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Vaporizing Tobacco (not e-cigs)

Discussion in 'Vaporizables' started by vtac, Apr 11, 2008.

  1. Snappo

    Snappo Caveat Emptor - "A Billion People Can Be Wrong!" Accessory Maker

    Messages:
    3,795
    I vape only real tobacco - only the finest sweetest nuttiest toastiest pipe tobacco - in my Solo.
     
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  2. PPN

    PPN Fleurs&Vapeur

    Messages:
    3,064
    Yes but you don't inhale if I remenber .... did you get the nicotine?

    Which t° do you use?
     
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  3. Snappo

    Snappo Caveat Emptor - "A Billion People Can Be Wrong!" Accessory Maker

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    3,795
    I vape pipe tobacco for the incredibly rich flavor - I don't inhale, but nicotine is absorbed through the membranes, saliva, and inhaled just a bit through the room vapor (wonderful aroma). I have over 200 different types of pipe tobacco... a good one for vaping that you may enjoy is Hearth & Home Anniversary Kake - sweet, nutty, toasty, very flavorful - pack very tight (I use Ed's TnT Solo stem). Explore & ENJOY the adventure!
     
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  4. neverforget711

    neverforget711 Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    75
    Location:
    Silent Hill
    Is nicotine rustica too concentrated to vape? It appears more nicotine is extracted through vaping instead of smoking.
     
  5. Farid

    Farid Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    699
    Not sure about rustica, but I know dokha is very high in nicotine, and vaporizing a bowl of that would put me to bed for the rest of the day. Hell even smoking a bowl of that stuff can be way too much, and vaping is supposed to extract more actives. And I'm not even sure if that's got as much nicotine as rustica. iirc dokha is regular nicotiana tabacum that's been bred with rustica, so theres a possibility pure rustica could have even more nicotine.

    Maybe try blending a tiny dose with something else, then increasing the dose to see what's possible.
     
  6. ShishkaBerry

    ShishkaBerry New Member

    Messages:
    7
    I read an article about rustica the other day, according to the author it's hardcore shamanic shit. Do a lot of research first haha, possibly erowid.com
     
  7. electricblues42

    electricblues42 New Member

    Messages:
    15
    Hey, hate to dig up an old forum thread but it's by far the most relevant to my question. I had a cheap vape from China (pax 2 clone) that I used to vape and I think the juices and resin from the tobacco shorted the electronics out, as the power button quit working (but it still charges, so maybe it wasn't shorted). Is that a possible worry with a real pax? When I took the cheap one apart I could see the tobacco resin in the top and when I pulled the whole thing apart the tobacco smell was overwhelming. I think somehow the resin gets into the fiberglass insulation around the heating chamber and later into the electronics.

    I'm considering buying a new vape exclusively for tobacco and I'm not sure what to get. Either the Arizer Solo or....well IDK yet. I ordered a vapcap but who knows when it will be here, plus I think that might be too much of a hassle for tobacco. This is for home use btw, out of the house I'll slum it with a e-juice vape. And preferably under $200, the cheaper the better. Something with no way for the smoke to come into contact with the electronics, basically.
     
  8. stardustsailor

    stardustsailor Accessory Maker

    Messages:
    347
    Location:
    Thessaly,Greece
    I do too -in my Air...
    It's rather superb !

    I kinda like the "Borkum Riff " series of pipe tobacco .

    I've even my "dedicated" pipe tobacco stem !
    Made from real briar !
    :rockon:...
    [​IMG]
    For all that woodyness of briar taste !

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    How it''s made ?
    Easy ...
    All you need are some drills ,an Aromed boro mouthpiece and an old ..briar pipe ...
    Since quited smoking ....!
    :evil:...

    [​IMG]
    :mental::mental::suspicious::uhh::lmao::shrug:




    Cheers.
    :peace:
     
    Last edited: Jul 23, 2016
    phried, ZC, electricblues42 and 3 others like this.
  9. electricblues42

    electricblues42 New Member

    Messages:
    15
    So I wanted to let you guys know I found another vaporizer that works great with tobacco, the Arizer Extreme Q. All you do is load it up with pipe tobacco or RYO cigarette tobacco and put it in. I use it on the higher temperatures, around 210-230, but not higher. It's definitely helped me smoke less when sitting at my desk, it might help some of you guys too.

    I'm getting a hookah hose to attach to it to class it up a little as well, I might try to make one of those pipe adapters like the poster above, it seems like a great idea.
     
  10. riccyn

    riccyn New Member

    Messages:
    4
    Hi. My first time posting.

    I recently bought a PAX 2 for vaping RYO and Pipe Tobaccos. I first tried with the lowest temp and I do get the flavor and the nice hit from the tobacco's but very little to no vapor production. I was still enjoying my tobaccos in a Heat not Burn fashion but I would have loved to see a little vapor.

    Today, I cranked it up to the 3rd highest setting and lo and behold, vapor. But, I had to compromise a little on the flavor but got a bigger hit with it.

    I have tried vaping some Chamomile and Green Tea, but I think the flavor needs getting used to. At what temp should I be vaping these? The temp settings on a PAX 2 are 360, 380, 400 & 420 F.

    Cheers!
     
    nihil likes this.
  11. nihil

    nihil Member, Known Well

    Messages:
    410
    @riccyn welcome to the forum. I run a few Pax 1's for my tobacco needs, and a few other vapes for my cannabis. The Pax is a flavor killer by design due to conduction versus convection delivery. If you don't understand the differences, please let us know and we can post more info to help you out.

    When you mention things like Chamomile and Green Tea, I'm thinking you'd benefit from a convection vaporizer like the Arizor Air or a desktop unit. Much better taste and efficiency.

    The Pax tends to "burn" the flavor, but for tobacco (Amsterdam Shag) I don't mind. But regarding cannabis, it's strictly convection vapes in my rotation, the Air and Enano.

    Hope that helps, willing to help if you have more questions.
     
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  12. riccyn

    riccyn New Member

    Messages:
    4
    @nihil. Thank you for welcoming me to the forum. I must admit, I am new to this kind of vaping and any information you have or can provide, is most welcomed.

    I was thinking of getting the Mighty as it has full temperature control, but I guess it is not designed much for tobacco, hence my hesitation.

    Currently I vape with Bali Shag and Drum. I wish to get more flavors from them and if possible, a really nice portable would be better then a desktop.
     
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  13. Snappo

    Snappo Caveat Emptor - "A Billion People Can Be Wrong!" Accessory Maker

    Messages:
    3,795
    I use the Solo (a conduction vape) for very high end pipe tobaccos, and the flavor is outstanding. I also have used my E-Nano and other convection vapes for my tobaccos and their flavor delivery is no better than from the Solo. I prefer to use the Solo for this purpose because I find the vapor to be more concentrated and flavorful and not as airy as my convection vapes deliver.
     
    Last edited: Sep 30, 2016
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  14. riccyn

    riccyn New Member

    Messages:
    4
    Thanks for the info Snappo. I vape Dunhill pipe tobaccos and I used to smoke them in pipes as well.

    But in the Pax I don't really get the difference in flavours from the various tins I have. There is a subtle difference but not a whole lot.
     
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  15. Snappo

    Snappo Caveat Emptor - "A Billion People Can Be Wrong!" Accessory Maker

    Messages:
    3,795
    This is true - the flavor/s extracted through a vaporizer reveal entirely different tobacco characteristics than from smoking - a vaporizer delivers the true flavor essences of the tobacco, whereas smoking it serves up a charred barbecue of sorts that muddy up the true flavors - much like vaping herb vs smoking it. For me and my huge variety of blends, I get sweet, nutty, toasty, tobacco flavors from many tins, and some are fruity sweet & toasty - all-in-all we never get any of that burned charred flavor that comes with combustion, just all natural tobacco flavors that one would never imagine were there if vaping weren't tried - it's a whole other world of rich dynamic flavors... and when snorked out through the nose, there's a very potent nicotine sting that could make us sneeze. Vaping tobacco is not really meant for inhaling, as the nicotine dosage delivery is much greater than with smoking, so not for the faint of heart and has it's serious risks. I'm seriously considering the new Pax 3 as it has greater battery capacity for longer sessions, and I'm hoping higher heat settings... it is a conduction device so I prefer it also for that reason for tobacco use.
     
    Last edited: Oct 1, 2016
  16. riccyn

    riccyn New Member

    Messages:
    4
    Thanks for your insight. I agree with you on the inhaling tobacco part being more potent. I have felt it. I kinda enjoy it to be honest. What are the serious risk you speak off?

    The temp settings for PAX 3 is similar to PAX 2.
     
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  17. Snappo

    Snappo Caveat Emptor - "A Billion People Can Be Wrong!" Accessory Maker

    Messages:
    3,795
    The serious risk I refer to has to do with the much higher dose delivery of nicotine, which can cause adverse effects to those with blood pressure, kidney, and/or heart issues. Also, while one may be vaping tobacco to try and stave off the cig/tobacco habit, vaping tobacco and inhaling (or even through nasal side-stream) can exacerbate the addiction, as it is the nicotine that promotes dependency. Further, the higher dosage of nicotine made available through vaping is readily absorbed through the mucous membranes in the mouth, as well as mixed in with the saliva that is swallowed and transported into the bloodstream. So, through all these bodily delivery systems in play, much more nicotine is absorbed and dealt with physiologically, and encouraging dependence.
     
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  18. electricblues42

    electricblues42 New Member

    Messages:
    15
    That to me sounds like you're making it out as a bad thing, and I would strongly disagree with that. Or at the very least making the dangers out to be more than they likely are. I know you like to only mouth hit it, but there are plenty of us who inhale as use this as a replacement for cigarettes. Yes the nicotine is more but it's not that much more than a full cig. It would be smart to start small and increase the amount one uses from there. But just because it has more nicotine doesn't mean that it is dangerous (well, to a certain point, it's still nicotine). I know there are people saying vaping tobacco is something like 95% more efficient, well that's just bull. Just from anecdotal evidence (lots I might add) it is only slightly stronger than a real cigarette, 25%ish or so. Vaping tobacco is absolutely a more safe way to get your nicotine than smoking would be.

    To riccyn, if you can deal with having a stationary desktop unit consider the Arizer Extreme Q. It's cheaper than the Solo and Air and works better. And it's just great for tobacco, I got a hookah hose and use one of the cyclone bowls exclusively for it, that way there is no flavor contamination between my pot vaping equipment and my tobacco equipment. And any other of the good desktop units that are whip based would work too (balloons with tobacco vape are sooooo gross, never ever do it).
     
    Last edited: Oct 4, 2016
    riccyn likes this.
  19. Snappo

    Snappo Caveat Emptor - "A Billion People Can Be Wrong!" Accessory Maker

    Messages:
    3,795
    You are quite mistaken in so many ways, but are of course free to disagree. I'm not suggesting it must necessarily be a bad thing for all, but it certainly can be for some.
     
    Last edited: Oct 4, 2016
    MinnBobber likes this.
  20. MinnBobber

    MinnBobber Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    3,481
    ................................................................
    @electricblues42 ,

    Snappo is not saying vaping tobacco is bad or bad for everyone. He is passing on valuable info and I/ others appreciate getting all the info out there.
    Reading about the great tobacco vaping tastes, I was kinda thinking---hey maybe try it as my cannabis stash is meager and it might be interesting to experiment????

    After reading his info, I'm thinking, thanks but no thanks--I should stick to cannabis as why get started on nicotine.

    Keep up the good discussion and thanks @Snappo for the info.
     
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  21. Snappo

    Snappo Caveat Emptor - "A Billion People Can Be Wrong!" Accessory Maker

    Messages:
    3,795
    Decide for yourself - moderation is key...
    Vaping tobacco preserves MUCH of the nicotine that would have otherwise burned away, and the dose delivery is MUCH greater... and so is the potential intensity of dependency and risk to health related to the cardiovascular system and MUCH more. ENJOY, but be very careful. As always, at your own risk, tolerance, and willingness to learn. I will not engage this topic further.

    These references are just a vapor drop in a galaxy-sized bucket:

    https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4363846/
    https://www.google.com/search?q=nicotine+gum+poisening&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8
    https://www.google.com/search?q=nivotine+overdose&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8
    https://quitday.org/smoking-effects/nicotine-poisoning/
     
    Last edited: Oct 4, 2016
    riccyn likes this.
  22. electricblues42

    electricblues42 New Member

    Messages:
    15

    How so? All I am suggesting is that vaping tobacco is a good and more healthy replacement for smoking cigarettes. I did not say that one who doesn't smoke should take it up, although that is their choice if someone want's to use nicotine. And if one did, this is one of the more safe ways. I would like to see your evidence for the statement "Vaping tobacco preserves MUCH of the nicotine" as I haven't found barely any real scientific studies on vaping tobacco leaves, most are just on ecig vaping. And I can tell you from lots of personal experience that the level of nicotine delivered is not THAT much higher than a cigarette, at least if you use similar amounts of tobacco. It is stronger, but not so much stronger that the nicotine is at dangerous levels. If you have any evidence that vaping tobacco is so dangerous then I would love to read it.

    Look, I don't want to start an argument here, but I just really do not want to see people implying as if vaping is not a good replacement for smoking, as it most certainly is. It's certainly dangerous as it has nicotine, but not more dangerous than smoking cigarettes. But if even just 1 person who could quit using vaping but doesn't because of hearsay and misinformation then that is a horrible disservice to that person. It's just like the situation with e-cigs, we don't have total information on the long term usage but from all the scientific knowledge we do have we can at least determine that it is far far better for your health than smoking.

    Edit 3 or 4 IDK: I bring all of this up because while I was researching how to vape tobacco properly I came across many people telling others to not vape because of the same thing Snappo said, that it is stronger and will make you sick. That convinced many people on those forums to not vape and instead continued smoking tobacco. That is the last thing any of us should want. If vaping can replace smoking in any way then it needs to be encouraged.
     
    Last edited: Oct 5, 2016
  23. herbivore21

    herbivore21 Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    4,278
    Curiously, I wonder about the efficiency of some of the new tobacco vaporizers on the horizon (the IQOS by Phillip Morris for example) in vaping nicotine.

    The boiling point of nicotine is 477f, and the IQOS runs at a nominal 350f. Not many dry herb vapes hit 477f! I am starting to wonder whether actually nicotine transfer efficiency from vaporized tobacco leaf may not be as high as we thought!? This low temp vaporization function in this device may indicate the designers have considered that they should not be providing 100% transfer efficiency of nicotine from the tobacco into the user, since this would make their products much more potent in dosage than traditional cigarettes.

    The specific answer to the question is possibly not yet answered in the literature though.
     
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  24. electricblues42

    electricblues42 New Member

    Messages:
    15

    I had noticed when I started vaping that the recommended temperatures (in the mid 300s F) did not work for me and I had to vape in the lower 400s F to get much vapor. I will try vaping some at a temp above 477 (Arizer E Q goes to 500) and report back later. Although at temperatures that high I think there are other nasty chemicals released so it might not be the best. Will still try and see.
     
    Last edited: Oct 5, 2016
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  25. herbivore21

    herbivore21 Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    4,278
    The IQOS tobacco is soaked in PG to produce extra vapor to substitute the low temperature used which as you say would not get much vapor from tobacco alone.

    PG of course is known now in the scholarly literature to be a precursor to propylene oxide when vaporized, there's another probable carcinogen for former smokers! lol
     

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