Discussion in 'Portable Vaporizers' started by ThermoCoreTim, Nov 1, 2012.
Thank you for your tireless contributions to science. Do you think it will be possible to add a little hash to the load? TIA.
Glad you are up and running again OF, enjoy!! I look forward to seeing how you hone the technique. Is this a one bowl per battery still?
There is an additional feature to the Cera that I forgot to mention. You may have noticed there is a bit of play (y-axis if she was standing on end and upright) with the mouthpiece. Meaning we built in 1.5mm of "travel" in the mouthpiece, so it can be slightly pulled out, or slightly pushed in. Or pushed in and then pulled out for a little tamping action. This will not have a huge factor in the draw. However there are some subtle benefits of this feature.
Also of note, with the mouthpiece removed, the opening to the Cera Top Cap is exactly 1/2 inch. This is part of our goal of making a more open source/open platform vaporizer (i.e. common dimensions/thread patterns etc.). We have done this to allow people who wish to further customize or modify their final vapor path, the most flexibility possible. The Outside Diameter of the Cera is also Exactly 1" so endless options from Colored Silicon tubing to "Skin" the Cera, to many storage options are available, off the shelf.
For the die hard modder there are many more features to the Cera that were built with them in mind. We also firmly believe that by building the device around common/industry standards we have built some serious longevity into the platform.
It has been a serious push for us. We are continuing forward and on track for shipping our limited number of pre-holiday Cera's. Essential Oil Cart is coming very soon. All Stainless parts are cut and finished, titanium is more time consuming and difficult to machine but it is being done as well. US sourced Titanium mostly goes to Aerospace, Medical Implant, and Military applications, these are some serious vaporizer parts we are making.
We appreciate your support and the support from the entire forum community. We feel that if you look at what we have done with the Cera, it was in direct response to your feedback and requests. We have done everything we possible could to delivery substantial improvements in every area of our vaporizers.
We will do our best to have a presence on the forum, Tim who may of you know will be in and out for a little while as he takes care of some important family matters. The rest of us will do our best to be here on the forum in his absence.
A quick note on pricing and discounts. We will NOT be selling any of the Cera Vaporizers in Stainless Steel to distributors or retailers. This is not because we have problems with any of the great companies who have distributed or retailed our products in the past. We simply cannot afford to sell the Cera to other resellers because there is not enough mark-up in the device. We cannot afford to sell the Cera for any less then what we retail it for directly.
This allows us to deliver the most value possible out of a device. It is not a great business model if we wanted to get rich selling these Cera's (luckily we do not need to sell that many devices to stay in business, efficiency has it's perks, and the owner's work for free).
However it is the only business model that allows us to build a vaporizer this high quality and sell it for less then $500 (our first cost estimates put the Cera ate >$750 just to make). However as a company we have made a fundamental commitment that we would rather build fewer vaporizers, then sacrifice quality or innovation. We do not need to be the most popular, we just need to know we are delivering the safest, highest quality products we possibly can. When you purchase a Cera, what you paid for is actually sitting in your hand. The materials the Cera's are made from are extraordinarily expensive, and American Sourced high grade Stainless Steel and Titanium are not cheap either. We have pulled off some magic tricks to deliver what could of easily been a vaporizer the retailed for $1,000. We leveraged everything we have learned from years of vaporizer manufacturing to pull this off, we almost couldn't do it, it was not easy.
We do want people to know that instead of paying for mark-up, profits margins, and advertising budgets, when you buy a Cera you pay for exceptional materials and the time and care it takes someone to hand build and assemble each device. It is a huge financial sacrifice for us (at least for the foreseeable future) to do this, however we do believe that if we deliver exceptional quality that people an actually afford we will benefit in the long term.
I hope that explains the loss of our coupons and discounts. Basically we built in a huge discount by abandoning the margin in the device that would of allowed us to sell the devices to Distributors, Wholesaler, and retailers. If your waiting for the Stainless Steel Cera's to be coming to your other online sellers or retailers, they will not be.
We will likely have some Titanium Cera's available to some select retailers who we have established strong working relationships. We have to account for fluctuation n US sourced Titanium pricing, so we build in a margin to account for the volatility in the material pricing. This allows for a potential margin on the titanium Cera that may make it work retailers selling them, or maybe not. We will see.
For now we will have a few units that look like they will be shipping in early December (if they are available on the site, then that means we have them to ship in the first run, we plan on ending the pre-order once those Cera's are spoken for) it is possible we will have another batch finished before the holidays, we would have an additional pre-sale if we find out we can release those units before X-mas. Cera's are springing up around here so expect more videos, pictures, and some more test units being released. Major changes coming to the website as well in the next couple of days with a lot of additional info. We have a had an overwhelming response so far, thank you.
More video to come. Old School Thermovape stuff. General use, plus we will find out just how tough the ceramic is.
Thank you OF, and thank you again to everyone on the forum community.
Noah & Nate
Thank You for the wonderful update. I wish you all the best in your transition.
Thanks for giving us an inside scoop ThermoVape! Such an elite vaporizer.
I am interested in seeing what kind of skins people come up with. Hopefully we can figure out a way to come up with an all black skin for those times when stealth is needed.
I can't wait to see how tough the Cera is. Can't wait to see more videos and read additional info. There was a lot of good info on the ThermoVape T1 when it came out so I'm hoping for a lot of info like that with the Cera.
No discounts is fine with me. Just makes the wait shorter knowing I can buy as soon as I have the money.
Thanks for sticking with us on the forum and I'm sure we will all be checking back for reviews, info, videos about the Cera.
You're welcome, of course. For the good of the greater group you know. I'm confident we can count on you when your turn to serve comes up.......
I hadn't planned on it, but it seems reasonable and for sure someone is going to try it no matter. Worst I can see happening if your careful is contaminating the heater? Otherwise it's pretty tough. That could kill it, but it's a Beta type test that should be done. I should be getting a lower power core to test in Monday or so, I think I'll wait until that's here so I don't kill the test outright again.....
Thanks, good suggestion.
Thanks, Lady, me too. Little sucker is no longer taunting me, but is rapidly becoming a good friend.
I'm kind of starting over on technique here. I tried half a bowl without much success (kind of like with T1) then loaded it real snug and got better production. This time I didn't honk on it hard early on like last time, instead sipping on the vapor. Very satisfactory, useful flavor much further this time. I also added a one inch piece of 3/8 tube (500 degree rated) to the MP to avoid all the warm parts for now. One thing at a time.
This is a whole other thing battery life wise. I'm now 3 bowls in, probably well past 20 minutes total on time on the original charge. If I wasn't goofing around with it but hit it like you do T1 when trying to conserve power I'd probably have twice the number of bowls by now. I'm pretty amazed. I'm running it like I'm made out of battery power, and it's vaping right along.
It's running less than half the power on a battery of nearly twice the capacity. I got battery time to burn.
Very glad to hear she is working for you!
We certainly made every effort to increase battery life, the T1 was certainly a battery hog and we listened loud and clear to the requests for longer battery life and an 18650 based platform, 2 birds with one stone there.
We know we will continue to see advancement in the 18650 cells in the years to come.
I had no doubt or hesitation in the final product's quality, and understand that the materials used are very expensive. Anxiously awaiting news/info on the concentrate cart as that is what I pre-ordered. Thanks Noah for the latest update. I know many of us are eagerly awaiting enjoying the fruits of your efforts! Cheers to the team!
That's what I like to hear!
I'm always appreciative of lower prices but I'm sure you also realized that the market for a $500-750 is incredibly small. By keeping the price reasonably affordable, you are at least seen as competition for other $250 vapes, I know I wouldn't be able to afford/justify a one time purchase of $500...
It's amazing, not that long ago we has mflb, solo, and T1... now we live in a wild jungle of vaporizers: Cera's and Inh's and Pax's oh my!
That's for sure: http://laserpointerforums.com/f67/panasonic-3400mah-18650-cell-now-available-74918.html I have one of those in my Pax and it gave about 30% more life!
is it safe to assume the 3400mah being sold for $15.95 from the link you just posted offer a better value than the 2900mah for $29.99 from thermovape, when being used in the cera?
i wouldnt recommend using an unprotected battery in a mechsnical mod. could go boom if discharged to far.
Just have an oil cart out for me and some models available before my vacation in march and you may just get that piggy bank stash i keep saying i'm gonna spend on a TV... if not... i guess more glass for me
No. I don't think that's a safe assumption. Depending on what you mean by value, of course.
One thing that is a safe assumption I think, is TV has evaluated all the available 18650s and has sound reasons to go with the one they found best suited. Same as we find with MFLB for instance. Or what we saw with TV and the 'lesser' 750 mAh RCR123As they specified for T1 when the 'clearly better' 900 mAh ones were not only available but cheaper usually....only they didn't get hot enough.
It's easy enough to try other types, folks surely will. Hopefully they'll let us know of those that measure up after testing but for now my recommendation if you want 'sure fire' performance stick with the factory units, they have been carefully tested in this application and are made in California from the best available 18650 cells (Japanese no doubt) and domestic protection circuit installation, packaging and test done to 'TV specs' locally. I got 3 color coded batteries to test out (I'm using the red...), I know at least one of them is a National and another is Sanyo I think (the other 'major hitter' as I recall), not sure about the third.
Until we know more, I say stick with the factory battery unless you've a mind for adventure.
I'm sorry, my misunderstanding. Re-reading your prior post I realize I was way off base. Oops, that's what I get for posting under the influence.
It's really impressive the way Thermovape is turning around it's business. And their interaction with their customers and posters here on this forum is even more impressive! They merit our support for sure.
And thank you very much for your reports OF! Can't wait to read further experiment reports with the Cera.
No worries, excitement is running high on this one for sure. Latest word from TV is 'next week' on the oil carts, I hope it's earlier than later in the week but am sure they want it at least as much.
Thanks for standing by, I know how tough that is sometimes.
I like the idea of using a silicone tube as a skin for the Cera, that might help a bit more with heat build up too. I just wonder how the heck you will get around the switch at the top since it sticks out so much, holes will have to be strategically placed and installation will probably prove to be a challenge when you get up to the switch that goes through the cera.
I gotta agree with you there. What a treat! Talk about a driven group of guys (and at least one woman) on a mission..... Even if the end result wasn't such keen products, it's fun to watch IMO.
You're very welcome, of course. Proud to be getting a first look for the team as it were. While I understand your excitement at the prospect of reading about it, consider how excited I feel about writing about it!
By way of testing news, I've dug out my stopwatch, I'm going to time a battery 'through the bowls' in an attempt to get a handle on lifetime. The last few bowls I've fallen into leisurely 'milking' the load. Taking smaller, more 'natural' hits rather than trying to horse it down as fast as possible. Bad news for the cloud chasers, this guy is a natural at this sort of vaping. The flavor goes longer into the hits and the hits seem quite uniform and productive over 10 minutes or more. They are still 'useful' when I finally give up because it's getting hot and the return is getting so small. Something like MFLB but without the shaking or other issues (like battery control) related to hitting it. Turn it on, wait half a minute, hit on it as you wish. Cool.
New medical users should take to this very naturally.
I'm finding most of my portables hit better with a natural breath style pull rather than forcing air through. Since we are not keeping a cherry lit, pulling air quickly isn't going to speed anything up, but rather put more air in the mix and thin the vapor out. I find as soft, steady inhale provides me the largest visible hits on most of my devices, even on lower temp settings.
Spot on Lady Jam! I agree. You're going to get it all eventually, it just takes a few more hits and a few more minutes. Not always a good trade off for all folks. Also calls for patience is not always a cloud chaser long suit you know. Tough being 'all things to all men' as they say.
There has been talk of more video's , has there been a video i missed then? can't find it! thank you in advance
I have not seen any vids of the new stuff yet
I agree with Jam, but "i have a dream" that some day I may press a button, wait 20-30 seconds, pull nearly full speed for a grip, and not have a convection heater cower under pressure, and finally slide quietly pack in the pocket. A guy can dream, can't he.
OF: If a guy was "cloud chasing"how is the vapor density compared to the LV EVO?
Also, you said it still can get unusably hot, with the insulative properties of the ceramic, does it take a lot longer to clool down?
My preorder got messed up, and I'm questioning if I should do it again...
That may just be the portable cloud you are dreaming of, but that has yet to exist AFAIK.
on the pre-order, that might be worth an email to confirm your order went through ok, rather than getting charged for 2 and having to back track... (I'm handing out pennies today)
**I have had to seriously control my VAS right now...it's not been easy, I am really tempted on the Cera, but the situation stands the same on my end... need to control the o'l spending for a while... but I am happy to still come along for the ride. It's funny, I am still figuring out what my "routine" is because it has not become a routine yet. I have added enough new gear, staggered in just the right spacing to over lap on the use of other devices, so it's been a real juggling act over here trying to find what really works the best for my needs. I went on a binge with each device, to get to know it, then rotated out to the next one... now I am back around to using the Cloud mostly at home and treating my portables as portables again, instead of main drivers. It's been a fun ride, learning the ins and outs, and I find the process to be a bit addicting, keeps me coming back for more...
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