The Nomad From Morwood

[The Stranger]

The box mod of vapes! Keeps looking better and better.

@Dan Morrison How is the battery going to be regulated in there? I'm very familiar with mech mods and only know how to control it with making coils.
Where would it be getting loaded with herb from? Are you still thinking about being able to load with capsules or whatever?

 

[Zangano Cruel]

Hola FC:
@Dan Morrison I agree with the smell of old coins that metal has. I believe that having metal like brass or copper next to the glass mouthpiece would lead to touching of the metal at some point, making the experience of handling cannabis and personal hygiene/care somewhat relevant. I'm not finicky, but coins , some door knobs, some keys and some non stainless or some non anodized or some non polished shiny/mate metals give me a bad feeling and that smell of old coins/pennies about it. I imagine, by mistake, touching that metal close to the mouthpiece with my lips while drawing vapor, or clearly smelling old coins while drawing instead of tasty smelly terpenes through my nose. By the way, I have a big nose
I don't really see the advantage on butane vs battery. We don't live in the jungle or the mountains anymore, at least 99% of us. If you vape more than 10 loads during an outing of a normal day, then , you are in need of a serious vape. There are power outlets every 100 meters all over the place wherever you are nowadays. No more excuses for no power outlets. I believe butane has more variables involved to achieve a constant hassle free almost perfect performances , like for example my 2 Solos I have since 2012. Kilos of weed they've vaped, and never combusted or had a battery problem. A butane vape, probably will have problems with leaks, clogging, dirty unfiltered butane etc etc. I can keep naming disadvantages that will make the vape useless and constant care or trouble while using butane.
4 18650 will power a portable for like 16 loads. If you vape 16 loads during the day, you'll be stoooooonnnneeeeddd. I've been. I've done it.
16 loads in a butane vape will mean like at least 4 butane reloads at least. You'll end up carrying a butane can even for 4 loads.
I'd rather carry 1 18660 battery than a bulky big butane can.

Can you substitute brass/copper with aluminum or SS where the stem goes? I believe SS or aluminum don't carry the old coins smell.
Can you do the patina on SS or aluminum?

 

[The Stranger]

Hola FC:
@Dan Morrison I agree with the smell of old coins that metal has. I believe that having metal like brass or copper next to the glass mouthpiece would lead to touching of the metal at some point, making the experience of handling cannabis and personal hygiene/care somewhat relevant. I'm not finicky, but coins , keys and non stainless or non anodized or non polished shiny/mate metals give me a bad feeling about it. I imagine, by mistake, touching that metal close to the mouthpiece with my lips while drawing vapor, or clearly smelling old coins while drawing instead of tasty smelly terpenes through my nose. By the way, I have a big nose
I don't really see the advantage on butane vs battery. We don't live in the jungle or the mountains anymore, at least 99% of us. If you vape more than 10 loads during an outing of a normal day, then , you are in need of a serious vape. There are power outlets every 100 meters all over the place wherever you are nowadays. No more excuses for no power outlets. I believe butane has more variables involved to achieve a constant hassle free almost perfect performances , like for example my 2 Solos I have since 2012. Kilos of weed they've vaped, and never combusted or had a battery problem. A butane vape, probably will have problems with leaks, clogging, dirty unfiltered butane etc etc. I can keep naming disadvantages that will make the vape useless and constant care or trouble while using butane.
4 18650 will power a portable for like 16 loads. If you vape 16 loads during the day, you'll be stoooooonnnneeeeddd. I've been. I've done it.
16 loads in a butane vape will mean like at least 4 butane reloads at least. You'll end up carrying a butane can even for 4 loads.
I'd rather carry 1 18660 battery than a bulky big butane can.

Idk about other metals but copper is anti bacterial so putting it in your mouth shouldn't be too much of a problem. (No I would never put coins in my mouth ) But I have a copper mech mod and you don't even taste it or smell it at all really. Maybe on your hands. The biggest problem is accidentally banging it on your teeth ha!

Anyway, not arguing for or against metal, just thought I'd say that. I agree on the batteries over butane though, that freaks me out more.

 

[ragnorokk]

If this ends up unregulated it will warrant comparisons to the Milaana. A lot of us already have one of those preordered. You may be excluding a good chunk your potential customers by presenting something similar to what we (hopefully by then) already own.

I suggest going an entirely different route. The electronic portable market is very saturated currently. Your earlier ideas bring a lot more to the table imo.

I mentioned butane not only as a personal preference but as a market observation. Nothing new has come out in the butane world save the vapcap (which is/was a runaway success) in quite some time, I feel your craftsmanship and ingenuity could really bring something to the table in this genre. The other alternative fuels and heating methods you mentioned earlier were interesting as well.

Well, there's always room for more, amirite? Seriously, for a fledgling company, maybe a few differently powere vape choices might not be a bad call. Of course, it might be a nightmare for Dan to source different heater parts for multiple models...

Mmmmm gonna be hard to please everyone. If butane is gonna be an option, do you mean in the same config as an iolite or similiar? I'm hoping this isn't the case as I have never got on with butane vapes and when I tried a mates Iolite I wasn't impressed at all. I found the vapour production very wispy. Would much rather prefer battery.

I can see the comparison mentioned above with the Milaana but I think I would definately prefer this over the milaana....just look at it! And from @Dan Morrison last efforts with the Okin the craftmanship will be second to none.

Wispy vapor is DEFINITELY NOT associated with butane. Numerous butane vapes exist that can give a solid, milky hit, and are highly regarded by our own comunity. I did not personally like the iolite wax pen I tried, and so cannot comment on the butane vape. Try a daisy and see if you still feel like butane sux! I don't really like the looks of it, but people love the Hammer, so even an all-in-one approach doesn't have to be lack-luster.

Hola FC:
@Dan Morrison I agree with the smell of old coins that metal has. I believe that having metal like brass or copper next to the glass mouthpiece would lead to touching of the metal at some point, making the experience of handling cannabis and personal hygiene/care somewhat relevant. I'm not finicky, but coins , keys and non stainless or non anodized or non polished shiny/mate metals give me a bad feeling about it. I imagine, by mistake, touching that metal close to the mouthpiece with my lips while drawing vapor, or clearly smelling old coins while drawing instead of tasty smelly terpenes through my nose. By the way, I have a big nose
I don't really see the advantage on butane vs battery. We don't live in the jungle or the mountains anymore, at least 99% of us. If you vape more than 10 loads during an outing of a normal day, then , you are in need of a serious vape. There are power outlets every 100 meters all over the place wherever you are nowadays. No more excuses for no power outlets. I believe butane has more variables involved to achieve a constant hassle free almost perfect performances , like for example my 2 Solos I have since 2012. Kilos of weed they've vaped, and never combusted or had a battery problem. A butane vape, probably will have problems with leaks, clogging, dirty unfiltered butane etc etc. I can keep naming disadvantages that will make the vape useless and constant care or trouble while using butane.
4 18650 will power a portable for like 16 loads. If you vape 16 loads during the day, you'll be stoooooonnnneeeeddd. I've been. I've done it.
16 loads in a butane vape will mean like at least 4 butane reloads at least. You'll end up carrying a butane can even for 4 loads.
I'd rather carry 1 18660 battery than a bulky big butane can.

Can you substitute brass/copper with aluminum or SS where the stem goes? I believe SS or aluminum don't carry the old coins smell.
Can you do the patina on SS or aluminum?

I moved to a more rural area, and there is no way to charge while out, so while I respect that battery charging on the go can be accomplished in many places, maybe a significant part of America (and possibly the world?) DOES live in a place where electricity is not freely available every 100ft...

Idk about other metals but copper is anti bacterial so putting it in your mouth shouldn't be too much of a problem. (No I would never put coins in my mouth ) But I have a copper mech mod and you don't even taste it or smell it at all really. Maybe on your hands. The biggest problem is accidentally banging it on your teeth ha!

Anyway, not arguing for or against metal, just thought I'd say that. I agree on the batteries over butane though, that freaks me out more.

You should ask @KeroZen how safe batteries are!

 

[The Stranger]

Oh I know how dangerous 18650's can be, that's why I'm wondering how this vape is going to make sure it doesn't draw too many amps than it can handle.

 

[nondarb]

I don't really see the advantage on butane vs battery.

Quicker thicker hits than ANY electric portable? Instant on demand vapor? Cheaper to manufacture, repair and upkeep, much less saturated market. Plenty of good reasons.

Your experiences sound like they are only with the iolite. That's old tech and wasn't particularly good. Most are powered by a torch lighter, I suggest looking into them. My solo hasn't been used in weeks (months?). My nano hardly gets fired up. Lily simply outclasses them for taste, speed and cloud production and I dare say my vapman is the finest conduction unit around!

Dont let your lack of awareness discount an entire genre of vaporizers right off the bat (even if DM doesn't go that route).

A butane vape, probably will have problems with leaks, clogging, dirty unfiltered butane etc etc. I can keep naming disadvantages that will make the vape useless and constant care or trouble while using butane.
16 loads in a butane vape will mean like at least 4 butane reloads at least. You'll end up carrying a butane can even for 4 loads.
I'd rather carry 1 18660 battery than a bulky big butane can.

Literally none of this is true. The only ones with limited tank size is the hammer and iolites, the hammer gets 6ish loads, unsure with the iolite. All others operate with a lighter or torch as the heat source. With my vapman and lily I have no idea how many bowls I get to a refill because it lasts days and days between them. Certainly more than 16.

 

[ragnorokk]

To be fair, I'm mostly arguing that @Dan Morrison keep room for non-battery powered vapes, because I thought that was what made the Okin special. Granted, charcoal has powered the vaporization in hookahs for a long time, so it's not like he invented some new method of vaping... I just thought it was distinctive.

So I guess I'm really saying "Dan, don't forget about stuff that isn't battery powered! Put a butane vape on the backburner, please!"

 

[°k]

Quicker thicker hits than ANY electric portable? Instant on demand vapor?

I like some flame based portable vapes too and have a Lotus, a Lilly (and a couple of Dynavaps that I don't use) but I have to say that my Grasshopper is quicker than them and can make rather thick hits imo.

Now back to this thread as the vaping star adventurer in me would like a little buckle on that vape so I can attach my spaceship keys to it and keep my essentials together please.

 

[Zangano Cruel]

Idk about other metals but copper is anti bacterial so putting it in your mouth shouldn't be too much of a problem. (No I would never put coins in my mouth ) But I have a copper mech mod and you don't even taste it or smell it at all really. Maybe on your hands. The biggest problem is accidentally banging it on your teeth ha!

Anyway, not arguing for or against metal, just thought I'd say that. I agree on the batteries over butane though, that freaks me out more.

Exactly what I meant, that "maybe on your hands". And the smell of metal, sometimes people can smell it, never smell SS by the way. can you imagine smelling old coins while you vape. No no.

@ragnorokk
"I moved to a more rural area, and there is no way to charge while out, so while I respect that battery charging on the go can be accomplished in many places, maybe a significant part of America (and possibly the world?) DOES live in a place where electricity is not freely available every 100ft..."


I was born 1976, rural area in the middle of a South American country, there we haven't electricity power, even we were only 20 miles from the closest town and the huge metal towers/power lines run only a block away on our own property, when during summer electric storms, you ride a horse under the power lines, and static will make your hairdo like a hedgehog. Power outlets electricity arrived to our home in the 90s.
If there's still areas on the US without power outlets electricity, shame on us.
I'm well travelled around the world and I've been to very rural poor parts and they have batteries of every kind. But nowhere to find butane in little cans to power vapes. They don't even know what a vape is.
In those areas where electricity hasn't arrived, most of the people consider weed "DOPE" in the way our great grandfathers mean it. DOPE, like some LEOs call it. (LawEnforcementOfficer) DOPE as Class 1 drug.
We have cell phones and computers to post here, so I don't see how you can't plug in and charge a battery for a moment. Not everywhere you can find very refined butane in the rural areas. Sometimes it's even hard to find in the cities, without driving and paying at least $5 a can. Or ordering online.
Besides oil derivatives and more fracking and cracking the earth for gas and etc etc, aren't we trying to be better to the world. I know batteries are heavy pollutants too, but I believe in the long term they will be better and at some point a 100% recyclable.

@nondarb
"Literally none of this is true. The only ones with limited tank size is the hammer and iolites, the hammer gets 6ish loads, unsure with the iolite. All others operate with a lighter or torch as the heat source. With my vapman and lily I have no idea how many bowls I get to a refill because it lasts days and days between them. Certainly more than 16."

Show me a portable vape with an attached gizmo to heat and vape that can be the size of what Dan is planning, and can look and perform as it will do and we will expect, and you'll convince me... in the meantime, I know all the external heat source, torch lighters, are a pain to maintain and find one that works well. I understand your point but for this vape, butane will be different imo
When you refered to butane vapes, I understand a whole unit, not a VapCap, that I own, not a Lotus that I tried, not a VapMan that I tried too. I tried the Supreme and another only glass heated by torch vape too at @Stu , right???
I have my experience with vapes, I believe I tried all @Stu vapes, he has quite a collection. I have my own collection too, and got rid of many too.
I stuck to my Cloud + and EVO and Nano as desktops, I have quartz bangers if I want butane purity with BHO. Portables portables, street portables are one thing. Home portables are another category. Portability means on the street for many people, I don't care about stealth, I live surrounded by medical legal states. I'm medical myself, even my daughter with her disability can be medical as well. I can buy anywhere recreational or medical, but I still stick to the black market because is still way cheaper than legal or medical and you get same quality here. I live in WA, but I'm a short hop/bridge from OR.
Leave butane for running BHO or torch flame vapes like Vapman and Lotus and etc etc.
There's like 100 vapes in this FC forum and only 2 or 3 butane powered vapes iolite, Wispr and?????
So, manufacturers, designers and engineers know why they don't go with butane for portable vapes in a whole unit I mean...

 

[delloy]

Wispy vapor is DEFINITELY NOT associated with butane. Numerous butane vapes exist that can give a solid, milky hit, and are highly regarded by our own comunity. I did not personally like the iolite wax pen I tried, and so cannot comment on the butane vape. Try a daisy and see if you still feel like butane sux! I don't really like the looks of it, but people love the Hammer, so even an all-in-one approach doesn't have to be lack-luster.

@ragnorokk I did not mean butane vapes like the Daisy, Vapman, Lotus & Supreme et al. I dont have a problem with them. They are only achieved by direct heat from a torch and Dans design doesn't look like one of those judging by the pics so find comments on them irrelevant here. I know those are cloud makers! Its the ones that have the butane chamber built into the device as I mentioned in the post like the Iolite, I hated that thing! I cannot comment on the Hammer never used one.

 

[nondarb]

Lilly... I have to say that my Grasshopper is quicker

From a cold start that's simply not true, the lily has no heat exchanger to warm up.. I can get vapor in as little as 2-3 seconds. I'm sure with proper technique you could even minimize that. Once warm I could certainly see that. The GH heat exchanger is nuts.. I'd realllly like to check out its internals. Its certainly a beastly vape, it and the RBT tech are the only portables I've heard of or seen nearing butanes power. I was sold on the Mi after hearing it was like an "electric lily" from a few butane fans. Getting off track..

Show me a portable vape with an attached gizmo to heat and vape that can be the size of what Dan is planning

Are you familiar with the hammer? Its small, has a tank, excellent warranty, built in ignition and preforms on par with or exceeding most log vapes. Its very small.

know all the external heat source, torch lighters, are a pain to maintain and find one that works well.

Only if using decent butane and completely draining a tank between refills is considered a pain and or difficult. There's actually a lot more do's and dont's pertaining to proper battery safety, maintenance and storage. Not to mention risks.

There's like 100 vapes in this FC forum and only 2 or 3 butane powered vapes iolite, Wispr and?????

I suggest looking again, but you are right that there are more electrics than butane powered, the electric portable market is extremely saturated.

in a whole unit

I never stipulated an AIO unit, I'm not afraid of a little torch usage myself.

Its the ones that have the butane built into the device as I mentioned in the post like the Iolite, I hated that thing!

Yeah the hammer seems to be the exception for now in this case. Shame, the idea is sound.

At any rate my initial point was mainly pointing out the differences in the current markets and the current concepts similarities to something already up and coming. Given Dan's other vaporizer and pipemaking backround fire/butane seems like a natural fit to me. Some of his off the wall ideas remind me of René of the Vapman (the dude made a FRICTION powered vape) and René is pretty much my hero! I can't help but try and nudge his crazy ideas towards my own ideal vaporizer while we are still in the spitballing phase. This thread started with a completely different concept, I wouldn't be surprised if we were in for another wild change or two.

No matter what Dan comes up with I'm sure it will be unique and sexy. He's definitely got a knack for style when it comes to these things. Ive got some 18650's on hand too!

 

[Dan Morrison]

Wow, loving all the discussion! Lots to think about!

I get where everyone is coming from, lots of great points!

As far as the market goes, I feel like the vaporizer market is still very young, there is room for all.

I haven't yet ruled out alternative heat sources...

As for the brass smell, That's a big one for me because I hate that smell on my hands. It's actually the smell of our skin/sweat/oils reacting to the metal. I would probably put a matte wax on the brass to keep it from smelling...or something, I'm confident that there are a few solutions so Im not too worried there.

Browned, Black oxide, or blued steel, and black/charcoal anodized aluminum (sandblasted) are other ideas but anodized aluminum looks like shit, imo, the moment it gets a ding or scratch, and feels too lightweight to me. So thats out i guess.

SS cant easily be patina'd.

In any case, best not to get too hung up on it yet, the heater design is next.. and that'll really dictate whether or not this concept can become reality...

 

[Dan Morrison]

Okay, on to concept No. 2.

This one would have two batteries.

There would be 4 chambers set up on a wheel. This wheel would be at the top of the vaporizer, under the glass dome. You can't really see it from the side profile. On the right of the below image, you can see the removed chamber disc, with a second disc that holds all of the metal screens.

There would be a connecting rod that extends down into the bottom of the vape, attaching to the blackwood knob on the bottom. Turning this knob would turn the chamber disc. Just like a pepper grinder design.

The heater airpath exits out of a hole on the top plate, with an o-ring seal depressed into a groove around this hole. So as you turn the chamber disc to the next chamber position, it will glide over the O-ring and make a seal between the heater airway and that single chamber.

The glass dome would be inset into a groove cut into the brass top plate, with an o-ring seal.

The vaporizer would come with a fitted tube-shape case made from kraft paper laminate.

 

[Shit Snacks]

Okay, on to concept No. 2.

This one would have two batteries.

There would be 4 chambers set up on a wheel. This wheel would be at the top of the vaporizer, under the glass dome. You can't really see it from the side profile. On the right of the below image, you can see the removed chamber disc, with a second disc that holds all of the metal screens.

There would be a connecting rod that extends down into the bottom of the vape, attaching to the blackwood knob on the bottom. Turning this knob would turn the chamber disc. Just like a pepper grinder design.

The heater airpath exits out of a hole on the top plate, with an o-ring seal depressed into a groove around this hole. So as you turn the chamber disc to the next chamber position, it will glide over the O-ring and make a seal between the heater airway and that single chamber.

The glass dome would be inset into a groove cut into the brass top plate, with an o-ring seal.

The vaporizer would come with a fitted tube-shape case made from kraft paper laminate.

Slick, Haze Square like... But still one hit extractions? Maybe single battery would still work in a different shaped, smaller design profile? Maybe more steam punk revolver shape? Something with a grip with two batteries even, then the revolver on top? I like the glass top idea, but might be tough to do a glass part like that? I dono maybe not, it could be Daisy mouthpiece thick, or even that long too for home use with a small narrower one for on the go... maybe some kinda of threaded steel or brass thing would be better for on the go too? Wood steel mouthpieces? Just throwing stuff around, might be a way to make it Mike a tube that comes up and around the device, a coil which would help cool vapor?

 

[Dan Morrison]

@Shit Snacks , Just checked out that Haze Square, looks pretty neat! But.. I was thinking the four chamber design was new... damnet! haha.

And the chambers would be a bit larger, wider but still very shallow. So perhaps 3-4 hit extractions.

The glass would definitely be difficult to get right. For a lampworker to get the tolerances right would be challenging, but I don't think it's impossible. It's a fairly simple shape.

I first had it mocked up with a straight glass tube, and then a top plate. Which would be very simple to make, but I just liked the look of the all glass top so much... I think it's a make or break situation, without the glass top, it's just a tube... meh.

Anyhow, just another idea in the pot!

 

[vapen00b]

I really liked the other designs better... Not talking about the chamber - rather the MP.
Looks kinda like the Namaste Grizzly Guru:

In this new design, where were the power and fire button? Wouldn't be on top as there's the glass now.
Would you guys think it could be a concern that it has similar designs like the Haze square and grizzly? Don't know, if these companies are like apple and Samsung when it comes to design infringements and patents..?
The last thing I'd like to see is Dan getting in trouble Maybe I'm totally exaggerating..
Hope to be more constructive next time, but this came up immediately.

Have a great Sunday everyone!

 

[Dan Morrison]

@vapen00b , Sunday! My favourite day of the week.

I doubt there would be any infringement issues, I don't think the shape of a piece of glass, or number of chambers is novel enough to be patented.

Eitherrr wayyy, after a good sleep.. I'm not too excited about the design anymore. I think it can safely be scraped, I'm more into the first one.

My plan is just to present a whole ton of concepts and at the end, hopefully arrive at something where we are all like.. IT HAS TO BE THAT ONE!!

For now, this thread can be a bit like a communal scrapbook!

I've got another concept I will try to get up later tonight after Okin work. It'll be a butane one for a change!

 

[The Stranger]

If anything though, I think the idea of the revolving chambers is a must. What a good way to travel light and easily with it. No needing to carry any extra tubes or anything, that's a big one for me when deciding on a portable. The mflb's trench is big enough (for me) not to have to worry about carrying extra around most of the time and that can hold about .15 grams.

Maybe if you keep the revolver idea, there would be a way to just switch them out on the go, that would be more appealing to me personally than having to empty it and reload.

I also like @Shit Snacks idea of making it more steam punk or even Victorian, or Star Warsish. I liked that idea over the more "modernish" look. I think that's why I liked the versions with metal.

 

[stickstones]

I think the revolver idea fits with the theme. It just seems like Han would want something that he didn't have to load every time.

 

[Copacetic]

I personally favour the 'cartridge' approach where we can whip out a spent bowl and 'load' a ready-filled one every time we want a fresh bowl.

I know the revolver approach would be even more convenient, but I fear that it might result in a device that's bigger and more complex to manufacture than it really needs to be.
A smallish vape, with a seperate and nifty 'magazine' of pre-loaded herb chambers would be more my thing.
Imagine 'cocking' your vape to eject a spent cartridge, then 'loading' another!
Lock and load!

Even though I've recently fallen in love with a butane vape (Vapcap), and no longer dismiss fire as unsuitable for my purposes, I would rather have a battery vape to accompany it in my collection than another butane.
With great small butane vapes like Okin, Vapcap, Lotus and Vapman on the market I don't feel the need for any more choice there.
I know there are even more good battery powered vapes available, but proper on-demand battery vapes are thin on the ground, and I would welcome another.

 

[NickDlow]

+1 on the revolver. Making the cartrage removable and interchangeable would be great IMO.

Don't scrap it just yet!

 

[nondarb]

With great small butane vapes like Okin, Vapcap, Lotus and Vapman on the market I don't feel the need for any more choice there

I could use the same logic concerning electric portables, except the list of viable electrics is pages long rather than a handful of vapes total. Okins not a butane vape either. If vapcaps your only foray into butane I highly suggest looking into some of the others.. Its not a good standalone representation of the genre by any means.

Cartridges/caps and revolving bowls don't interest me in the slightest. They arent fun to load and rob heat. I just see a mess of expensive, hard to source and or custom moving parts to loose or fuck up with that whole concept. The best vaporizers keep it relatively simple, certainly the most powerful and efficient units do.

I'm personally a fan of the KISS ethos, less to break, less to make. If this isn't butane I think the aspiration should be electric pocket torch. I gave it some thought, its not butane I lust after, it's power. Most (in reality all) electric portables are simply anemic in comparison.

 

[Dan Morrison]

I think I am with @Copacetic and @nondarb on this one.

KISS is also something I live by. Yet... sometimes It takes a kick in the ass to remember that! haha. I am always fighting my tendency to over-complicate things... I think it's because I like problem solving, so I create problems to solve, or something. Am I over-complicating this paragraph right now?! oh god.

I have this pipe... and let me tell you, it's the shittiest pipe you'll ever see. It's a funny thing, I totally love it. I whipped it up in maybe 15 minutes. It's so basic, little more than a rectangle of wood with an african blackwood bowl plopped on top. It's harsh as hell because of the tiny airway, and I haven't given it an ounce of maintenance in over a year. But I still use it all the time.

I started to analyze why. Why would I keep using that dirty old shit-pipe. And I think it's because it's so damn easy. I can pull it out, load it, spark it, dump it, toss it, all under 20 seconds.

There is something about that convenience.

I'm thinking that butane sort of gives you that convenience in a way that batteries don't.

Lighters have been a companion to smokers for a loong time. And if you're every going camping/hiking you always have a lighter on you anyhow. So carrying one around just feels natural.

Batteries could be just as convenient, but somehow it doesn't feel like that to me. What are your thoughts?

I've been thinking of a design with an open bowl, just like a pipe. And a bowl cover on a hinge. The bowl cover "disc" would be made of steel (or other metal) to hold a good amount of heat. With tiny holes through the disc in which to inhale the hot air through. It may be possible to make this disc in two parts, like a sandwich, and engrave a spiral airpath through the disc to increase the heat exchange efficiency.

Here is a napkin-sketch of roughly what I'm picturing. This is the side profile. Take a look at the photos below for a better idea of what the top/bottom might look like.

Imagine this bowl lid design, on this pipe...

I made this pipe about a year ago, and I still really love the design. I think it could be sci-fi'd up a tad and look super awesome. I've been looking for ways to re-visit this pipe design ever since.

Holding this pipe in the hand, your index finger would be naturally suited to opening and closing the lid. And heating the heat exchanger while the lid is open would avoid over-heating and scorching the pipe itself. You could slightly open and close the lid while drawing to have basic control of the heat.

And when you're done a bowl, just open the lid and dump it like a regular pipe. You could just sprinkle in a new load, while the heat exchanger is still scorching hot, and go in for another bowl full.. no waiting for cool downs.

And the design would be very compact. I would like to make it perfectly fit into a box much like the one supplied with the Okin.

This is concept No. 3, and maybe the one I am most excited about!

 

[Copacetic]

Nice idea Dan

Please, no steampunk though, I don't want a vape I'm too embarrassed to use!
I like the direction your sketches have been taking, and I feel the latest pipe (gotta be named the 'Spiral Path' if you go that way right?, right?) style one represents a pretty new way of using butane too, and I like it.
Very different vapes, but that's what we want at this stage of the game right?

I could use the same logic concerning electric portables, except the list of viable electrics is pages long rather than a handful of vapes total. Okins not a butane vape either. If vapcaps your only foray into butane I highly suggest looking into some of the others.. Its not a good standalone representation of the genre by any means.

Cartridges/caps and revolving bowls don't interest me in the slightest. They arent fun to load and rob heat. I just see a mess of expensive, hard to source and or custom moving parts to loose or fuck up with that whole concept. The best vaporizers keep it relatively simple, certainly the most powerful and efficient units do.

I'm personally a fan of the KISS ethos, less to break, less to make. If this isn't butane I think the aspiration should be electric pocket torch. I gave it some thought, its not butane I lust after, it's power. Most (in reality all) electric portables are simply anemic in comparison.

I re-read my post and realized it might read as though I'm in favor of a 'revolver' style mechanism.
I'm not, I just worded my post badly, apologies.

I too cleave to the KISS methodology.
When I mentioned cartridges I meant a single load at a time, in the simplest bowl possible.
I agree though, that unless the cart' has very minimal mass then it's going to rob some heat, although careful design could mitigate this.
However I'm not against simply loading the vape bowl every time I've spent a load, it's just that the convenience of having something like multiple Firewood bowls is very attractive to me.

Another failure in my post was to give the impression that I'm against butane vapes.
I'm definitely not since I got my VC, and I've yet to hear anything other than fairly robust praise for the Okin (which I consider a butane vape as that's how most will be lighting it, and therefore carrying a lighter) and the others I mentioned.
But I'm probably not looking for another.
Dan could easily change my mind on that though, it all comes down to the final design, which I guess is a loooong way off.

I definitely agree on POWA though.
I've never tried either, but the Zion heater has been compared by some that have, to the Trihouse vapes, which some consider the finest butane vapes available (such a shame they are no more ).
The Apollo has also been getting some better than satisfactory comparisons too, and they're both battery powered.
In my NSHO, a proper halogen heat exchanger could improve on the operation of the Apollo bulb quite significantly if it can be made to work.
I believe the Apollo operates by simply passing air over the bulb, and past some relatively small surfaces that the bulb has heated through proximity.
I think this is why Ville is seeing the heat-up times the Apollo currently has.
The more mass the slower the results will be, so the less thermal mass used in the design of the heater/bowl area the better.

Some have suggested/reported that a higher power bulb decreases heat up time in the Apollo.
This is simply using brute force to overcome the highish mass to pre-heat, and the absence of a proper heat exchanger.

Efficiency is king, as a low power but efficient vape will work, as will a high power but inefficient vape.
If the 'Next Vape' manages to include reasonably high power, AND a decent heat exchanger then I believe it'll be VERY attractive as it will heat up fast, and have the power to keep up with a strong draw without having to rely on heat stored in a mass.
Power could get from the battery to the herb quickly, and the reduced need for lengthy, battery draining warm-ups might result in great efficiency despite the POWA on tap (I believe RBT's Zion heater achieves this?)
Combine that with great D M pipes looks and workmanship and it could be King Vape.

BTW, that last para' sounds like criticism of the Apollo, it's not meant to, as I really like the look of the Apollo, and it sounds like it could be one of the best functioning portables around (leaving aside heat-up time)

I am still interested in ANY heat source, and power storage (unless we can make our own! have you seen the cable operated friction vape that Vapman made?, nothing to carry there except maybe a Mars-bar for long sessions! ), but think battery offers the best recharge options (power outlets everywhere except hikes/work outdoors).

 

[nosmoking]

Is it too soon to say it cause I am really feeling the IT HAS TO BE THAT ONE on concept number 3! I don't need things to be compact, but I love eliminating the unnecessary and keeping things down to the essentials.

My favorite parts of your concept 3 are:
"You could slightly open and close the lid while drawing to have basic control of the heat."

You could just sprinkle in a new load, while the heat exchanger is still scorching hot, and go in for another bowl full.. no waiting for cool downs."

A manual control for temp and being able to keep going really matter to me. I like my meds delivered at higher temps often but I like to skirt the range a little so I can still get great flavor. I am stupid high tolerance sometimes as well so I am always wanting another bowl.

I am not so into preloaded shuffling mechanisms because its one more thing to go wrong, and seems unnecessary so I don't mind seeing concept 2 scrapped so quickly.

Are you ready for my money yet, lmao! I am not sure where you'll end up, but I plan to be there with you on this one Dan. These are some really great ideas you have been sharing!