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The Lotus Vaporizer

Discussion in 'Portable Vaporizers' started by Max Jitter, Sep 24, 2010.

  1. Max Jitter

    Max Jitter Manufacturer Manufacturer

    Messages:
    203
    Location:
    Mendocino County CA
    [​IMG]
    This is the new Lotus Vaporizer.

    The Lotus is a portable vaporizer that uses a jet torch for its heat source.

    Its design separates the flame and its fumes from the air you inhale. The air passes through a bowl beneath the heat exchanger( the blue ring), becoming vapor. The vapor is cooled by the aluminum stem as it passes through.

    The heat exchanger slides onto the bowl and is held there with magnets.

    Heat-up time is about 2 seconds and cool-down time is instantaneous.

    The Lotus is made of maple, stainless steel, nickel and hard anodized aluminum. Thanks to the design and construction, there are no metal, plastic or wood flavors in the vapor.

    The user adjusts the vaporizing temp by varying his/her inhalation speed and the flame location. A 'hot spot' on the heat exchanger gives visual feedback of the vaporization temperature, shortening the learning curve. This is described in the instruction guide and shown on a video on our web site.
    http://www.lotusvaporizer.com/howto

    People really love the Lotus; it's portable, easy to use and gives a lot of flavor.

    I'm sure you are going to have questions. I'll try to answer them as best I can.
  2. lwien

    lwien Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    10,578
    Location:
    Arcadia, California
    Whatdya get when you marry a Vapman with a VaporGenie? Seems like a real viable alternative to either one of them.

    Interesting vape, Jitter. Good luck with your new venture and welcome aboard.

    btw, I also commend you on how you presented yourself and your product here. Well done.

    Now let the questions begin. I'll start. Would you say that there is absolutely no wood, metal or butane taste when using this vape? And, is the Lotus manufactured here or offshore?

    Love the idea of a magnetic top versus a screw-on top.
  3. pakalolo

    pakalolo RoboMod v3.17 (ticking) Staff Member

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    Definitely portable, stealthy not so much. That's a comment not a criticism.

    If I'd seen this without knowing about the LB I probably would have bought one. It looks simple, robust, easy to clean and use. I like the looks too. The price looks competitive ($110 Lotus alone, $126 for a kit w/ lighter). I can see a lot of people buying one in the near future. I won't be one of them, though. Attractive as the Lotus looks, the LB already fills the portable niche for me quite nicely.

    Congratulations Max!

    PS Everyone should go watch the video.
    Captain Comply likes this.
  4. NYC Vape

    NYC Vape Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    38
    First I say welcome to the forum and congratulate you for bringing a new and well thought out vaporizer to market.

    Can you contrast your product vs. the VaporGenie?

    I find with the VG (I use a regular bic lighter) I have to inhale so much I'm hyperventilating to get any vapor.

    I am in the market for a portable (other than the VG I use just on vacation).
  5. Max Jitter

    Max Jitter Manufacturer Manufacturer

    Messages:
    203
    Location:
    Mendocino County CA
    Thanks for the welcome. I've been lurking for a while and the posts are usually quite thoughtful. It's a good site with a questionable name.

    lwien said:
    Now let the questions begin. I'll start. Would you say that there is absolutely no wood, metal or butane taste when using this vape? And, is the Lotus manufactured here or offshore?

    There is no wood, metal or butane taste with the Lotus.
    1 The air that goes past the wood is at room temperature.
    2 I've had a lab test for nickel fumes (thin plate on top) and they are a small percentage of what is in normal air.
    3 The inhalation air is drawn thru the little holes on the bottom of the heat exchanger, away from the flame. The flame fumes also go up because they are hot and low density.

    The Lotus was designed here and will be built here. I'd like to see manufacturing return to the US, not leave.

    NYC Vape asked:
    Can you contrast your product vs. the VaporGenie?

    The Vaporgenie and a lot of other torch powered vapes suck in the butane fumes along with the inhalation air. My objective in designing the Lotus was that there were to be no butane fumes inhaled. The original name of the Lotus was the Lotus Clean Air Vaporizer, but it was too long a name.

    Lighters: The Lotus has to be used with a goose neck torch type lighter.
    A Bic type lighter doesn't produce enough heat and when the flame hits the 'hot plate', it just dumps a bunch of soot on it.
    The standard straight torch lighters don't work for very long when they are flipped upside down or past horizontal.
    You could roll the Lotus on its side and use a straight torch lighter but then you only see the top with one eye and you lose depth perception.

    pakalolo said:
    Definitely portable, stealthy not so much. That's a comment not a criticism.

    You're right. The Lotus comes in 2 stem lengths, 5 1/2" & 6 1/2", but it's definitely not as stealthy as the LB. I didn't want anyone to be worried about singing his/her nose with the torch.
    ataxian, BLAZING OG and filteredhead like this.
  6. rotax

    rotax Zaporist

    Messages:
    190
    Location:
    'burbia CO
    How long does the fuel last, in general?
    How many hits, how many hours, days (depending on use of course), etc?

    I like the idea behind the clean-air intake system.
  7. stickstones

    stickstones Wasted Staff Member

    Messages:
    7,974
    Do any of its parts get too hot to touch, and if so, how long til they cool down?
  8. Max Jitter

    Max Jitter Manufacturer Manufacturer

    Messages:
    203
    Location:
    Mendocino County CA
    The lighter seems to go for about 5 bowls before it needs a refill. I'm asking more users and will have more info later in the week.

    The Lotus ring on the top definitely gets too hot to touch and takes 20-30 seconds to cool down.
  9. Jacopone

    Jacopone Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    32
    Hi Jitter,
    Really interesting vaporizer, congratulations.
    I am a regular user of the Vapman for my needs on the go and as such I am really interested if you could elaborate on what are the main advantages and or disadvantages of one versus the other.
    They seem to be very similar in their approach so I am curious to know what you think.
    Thanks,
    Jacopone
  10. max

    max This space available Staff Member

    Messages:
    8,840
    While I think it's a good thing that the flame is not going into the bowl, as with the Vapor Genie or Vaporstar, you don't get butane fumes with those models either, at least not from the nozzle. You get partially burned carbon (soot) with a regular lighter, which is the preferred type for these models, vs. a torch.

    A torch lighter injects air, with 20% oxygen being the important part, allowing a complete carbon burn as well, and emitting only carbon dioxide, water and heat. If any butane escapes intact from a torch lighter, it would be due to a poor seal (not issuing from the nozzle), and butane from that leak would be in the air no matter what type of vape you're using.
    $unnyblaq likes this.
  11. stinkmeaner

    stinkmeaner Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    1,024
    I noticed the center of the flower on the heat exchanger is quite dark, does this come off or is the metal discolored from the heat?

    If it is discolored permanently, about how many vape sessions did it take to reach that level?
  12. DevoTheStrange

    DevoTheStrange Ia! Ia! Vapor Fthagn!

    Messages:
    1,652
    Location:
    Somewhere in the mountains.
    Also, can the flower portion be exchanged for a new one if needed?
    Although I would imagine there would be no need to do so, just wondering if it is an option.
  13. IAmKrazy2

    IAmKrazy2 Darth Vapor

    Messages:
    1,376
    Location:
    Detroit
    I like your style Jitter. Welcome, Nice first manufacturer post.

    You need to add in a direct connect for 14mm and 18mm glass. Throw it in as a package. Has this been tried filtered through water directly into glass? If heat retention is correct, this could be very nice.

    I may have just made you some money, i hope. :D

    Edit: Oh, and i think you hit the nail on the head with the scoop. Great addition to the quick on the move portability of this product. But with glass, it might have more of a home market value too.

    If this has already been mentioned, i apologize.
    filteredhead likes this.
  14. vumeister

    vumeister Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    6
    It seems kind of expensive considering what it is...does anyone else agree with me on this? If you could get the price down a bit to like 70ish, then you've got a winner.
  15. vapirtoo

    vapirtoo Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    585
    I agree totally. I like the design as an alternative to my LB
    when and if the electric power grid goes down.
    The lotus is kind of big and bulky, but I like the pure
    air flow. There will be another learning curve with this
    one just like the others. Lets hope the price comes down,
    Looks like it could be a contender!
    ataxian likes this.
  16. pakalolo

    pakalolo RoboMod v3.17 (ticking) Staff Member

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    I'm not sure why you think it should cost less. Is it too simple? Not big enough? Not small enough? Cheap materials? I don't really know what it costs to make one, do you? What do you think would be a reasonable markup?
    ataxian likes this.
  17. vumeister

    vumeister Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    6
    It just seems like I can shimmy something like this for 20 bucks with similar materials. Perhaps it's the simplicity.
  18. lwien

    lwien Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    10,578
    Location:
    Arcadia, California
    Aluminum VaporGenie costs 60 bucks.
    Vapman costs 150.

    This is kind of a hybrid between both of those so their price of 110 seems to be about in the ballpark if you go on that logic.

    If ya go on the logic of what is available for portables in the market:
    55 to 60 for a VaporGenie
    150 for a Vapman
    200 for an Iolite
    200 for a Supreme with a digital display
    and 100 bucks for a LaunchBox

    then imho, 110 seems to be in the right ballpark.

    Considering the cost of materials and manufacture, why would you feel that the LaunchBox should cost 30 dollars more on your thought that the Lotus should be priced at only 70, unless of course, you feel that the LaunchBox is also overpriced.

    Like pakalolo said, I have no idea how much it costs to manufacture one of these, nor do I know the amount of time and effort it took to bring it to market but strictly from what the "market will bear" perspective, I think somewhere between 90 to 110 seems about right.
  19. lwien

    lwien Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    10,578
    Location:
    Arcadia, California
    It's funny. People said the exact same thing about the LaunchBox.

    I have no idea how well the Lotus works, but if it works well, and if you can build one that works just as well and looks just as nice and is just as safe to use for 20 bucks, I'll buy it for 40 bucks from ya. You'll double your money. :brow:

    All kidding aside though, I think it's pretty easy to make something complicated work. The real trick is making something simple work and it's that philosophy that is one of the big reasons for the overwhelming success of the LaunchBox as well as one of the downsides to the Iolite.

    But hell, we really don't know how good the Lotus really is until we get one in the hands of one of our members here who can write up a report. It may not even be worth 20 bucks for all we know. But on paper, it looks pretty neat.
    ataxian and OO like this.
  20. Max Jitter

    Max Jitter Manufacturer Manufacturer

    Messages:
    203
    Location:
    Mendocino County CA
    Neither sucks in butane/flame fumes, using different methods.
    The Vapman is smaller
    The Lotus uses convection to heat the herb. It seems that the Vapman has the herb on the same plate that is being heated. That would give you conduction heating, which isn't as even in heating the herb as convection.
    The Lotus can be cleaned by putting the bowl/stem in alcohol.
    The aluminum stem of the Lotus cools the vapor.
    The Lotus is used more like a traditional pipe.
    The Vapman uses a copper heating plate vs a nickel plate on the Lotus. Copper oxidizes at a lower temp than nickel. Have you seen any signs of oxidation?
    We'll have to wait until someone has tested them head to head to get a real comparison.

    max wrote:
    You get partially burned carbon (soot) with a regular lighter, which is the preferred type for these models, vs. a torch.

    I vote for no soot or flame fumes. There is probably a difference in the taste.


    stinkmeaner wrote:
    I noticed the center of the flower on the heat exchanger is quite dark, does this come off or is the metal discolored from the heat?

    The metal gets discolored the first time it is heated and stays that way. Every spot that was red becomes dark blue.
    I will be offering replacement plates, but it wouldn't be worth it unless the old plate was punctured or badly dented.

    A model that fits a standard bong stem will be offered in the future but right now I'm flapping my wings as hard as I can to get this model off the ground.

    vumeister wrote:
    It just seems like I can shimmy something like this for 20 bucks with similar materials. Perhaps it's the simplicity.

    Its easy to make something complex. Its harder to make it simple. This is the 12th model I've made and I have a patent pending on it.
    ataxian, BLAZING OG and filteredhead like this.
  21. george

    george Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    423
    I think it would work great as a bong attachment..18mm please;)
    ataxian likes this.
  22. DeepFried

    DeepFried A Legend in my Own Mind

    Messages:
    535
    Location:
    District9
    Nice to see some new vape designs, congratulations on a nice clean design. On your site it says "The Lotus Vaporizer features a one-piece aluminum stem and screened bowl." Does that mean the screen is aluminum too, I doubt it but just checking.
  23. ShadowLink12

    ShadowLink12 Activist

    Messages:
    149
    Location:
    WA
    I can't wait to see some user videos of this, as it looks like an impressive piece. I am not saying it should be cheaper, as I am sure it deserves its price point, but it isn't a purchase for me for a while at that price.
  24. vumeister

    vumeister Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    6
    The lotus is basically a fancy lightbulb vape in my opinion...and I find that the Magic Box is more complex because it has a built in heating element which is far harder to build and therefore making it cost more. The lotus has essentially 3 basic parts: a tube, a bowl, and a hot plate....that's it. The lotus is more comparable to the VG as it is the same thing, basically you can just replace the ceramic filter with a hot plate and you've got a lotus. The price should be more closer to the VaporGenie if this product wants to be competitive in this market. The cheapest VG goes is $45, a price of $70 like I initially stated still seems like a reasonable price point for it being a new product/company. I just feel like that the lotus would be more successful with a lower price point then what it is right now.
    ataxian likes this.
  25. stinkmeaner

    stinkmeaner Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    1,024
    Compare this to the complexity of the SoloPipe which can be bought for as low as $30, the Solopipe is way more complicated so this could be priced cheaper but most vapes should.

    I don't know why everyone is targeting the Lotus Vape as over priced when the Vaprorizer market is flooded with products that are simply overpriced, most desktop models like the SSV, DBV, & VB too name a few are still just a heating element and a dimmer placed inside different enclosures like aluminum tube or a wood box.

    I think as consumers in the Vaporizer market, we have to get used to inflated prices because in this type of niche market, new products are going to come out all of the time and many of them are failures or duds so I think the Manufacturers price products high initially so they can recoup some of their money and then most will lower the price after it has been out long enough, and by the time they make it to distributors or Ebay, most can be bought for nearly half of the MSRP that they started as.
    ataxian likes this.

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