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The Arizer Air

Discussion in 'Portable Vaporizers' started by pakalolo, Nov 26, 2014.

  1. fubar

    fubar Ancient and opiniated inhaler

    Messages:
    176
    Location:
    Sydney, Australia
    You might soemtimes see char (black abv) on the top of the bud from radiant heat if you push it too close to the oven. The inverse square law for radiant heat transfer makes it much less likely to happen if you pull it a few mm out. See http://fuckcombustion.com/threads/temperature-plotting-with-a-raspberry-pi.20720/
     
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  2. greyduck

    greyduck Member

    Messages:
    6
    If I vape about once a week, how should I store the battery? Is it ok for me to leave the battery in the Air at 100% charge or should I remove it? If I remove it, is it ok for me to keep in a plastic ziplock sandwich bag? I would do this because I'm concerned about the battery contacts accidentally coming into contact with something metal like the tamping tool.
     
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  3. OF

    OF Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    17,346
    Location:
    Left Coast
    Good questions. I'd say don't remove it unless you need to for charging or battery changes? Otherwise, treat it like an internal battery.

    Don't store it at 100% charge for long times....ever. Notice it came to you about 75% charged? That's why. They can die in a year of so stored at 100% (no use), especially if the temperature is high. Avoid it. Instead, recharge after about 3 sessions (you'll learn how many between chargings, but four is a typical number) before the fourth when you charge it then immediately enjoy a session before putting it away?

    Replacements are cheap, and easy to swap in Air, but IMO that's the best routine to preserve life.

    Most importantly, enjoy your Air. It's a tool, and a fine one to be sure, but only a tool. And only truly useful when it does it's owner's bidding?

    OF
     
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  4. greyduck

    greyduck Member

    Messages:
    6
    What's considered a long time for battery storage? Do folks keep their spare batteries charged at 100%?
     
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  5. OF

    OF Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    17,346
    Location:
    Left Coast
    Pretty subjective, really? Some good reading on the topic here, perhaps a good place to start?
    http://batteryuniversity.com/learn/article/how_to_prolong_lithium_based_batteries

    As I said, there's a clue in the observation that legitimate pros store/sell/deliver them at about 75% and temperature is a big wild card. Store them at 75% or so and keep them comfortable and they should give half or so capacity ten years out. Your call.

    Perhaps you know a cell phone or laptop that used to live 'plugged in and ready to go' and now has very poor battery life? Now you know why (100% charge 24/7).

    Battery life is a complex issue, really. For instance, notice from the BU page that stopping charging 10% early doubles you cycle life? Charging to 4.1 Volts, rather than 4.2, means your battery will last twice as long. Twice. And, as a fun side benefit of this, recharging this class of batteries (Li-ions), is like filling your gas tank. You charge 'full blast' (at the limit of the charger) for most of the time like you 'pump' gas as fast as the pump will allow at first. Then, like you at the pumps, the charger starts to taper off the charge rate to stay under 4.2 Volts like you throttle the nozzle to keep kickback under control. Charge is stopped when the rate drops to 10% of 'full blast' so it will end in reasonable time. So it fills slower and slower as it comes up to 100%. This last 10% (or half the charge if you only do one session.....) averages half the normal rate, it takes twice as long as the 10% between say 60 and 70% does. Stopping early saves about 25 minutes off every recharge (the last 25 normally). Battery management is a compromise for sure.

    BTW, the Military often specifies early termination for this very reason. Typical numbers are 3.95 plus or minus .05 Volts, against the more typical 4.20 which 'comes in' 4.15 to 4.25 typically. They (the Military) will trade off run time for longer battery service life. Logistics and all that.

    OF
     
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  6. Hey guys Im about to order the arizer air and I just cant decide what colour to order. The options are Black, Silver or Titanium. Does anyone have the titanium. I would really appreciate if someone could upload pictures of their titanium unit in good lighting . Please let me know your thoughts. Im leaning towards the titanium what do you think?
     
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  7. sickmanfraud

    sickmanfraud Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    967
    You can go to Arizer.com or puffitup or PlanetVape.ca and see pictures. Plenty of video reviews on youtube also.
     
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  8. greyduck

    greyduck Member

    Messages:
    6
    Thanks for the super informative post. I suppose that it's a good idea to get an external battery charger then to get a good idea of the charge level of the battery if I don't want to fully charge it each time since the Air doesn't have a good battery level indicator.
     
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  9. TwistedGray

    TwistedGray Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    426
    It sucks when you're one or two minutes in and the damn thing shuts off.
     
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  10. sickmanfraud

    sickmanfraud Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    967
    Many folks grab a second (charged) battery as soon as they see a red battery indicator. That way you are not 2 minutes in and wondering why the Air doesn't work.
     
  11. greyduck

    greyduck Member

    Messages:
    6
    Yeah I just got mine then fully charged it and pretty sure I only used it for two sessions the first time and fired it up a couple nights ago but couldn't get it to warm up. Looked online and saw that a solid red light with flashing blue temperature light meant the battery needed to be recharged. It was a bummer since it was already late for me and I didn't want to wait 30 minutes for it to get to a level where I could use it while plugged in.
     
  12. OF

    OF Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    17,346
    Location:
    Left Coast
    Got a stoppage? Abandon your long arm and draw and engage with your side arm.....

    Ooops, wrong venue. Same idea, if you can't reliably count to four sessions per charge, perhaps best to have a (3/4) charged 18650 in standby? Time to swap when you get caught with no heat.

    Yep. While the newer versions have a 'meter' of sorts added, it's crude indeed. As I recall, the entire last half of the charge is indicated by the same color? Like covering the bottom half of your car's gas gauge up, isn't it? You know there's less than half a tank left, but you've really no idea if you're about to run out of gas or have LOTS of time left.

    And then there's those of us who are Color Blind enough to make the Red/Green coding a cruel joke. I can't tell the full charge from 'half or less' all I can define is the 75 to 60% 'white' step. Worst possible choice for the largest population of us so afflicted. Over half the total as I recall are R/G, most any other scheme would be better. We're not uncommon, about 1/8......about the same number as are left handed. Basically only males since females (XX) get a second chance to have normal color vision (it's in the tail that changes X to Y Chromosomes). So think about left handed men, that's basically how many Color Blind men are around you, many don't know it. Until I was about 14 I wasn't color blind officially, I was just stupid. Ask the school system. That was when I first saw an eye doctor, who tested. Very well documented, funny they would 'write us off'. Perhaps from ignorance (being female or the 7/8 that have normal color vision).

    I considered 'identifying as female' to address this handicap, but am informed that's not really how it works.......

    OF
     
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  13. TwistedGray

    TwistedGray Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    426
    I recharge (religiously) after three sessions now. Too lazy to buy extras just yet because I keep that this emotion of switching to concentrates, but then again...I never do.
     
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  14. Faolan

    Faolan Active Member

    Messages:
    34
    Every time I come here you crack me up haha. :p

    usually charge my air when it's on red. Just about always get a session out of red but it doesn't feel the same? If that makes any sense lol. My air gets stored at full charge usually because I forget it's charging but the battery still feels new! I should mention it never gets stored for more than a few days
     
    Last edited: Jan 9, 2017
  15. OF

    OF Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    17,346
    Location:
    Left Coast
    Glad to pass on smiles when I can. You know what they say, "if you can't inform, at least amuse"?

    I think the most important part is you are using (and enjoying it), the rest is details.

    Best wishes,

    OF
     
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  16. sickmanfraud

    sickmanfraud Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    967
    Just saw a 90 mm all glass aroma tube being supplied to the new Solo NLE.

    Has anyone here gotten their hands on a 90 mm stem for the Solo or Air??

    Does it make the vapor noticeably cooler than the 70 mm?
     
  17. Jimiblues

    Jimiblues Active Member

    Messages:
    35
    I just made it part of my routine to unscrew and throw it on the charger after each session. It was a hassle at first but now I don't even think about it, automatic.
     
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  18. OF

    OF Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    17,346
    Location:
    Left Coast
    For sure that is easy and will work, and it is a personal call, but that' probably the worst way to go WRT battery lifespan short of intentionally baking it at high temperatures. Simply storing them at 100% (never using them) will kill them off in short time. Notice how new ones are charged to about 75% when you get them rather the 'fully charged, ready to go'? That's why. Ten years standby at 75% doesn't dent capacity much, but a few years at 100% can be fatal.

    I'm sure we all know a cell phone or laptop (same type battery) that was left 'plugged in, so it's always ready to go' that now as miserable battery life? That's why. It wasn't the battery or unit, but the practice of 100% charge full time.

    Good information on the topic on this page, and elsewhere on the site:
    http://batteryuniversity.com/learn/article/how_to_prolong_lithium_based_batteries

    An individual decision for sure, but IMO it should be an informed one. Part of that consideration should be, I think, the negative aspects of this advice? Since replacements are cheap and easy this is not as important as with some products with built in batteries, but he issue remains and I think should be considered. Keeping 100% charge has real costs.

    OF
     
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  19. TwistedGray

    TwistedGray Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    426
    Very true, but if you are like this guy and recharge after each use it is a moot point. He has nothing to worry about as far as battery lifetime is concerned given his method of charging. That's the same for laptop, phone, and other similar devices. It doesn't matter if you're always tethered and don't care about battery longevity.
     
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  20. OF

    OF Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    17,346
    Location:
    Left Coast
    Actually I think both those positions are wrong. The point is 100% charge all the time is destructive, it will shorten battery life. Yes, if he never does more than one session that time will be a long time coming (it will go from four to three to two to one complete session first). But it will eventually fail to complete a single session even when plugged in (as we've discussed before, the charger is not powerful enough to heat alone). Those that 'unplug' for travel will of course run into trouble much sooner.

    What this means is the 18650 will need replacement much sooner is all.

    And while most cell phones are OK with no battery support (although some don't allow it anyway?) most laptops are not. The clue is, like with Air, it takes longer to charge than discharge? Logically that says the charger isn't able to supply enough power in real time.

    It is a technique worth considering, but IMO all aspects should be included in that decision. Not everyone is "like this guy", in fact I expect very very few do this? From a wear standpoint alone I'd avoid handling the bits that much, instead charging in place, but that too is a personal call. In general such techniques (always top up') are considered poor Battery Management by those 'in the know'. Like Battery University. And the vape maker?

    I think that should be included with the advice for more informed decisions.

    OF
     
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  21. TwistedGray

    TwistedGray Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    426
    Right, but we're talking a long way off, so again I feel it's a moot point for this user.
     
    OF likes this.
  22. Jimiblues

    Jimiblues Active Member

    Messages:
    35
    Like you said OF the battery is a cheap replacement...it would be a different story if I owned a solo. Btw I never really store it. It's always being charged and used(daily driver and heavy use) and at night time ill have a session or two then turn off the air...wake up the next morning then charge. OF do you recommend that I use the air until the battery is completely drained? Or should I continue my routine?
     
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  23. OF

    OF Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    17,346
    Location:
    Left Coast
    But bad general advice? Especially without the negative factors being included.

    If the statement was intended only as expressing what he does, I'm only pointing to a downside for him (early battery failure). If, as I suspect, it was put up as an example of how you should practice Battery Management for Forum advice I think it has serious problems/shortcomings

    Informed decisions. That means knowing all the important points?

    From a battery POV it's being stored when it's not being charged or discharged.

    While you seem to have modified your "routine to unscrew and throw it on the charger after each session" which is, I think, a step in the right direction.

    The BU page has some good discussion of the trade offs of DOD (Depth of Discharge) and so on. To a large extent, more sessions per charge is cost effective. It's deep discharge and full recharge we need to watch. I recommend (and practice) 3 or 4 sessions in a row before recharge. And, if possible, recharge then immediately take that first session (ending at about 75%) rather than recharging an putting it away. I can 'work' this more since I've built a 'gadget' to automatically stop charging early (at about 90%) which automatically doubles the battery life. I made this for Solo, but have modified it for several other vapes (including most 'USB capable' ones like Air) since it works so well. One version looks like this:
    [​IMG]

    Power comes in the connector in the top left corner. When the button is pressed power is delivered to the cable and current is monitored by the 3 parallel resistors on the top of the upper board. As the current tapers off naturally at end of charging it's sensed and when it drops below the trip point power is dropped. The processor (lower left on upper board) does the thinking/control and the beeper (now covered with the 'washing label') signals when it's done. The lower board reduces the 12 Volts Solo uses to 9 (for Ascent, FMs and such) or 5 Volts for Air and a bunch more. My 'run four sessions and recharge with the Gadget' routine runs the 18650 from 90% down to about 20 IIRC.

    There's also a fun time benefit here, since the last 10% or any normal charge cycle is at an ever reducing rate (half normal average) it's the part that gets cut off (the slow bit). EVERY RECHARGE IS ABOUT A HALF HOUR FASTER. Faster and better for the lifespan, a win-win IMO. That 10% is a good trade-off where I came from.

    Having a (mostly charged) 18650 in standby has prevented any 'slide locked back' accidents. I have the added problem of not being able to use the 'battery meter' in Air, such as it is, being Color Blind (as are many others).

    Sounds to me like 'use it all day, recharge first thing in the morning and enjoy a bowl to start the day' might be worth exploring to you? You can feel all kinds of warm and fuzzy taking best care of your battery....... Small sacrifices count too.

    Regards,

    OF
     
    Last edited: Jan 10, 2017
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  24. Jimiblues

    Jimiblues Active Member

    Messages:
    35
    Thank you OF....my new routine will be 3-4 sessions then recharge, ill take it off the charger at 3.9-4.0, just shy of a full charge.
     
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  25. OF

    OF Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    17,346
    Location:
    Left Coast
    You're welcome. Worth looking into I think. That's earlier than I cut off. It's fairly linear at about .1 Volts for every 10% (that is 100% is from 3.2 or so to 4.2) so you'd be stopping at the 70 or 80% point. No big deal, of course, you should still make 4 sessions (I do on the 3rd step easily). If you miss stopping the charge in time no big deal, you just lose the benefit for that cycle. If you can, you get a session or two (or more) for 'free' in the total........and the guys that sell replacement batteries go back to drinking well Scotch rather than Single Malt?

    BTW, this has got me curious so I dug out the Air, enjoyed the fourth session on this charge and am doing test run. I started out at 3.42 Volts, probably not enough for another session. It's running at .820 Amps. Let's see where we go with it. Will advise......if I don't forget. Or get distracted or something.......

    OF
     
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