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QB-GON Grinder

Discussion in 'Vapor Related Equipment' started by QB-GON, May 11, 2016.

  1. Edward Hyde

    Edward Hyde Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    478
    Maybe it is of the same level of quality as these grinders. Or maybe its even better. we dont know till someone has one on his hands. I am about to spend a good amount of money and i was thinking one of the high end grinders and they are similar price. So if its high quality product its normal.
     
    QB-GON, °k and IAmKrazy2 like this.
  2. °k

    °k The sound of vapor

    Messages:
    541
    That design looks interesting to me and I'd expect it to be pretty resistant. It's also said that a part of it is handmade which obviously makes it a bit more expensive to produce than a metal grinder I'd think.

    On top of this the price has been reduced since your comment @IAmKrazy2, it turns out to be cheaper than what I've paid to get my Cali crusher homegrown. Join me in the grind side, you know you want to... :nod:

    On a side note, I'm really surprised there's not more reaction from the grinder thread people. :shrug:
     
    SSVUN~YAH, Edward Hyde and QB-GON like this.
  3. IAmKrazy2

    IAmKrazy2 Darth Vapor

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    Location:
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    Thanks for letting me know the price drop. Might very well pull the trigger and take a chance now
     
  4. Vitolo

    Vitolo Vaporist

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    8,588
    Location:
    The Vapor Trail
    Judging from @QB-GON's response... it is a concept.
    That is what it did to me.
    I have no choice but to agree.
    Been there... done it.... and have been disappointed every time.
    When I see these online, if price looks appropriate I will buy one.
    FC already has a perfectly good Herb Grinder thread.
    It was a bit of a turn off to me that this Accesory Maker feels his product needs it's own thread.
    Personally I would have taken a better shining toward this product if it was humbly spoken of in the Herb Grinder thread that we all check daily.
     
    Last edited: Jul 6, 2016
  5. °k

    °k The sound of vapor

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    541
    Woaw guys why are you so harsh on him? :o

    It looks like people have different experiences in crowd-funding but to call this grinder bullshit is not "very nice". I've funded a few things, simple ones, more advanced ones and my conclusion is the more electronic and the bigger the claims the more delay there'll be and the more deception you'll get. Simple products with no electronics might have slight delays but nothing too horrible. This grinder is made of wood and metal, both easy to get and process and the claims about it are not that amazing to believe so why would you expect an extremely long delay for this to arrive?
    Some have said to go get a loan at the bank... smart but in some countries bankers won't put their money on weed related products, on top of that I'm not sure Greek banks are in the best shape at the moment...
    I personally find the idea of crowd-funding a great way for a community to support something made for them.

    Is it still a concept if a working prototype has been made and shown in a video?

    I agree with you, it'd have had much more visibility in the grinder thread. That said I'm not sure an accessory maker can just hijack a generic thread for his own product, while this might appear manageable with only one what happens when more grinder makers decide to come to FC? Also I certainly don't mind JyArZ having their own thread for instance.

    I have to say @Vitolo I completely agree with you on the video being too much, he's now replaced it on the campaign page with the demo video on the red table (much more informative and can be played without being muted ;)).

    :2c::peace:;)
     
    Vitolo and DrHermman like this.
  6. Vitolo

    Vitolo Vaporist

    Messages:
    8,588
    Location:
    The Vapor Trail
    My answer would be mixed.
    A working prototype in my mind would be a home made grinder.
    If a working prototype is however not in production, and the production of these is not in progress, then while the prototype would not be just a concept.. the actual functioning business and support is just a concept.
    That is a positive step for sure.
    Trust me @QB-GON .... I am not trying to rain on your parade, and I wish you only success. I will buy a grinder when it is available for sale..
    If the grinder is great, I will proudly show it to every patient I come into contact with.
     
  7. Edward Hyde

    Edward Hyde Well-Known Member

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    478
    Tbh greek banks dont fun anything at the moment cause liquidity is running too low... I believe that when this item becomes available to us its going to be a game changer.i mean 2 options for fine and coarse grind with the same mechanism interchanchable grinding chamber. My old grinders have all broken teeth and i am about to purchase a new one so for now i have been using scissors and this grinder looks like some kind of 3-4 stacked scissors in the shape of John Rambo's knife. If they have managed to bypass the excessive force of trying to grindall scissors at the same time then fore sure this will be a beast cause scissors seem to always do a better job on fine grind..
     
  8. °k

    °k The sound of vapor

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    541
    The more I look at the in use video, the more it looks to me like the final product, it only seems it now needs to be put in production. Now saying that a company on the brink of existence is a concept, I find that to be a bit of a stretch but I hear you about the fact that you can't really evaluate their CS yet.

    That said I've spoken with the man a little bit and he seems like a genuine, good person who really listens to his customers (he made several requested changes: addition of a pollen tray, lower IGG price, replaced the video) and who's only willing to make his grinder available and then carry on with other designs he has in plan (not just grinders). I've put a bit of my money on the guy, and I really don't feel like there's any risk for him to run away with it, also the demo video is good enough for me to see this new product is different and seems to work fine. I'll obviously won't know if it's satisfying until I get one in my hands but I personally like the principle of crowd-funding for small or starting companies (I see it as a good deed, I've even given money to give surgery to a guy in Philippines once through IGG and there was no perc for me to get! :p).

    I used to want to get an SCS but after seeing their attitude towards customers I simply decided not to even though I could have bought one from a 3rd party in UK, but I believe I "vote" with my money, and my money for a new grinder is going to @QB-GON and I'm proud and happy to support his project, hopefully more will join me soon because being honest, I'm pretty convinced it'll be a nice object to have and to use.
     
  9. Vitolo

    Vitolo Vaporist

    Messages:
    8,588
    Location:
    The Vapor Trail
    A menu change in a restaurant (new prices.. new items etc) is still a concept even if they have the prototype sample of that menu completed.. and shown around to the world for approval.
    Until that restaurant has enough menus printed for all customers, it is a concept.
    And I meant it.
    I will get one of these when it is not a concept, but out on the market for sale.
     
    Edward Hyde likes this.
  10. °k

    °k The sound of vapor

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    541
    I'm glad you've joined the discussion here by the way @Vitolo. :tup:

    Hopefully more people will be supporting this like me so it gets funded and you guys can then buy it. :nod:
     
    IAmKrazy2 likes this.
  11. Vitolo

    Vitolo Vaporist

    Messages:
    8,588
    Location:
    The Vapor Trail
    Thanks.
    I will stick around and watch.
    I looked at the videos at the campaign site again.
    I must be honest... I am concerned.
    It is supposed to be a working prototype.
    The videos... all 3 are using video magic...
    grinders do not float on fingertips.... come apart with no hands to expose their "innards"..
    Yes real hands take it apart and re-assemble (with help of video editing to make it smooth where needed), but where is the demo?
    Where is a real time unedited video of the grinder in use?
    alot of sliding parts whose surfaces are flat, and will get gummed up sooner or later....
    Some video of a dirty unit, and it's cleaning would help. (I know the metal parts could be submerged in Iso... how about the wood.
    @QB-GON - you have done a stellar job of advertising using a variety of video enhancement techniques, but I would like to see some real time footage of usage, that demonstrates function, and finished grind.. something more basic please.
     
  12. °k

    °k The sound of vapor

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    541
    I think he had to remove the video with weed being ground to avoid issues with IGG (not sure that'd happen but better safe than sorry).

    There's a pic showing the grind resultS earlier in the thread (I know it's just a picture and you have to take his word for it).

    The cleaning is indeed the one part that has me a bit "worried". I believe regular brushing would do good and when it's time to clean it better probably a slightly wet clothe to clean the wood parts should do? I know you like cleaning your wood with whisky though. ;) I think the part that would bother me the most in term of cleaning (the bottom chamber) is not an issue any more as he's added a metal dish to collect the pollen (which can be removed to be soaked for cleaning. It's obviously a grinder that requires a bit more TLC than a metal one, some butter or oil based lining for the wood seems to be necessary but I might be wrong on this.
     
    Vitolo and Edward Hyde like this.
  13. Edward Hyde

    Edward Hyde Well-Known Member

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    478
    I am pretty sure that since there is at least one guy here asking for that video these guys will make it... I vote for such a video aswell. I am almost ready to hit the button on it and i got a feeling i will not regret it. Such a video for sure will help a lot to fix my decision. As k said since its not electronics and high end technology and its just a mechanism with a wooden cover not many things can go wrong imo and the picture from the results indeed looks like a good job.
     
    Vitolo and °k like this.
  14. little maggie

    little maggie Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    2,535
    Hopefully IGG won't pull this at the last minute the way they did the dynastasher
     
    Dramma Lamma, TheVaporist and Vitolo like this.
  15. QB-GON

    QB-GON Member Accessory Maker

    Messages:
    22
    You might not know this but as we mentioned earlier we are based in Greece and the current economical crisis means that there are more chances winning the lottery than getting a loan from a bank.

    It is a fact when a client pays, they have the right to expect their goods on time. I can assure you we don't want to sit on your money and we want to deliver a product without delays. Last thing we want is an angry customer. A company that respects itself should want a happy customer willing to buy again. We know that this is not always possible to meet deadlines as there are always so many things that can go wrong that eventually something goes wrong. None can predict the future but what we can guarantee, is that we will have the same dedication for production as the one we had for making our design as perfect as possible (even with a last moment addition).

    We never said we don't need crowd funding. Thanks to bank delays we are 1 month delayed. That means our campaign will end at 4th of August + 15 days for IGG processing time of funds get us to 20th of August. Another fact is that from 15-30 of August everything is closed in Greece due to summer vacations, all suppliers will start working from September. We hoped we could get funds before 15th so we can start manufacturing but this is not going to happen now.

    We bet Kannastor is a great grinder, and if you already own a grinder that satisfies you, you might no need a new one. But we also know that everyone that gets a QB-GON in their hands, appreciates the feel and wants to start another session or roll another joint just to use it. We also seen friends chasing each other around like kids about who is going to grind.



    If you like products with elegant design and a new approach then QB-GON is for you. We believe that beyond its functionality, it is a display piece that also pleases the eyes and would sit nicely on a desk for instance. It is not made to be carried around in a backpack with sharp objects and requires to be treated the same way we have made it, with love and care.
    We are planning on making an on-the-go version too and once funded we'll have more designs coming up, from vapes to bongs and grinders. This is only the beginning and we hope you guys will be with us along the way!



    Concerning the prototype and production line, the wooden parts are the most complex. We can produce QB-GON in a room in my apartment but producing 1 piece there takes almost the same time as making 100 in a dedicated workshop, because of different tool set ups that can take up to 30 mins between each production phase. In this apartment we have developed our production line and know-how, we made the final prototype and some spare parts from this production line so we can estimate processing times. However running a real production line in an apartment is not possible as machines produce a lot of noise and sawdust. Typical while we develop our manufacturing methods and made tries we had to stop from 14:00-17:00 as there's a siesta law. Metallic parts from the manufacturer are very simple, and don't require any special manufacturing. Custom tooling is also ready for parts that require it.


    The current blades are made from stainless steel 305 alloy that is used for architectural purposes and it is non magnetic. Commercial version will be made from stainless steel 430 alloy that is used for kitchenware and is magnetic, we need magnetic alloy so axis can magnetized on bottom blade. The reason we didn't use this alloy on our prototype is because by default manufacturers use 305 and we would have had to provide the material that is too expensive for a prototype.


    We are crowdfunding so we can buy wholesale magnets / get the materials we need tell our suppliers to push the button and start manufacturing a batch that can lead us to some profit so we can continue.


    There is a mold we need to make for the pollen catcher, so it can have a perfect fit as the ones on photograph are made with manufacturers stock mold. But this is not something that should cause delays as this is a very simple mold, nothing too difficult to manufacture and from my 4 years experience with the workshops is a 10 mins program in a lathe.

    Before posting we contact the forum admins to ask if we can post as manufacturers.
    They recommend to start a thread on vapor related accessories.


    As we have done so far, there is no request we don't want to consider as we want to do our best to satisfy our potential customers.
    We will post a video as soon as possible. For now I will share with you some photos of the spare parts made from our production line.

    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Jul 9, 2016
  16. °k

    °k The sound of vapor

    Messages:
    541
    Sounds like apart from finalizing that pollen tray and setting up your workshop in a non-siesta area (gotta love that law when you can't be bothered working after lunch :p), you're ready to start the production once the campaign gets enough funding. :tup:

    I'm looking forward to seeing your new in-use video!
     
    DrHermman and QB-GON like this.
  17. IAmKrazy2

    IAmKrazy2 Darth Vapor

    Messages:
    2,642
    Location:
    Detroit
    I like the way you carry yourself and the way you answer questions @QB-GON
     
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  18. Vitolo

    Vitolo Vaporist

    Messages:
    8,588
    Location:
    The Vapor Trail
    I do have an opinion on this herb preparation device.
    I watched the videos at QB-GON's channel https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCb5YJII2NGYzBdYFezR8YhA?spfreload=5
    plus an "unlisted" video that shows more.
    I watched for hours so I could gather my thoughts.
    • The OB-GON grinder is undoubtedly unique.
    • It is beautiful, and obviouslly made with care.
    • It is a collectors piece, with a wonderful artistic form.
    • It is innocuous in appearance to a casual observer seeing it on a shelf, and does not draw attention as Marijuana paraphernalia.
    • It is well thought out, and intricate in it's mechanism, which would appeal to any engineer.
    It appears to be an engineers dream... sort of the puzzle box of the grinding arena. It is a device of loving use, and proud delight over its intricacy.
    I am fascinated by the workmanship, but not being an engineer, I primarily look at a device from the standpoint of a Medical Marijuana Patient.
    From what I see in the videos I feel personally disinterested for the following reasons.
    1. The fact that is can be balanced has nothing to do with function (smoke and mirrors).
    2. It it does not appear easy to hold by all hands..
    3. It is very complex with many working parts.
    4. Meds are not enclosed.. so unit must be held upright and carefully.
    5. You must hand feed small amounts of meds at a time.
    6. The meds that are hand fed into device must be poked down, and then tapped around to get into the machinery.
    7. The clicks of the Device (you must turn it twice- once in one direction and once in another ) seem rough and awkward, using discreet/specific movements rather than continuous gliding motion.
    8. It appears that it will require more time consuming cleaning than traditional grinders

    My preference is that the grinder hold the meds well and enclosed, the turns of the unit should be able to be accomplished in one direction or in a back and forth direction…. and when back and forth it should work with any degree of turn (1/4 turn, 1/2 turn, or even a minute back and forth jiggle).
    I do not like the idea of forcing small amounts of meds through and working them through, my preference is to place whatever amount I like in the unit, and be done with it.
    The complexity is wonderful for the proud user with time on his/her hands, but I see great advantage in using a tool that is 2 parts: top and bottom.
    After watching the videos repeatedly I have decided not to get involved with this.
    I wish the OB-GON greatest success, and I congratulate the soon to be proud owners of these never before seen design of Herbal Preparation Implements.
     
    Last edited: Jul 20, 2016
    vapen00b, turk, NorVape and 4 others like this.
  19. FlyingLow

    FlyingLow Team NO SLEEP!

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    2,747
    I agree on all accounts, well engineered (depending on what youre looking for), but far overly complex solution to get a grind and all the moving parts i can see being a nightmare for a heavy user to keep clean and functioning optimally.
     
    justcametomind, turk, Vitolo and 3 others like this.
  20. VapourHaze

    VapourHaze Rexcornish on IG, Vaping since '02

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    602
    Location:
    Eurocentric
    They have siestas because its too hot not because they cant be bothered lol.

    I was in Greece in August during a heatwave once . . Its absolutely brutal.
     
    NorVape and QB-GON like this.
  21. °k

    °k The sound of vapor

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    541
  22. °k

    °k The sound of vapor

    Messages:
    541
    Glad to see the campaign picking up! :tup:
     
    QB-GON likes this.
  23. Edward Hyde

    Edward Hyde Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    478
    Got news on this thing. I pushed the trigger and i think i am not going to be dissapointed and nor will anyone else that bought it be. These guys are located in Greece and so am I. During summer trip I had the change to visit their company place they were really friendly and also let me get my hands on one of the prototypes.

    First about their company i gotta say the place its impressive. They have DIY set ups with modified machines like small cnc, drills and wood carving tools and specified tools for magnet dispensary on the units (DIY machine from 0 to complete) which indeed allows the production of the wooden parts in really decent amount of time and i can say that cause i actually watched them create one wooden part in front of my eyes. About the blades they told me they are having that outsource and the production process isnt long.

    Now about the QB-GON i held in my hands. This little thing has some kind of addictive ability indeed. the wood feels really nice on the hand and the geometric shapes make it really interesting while using very similar to playing with a rubics cube. The feeling of the grind time doesnt remind me of any other grinder. i could say it feels more like chopping chives with that cooking tool that is like stacked scissors. I dont know about how fast it takes to gank up with oils and resin but about clean up these guys impressed me again... They took out the blades (which is the grinding chamber also) they threw it in iso and stir a bit,after some minute he took it out wipe it with paper and then blast it with a torch lighter for like a sec to burn of any left iso and it was like new.

    I officially vouche for these guys. They have indeed the production set and the product is way better than it shows in the videos.
     
    Vapor_Eyes, vapen00b, NorVape and 2 others like this.
  24. vapen00b

    vapen00b various on-demand full convection units

    Messages:
    1,320
    Hey guys,

    just read about all this.
    @QB-GON Is there any news? Is it still possible to back your product? IGG seems to be down so I fear you had the same fate like DynaVap..? Color me interested - hope price matches quality and that this product will launch successfully. Please keep us posted! :)
     
  25. °k

    °k The sound of vapor

    Messages:
    541
    To sum it up, the campaign had gathered enough money to get things started (moving to a better workshop and getting the materials for one batch to fulfil the backers and their website orders. The campaign was over and things were confirmed to be in motion and then IGG refunded everybody their money...

    It can now be pre-ordered again from their website and with this code (QB10) it should be at the same price as during the campaign, I've reordered mine after IGG refunded me, and while it's not guaranteed I'll get it in October, I've been told they'll do their best to make it so.
     
    vapen00b likes this.

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