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My Lava fantasies

Discussion in 'Vapor Related Equipment' started by Egzoset, May 16, 2014.

  1. Egzoset

    Egzoset 1SipAToke Vaporist (v3.0)

    Messages:
    2,752
    Location:
    Shawinigan/Qc, Canada
    Salutations everybody,

    In retrospective it appears i didn't fully grasp what mister nr-cole meant a few years ago when he commented as quoted below:


    « ...it would be heated by sitting on the base. As long as it had been sitting there for thirty minutes to an hour you could pick it up, hit it, and put it back on the pad. Logs tend to stay hot for a couple hits even if you remove your power source... »

    Regretably i simply lacked having "log" vaporizer imagery in my own ritual background.

    Anyway a couple years later i still keep reminding this ancient thread once i a while:

    Really, doesn't that coaxial layout from my imaginary VapBong-like unit feel most appropriate for the purpose?!!

    E.G.: IMHO it just can't be wrong when fresh-air comes from an opening located right next to the mouthpiece!!

    As that's one sure way to check that it's staying clean... Isn't it?

    :nod:

    Next, i believe ceramic filter discs would replace the spiral item advantageously, as a result of the additional mass concentrated within a more compact structure:


    The solid orange bodies correspond to metal IH-compatible plates with their holes alternating position in order to promote heat echange, while the light fluffy-textured layers represent ceramic filters identical to those pictured in this stacked structure:

    [​IMG]

    Notice my metal bracing which supports a glass part (featured with 3 legs).

    Well, the ceramic filters are those porous dark discs we can see in the pile and they only measure 3 mm thick each. That's the heart of my present 3-Stones modded VG pipe, to be exact.

    ...

    So, what's the connection one might wonder?

    METAL: how about replacing aluminium with Demeyere's ControlInduc alloy?! [​IMG]

    Of course that would mean cutting through some expensive cookware but lets also consider that 1 single pan potentially contains many more support pieces, if necessary!...

    :D

    In any case, i'd first want to cut a 12 cm disc to explore my older fantasies that lead to LavaPit (the smaller tripod-shaped supports are for my LavaWand concept).

    LavaPit would be the "table" series and it would hide behind the stealthy look of a CD-ROM box during transport, LavaWand is intended for bi-energy compatibility and i believe it can be built with my modded VG pipe as the inspiration. The later may seem closer to implementation as i yet need to imagine a method capable of exploiting a disc-heater element efficiently, to generate hot air in some convection fashion...

    Since i already own an IH plate (and i know the LavaWand profile simply won't even allow detection by it) this could mean the LavaPit model (using 12 cm discs) probably has better chances of realisation at the moment. Not to mention i might be able to split its surface into 2 or even 3 different temperature sections, ultimately, to support additional features such as adjustable temperature (by mixing between 2 steady sources) and even integrated moisture conditioning!

    Ah those fantasies!!

    :peace:
     
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  2. Egzoset

    Egzoset 1SipAToke Vaporist (v3.0)

    Messages:
    2,752
    Location:
    Shawinigan/Qc, Canada
    ILLUSTRATION:



    [​IMG]
    Fire heat is from the top (bi-energy burane-compatible mode), the grey cage would where Curie-alloy metal can work its magic (in IH "butane-less" mode).

    Part of the heat would be captured early in order to warm-up the bowl...
     
  3. Caligula

    Caligula *results not typical.

    Messages:
    6,625
    Location:
    So Cal
    I like this lava table. Let me know when i can order one.
     
    syrupy likes this.
  4. syrupy

    syrupy reitcello - it's what's for breakfast

    Messages:
    1,462
    When you do, let me know how I can hook it up to my Nano.
     
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  5. Egzoset

    Egzoset 1SipAToke Vaporist (v3.0)

    Messages:
    2,752
    Location:
    Shawinigan/Qc, Canada
    Salutations Syrupy,

    Thanks for expressing your interest about Induction Heating applied to vaporizer design, Syrupy!!

    :D

    So, lets see what it can do for an EpicVape e-Nano, in principle (...):


    Well, most unfortunately i notice we loose the exceptionally convenient surface-contact of VaporGenie's Ceramic Filter pucks. With zero degree convolution i'd move away from my pipe-size LavaWand concept and try to adapt this configuration with my LavaPit (CD box profile) scenario in mind:

    [​IMG]

    Knowing how the HerbalAire is built i can safely gather this sort of IH conversion should work on it as well - and most likely many more actually.

    But that's a tall layout and chances are a more suitable horizontal solution exists which eluded me... Not to mention the neon light is gone...

    :peace:
     
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  6. Egzoset

    Egzoset 1SipAToke Vaporist (v3.0)

    Messages:
    2,752
    Location:
    Shawinigan/Qc, Canada
    Salutations,

    In terms of coil formats (flat vs cylindrical) the LavaPit model certainly seems the most affordable so i think of this one as of my economic "Walmart" scenario:


    Most unfortunately, money saved using an off-the-shelf IH cooker translates as the need for a 12 cm disc cut into the base of a 225+ $ piece of cookware (unless there's an alternate source for such special Curie alloys or a yet-to-emerge vaporizer manufacturer will manage with this himself, someday)...

    The LavaWand concept requires much less of the precious alloy, so here's my own favourite type of scenario:


    Or... This could be the alternate DIY-friendly "Walmart" scenario if power remains an issue:


    Overall, LavaPit would cost almost ~300 bucks just for a magnetic generator combined to its heater element (by far the most expensive part to get) while LavaWand with a dental IH tool would probably cost nearly the same but using much less metal, the Mini-Ductor and similar being reserved for sinful hobbyist luxury...

    Well, that's a preliminary evaluation only. In any case it shows that if you're not a manufacturer then such venture may be difficult to justify, yet i'm still confident there's something nice to do with all this!

    :peace:
     
    Last edited: May 24, 2014
    Caligula likes this.
  7. Egzoset

    Egzoset 1SipAToke Vaporist (v3.0)

    Messages:
    2,752
    Location:
    Shawinigan/Qc, Canada
    Salutations everyone,

    Guess what, maybe there are other ways than to fashion a pile of glass sheets:

    ...or cut pieces into frypans, out of frenzy (!...):

    ...and then bend the resulting metal stripes in order to build some heat-exchanger structure that looks similar to this:

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    ...

    Here comes 3D material "printing"!! [​IMG]

    At the moment only ceramics can be considered relatively safe for our favourite cannabic application but such high-tech process is bound to evolve and then lead to surprizing potential capabilites in a future most of us can hope to live through, or at least witness its origins! So i'm cordially inviting the reader to follow this exciting new thread:


    It's really mind-boggling despite the present limitations, for example what i've learned there appears to provide a solution to my LavaPit problem: it seems i just need to create the right 3D designer-file and a company will cast ceramic to these specifications! Which means to me it's now a viable idea to implement aerial channels of which the main purpose is to elongate transit, so air has more time to thermalize while it circulates above a hot 12 cm Curie-ally disc (from 3rd-party source)... Instead of tiny metal spheres contained inside glass tubular arms (as in 2010) i'd now try to imagine a simple ceramic plate embossed in a similar multi-spiral patern, with a hole at the center to collect hot air into a GonG junction, or to deliver it directly to some crucible bowl, whatever. I haven't evaluated the suggested free software yet (Blender, FreeCAD, Open SCAD) but this might prove fun eventually, one way or another since i'd like a better drawing tool than MSPaint anyway! Not to mention these are also Linux-friendly.

    Ain't that good news, Caligula!! [​IMG]

    In short there's quite a seducing alternative to traditional glass-blowing artisans, etc., that has emerged lately and this stimulating 3D thread happens to offer some fresh perspective over this recent reality.

    :peace:
     
    Caligula likes this.
  8. Egzoset

    Egzoset 1SipAToke Vaporist (v3.0)

    Messages:
    2,752
    Location:
    Shawinigan/Qc, Canada
    UPDATE



    Some recent modularity-promoting ideas expressed graphically:

    [​IMG]

    :peace:
     
  9. Egzoset

    Egzoset 1SipAToke Vaporist (v3.0)

    Messages:
    2,752
    Location:
    Shawinigan/Qc, Canada
    Hummm...

    Of course, UFOs!!!

    [​IMG]

    Why couldn't i think of that before! [​IMG]

    It should work fine using 2 instead of only 1 thermostatic (IH) frypan: the top unit simply requires some moddifications to provide plenty of heated air to a cannabic bowl i presume, though at least i know this would cost twice as much, euh...

    :peace:
     
  10. Egzoset

    Egzoset 1SipAToke Vaporist (v3.0)

    Messages:
    2,752
    Location:
    Shawinigan/Qc, Canada
    Salutations everybody,

    My goodness, what a party vape this would be! Probably enough to feed a whole regiment of zombie stoners...

    Euh... But wait!! [​IMG]

    This sort of extravaganza format has evoked an idea which i feel will sound more constructive: printer heads. They don't heat up a group of ink bottles collectively only to eject a single drop, do they?

    Of course not, instead all that is actually required is a tiny vaporization cell so small many of those can be packed together, conveniently, on a single printer head. M'well, that's vaguely what it said the last time i read on such a particular subject anyway.

    [​IMG]

    The fact remains that printer manufacturers do choose to micro-(if not nano)-manage ink on demand - going bulk as we practically all do hardly appears to appeal to them. So, this naturally inspired a question relatively to this concept-demo from the Evoke team:


    Not much hey?... Hummm...

    [​IMG]

    So...

    How little cannabis should be required (at least theoretically) to generate decent puffs ON DEMAND and how little energy shall suffice to vaporize it within some convenient/appropriate period of time?

    In addition, in the same spirit... Wouldn't that make good sense should e-Cigs happen to be the 1st vaporizers that can run on induction some day? That niche already deals with limited resources after all!

    [​IMG]

    In short why not vaporize the goodies on demand, printer-head style?

    Now lets check what we learned from the Evoke team so far:

    « I want to see a vaporizer or a platform that work with concentrates, e-liquids and loose leaf. »
    « Not too hot, not too cold. Just right. »
    « A smart chip is embeded to maintain accurate heating,
    this allows us to provide you with an array of other smart features. »


    FC: Loto Labs Evoke (2014-Jun-17)

    « Accurate adjustable heat settings from 280 °F to nail temperatures »
    « Foolproof design that won't overheat and possibly burn »

    The least we can say is that this looks like an audacious proposal!... [​IMG]

    Not to mention there's so much more waiting to be seen.

    Of course it's only the begining of an adventure, i don't know how many batteries will energize the Evoke nor do i recall reading about electrical capacity, etc. That may be important as i figure this would determine a maximum vegetal weight (volume) in turn affecting bowl size then frequency then PC-Board footprint for a tank-capacitor, etc.

    :2c:

    It seems to me at this present moment that if the "1st Smart Vaporizer" is really going to be induction-drived then perhaps it might pay to search inspiration in the printer world pronto!... And then possibly adapt productive findings so these can be applied to this:

    That type of IH unit costs less than a hundred dollars on e-Bay, now imagine if the IH vaporizer doesn't contain any electronics and it will fit in there. One could wonder about the gain in space i think! Maybe part of the generator's IH field might even power a secondary coil to feed electrical power directly into some primitive engine capable of injecting tiny cannabic "doses" inside some hypothetical IH vaporization nozzle-head...

    Whatever! :D

    I mean, does it have to use 26 Watts or it can be tweaked further?

    Because once a value is established as the absolute floor more inspiration is likely to emerge and then ultimately result in even more suggestion ideas, not to mention that i fear we may actually need to built it ourselves.

    Good day, have fun!

    :peace:
     
  11. Egzoset

    Egzoset 1SipAToke Vaporist (v3.0)

    Messages:
    2,752
    Location:
    Shawinigan/Qc, Canada
    Salutations everybody,

    The last wave of relative Induction Heat enthousiasm has decayed and i finaly managed to collect numbers in an effort to figure out what the "Lava" concept should be like if implemented using a prototyping platform as the VaporGenie shown below, after significant moddifications:
    Take note the sphere from above was cut to shorten it's front heat-collection funnel... The reason for this was early extinction of my jet flame, so i gave it more air, though a 1 mm (or so) error wouldn't have impaired it i suspect. But the original length was no option, that long tunnel had to go it seems or it would have felt less convenient when switching ligters, between soft yellow "candle" and jet blue "torch" or vice-versa, precisely. The shortened space separating my sphere's 2 metal funnel sections was a necessary step, i gambled that should i ever let myself inspired by the VapMan then perhaps this might show me where to aim next. In the end that last strategy paid tenfold because my venture is an evident success for all i know!

    :science:

    Here's a closer view on the "PinHole", it was slightly stuffed with a tiny amount of cotton to adjust flow restriction. This adapted form of outlet self-conditioning combined to inlet self-moisturizing results in a toke which provides me quite some enjoyable appreciative sessions, not to mention it's not as when i used to drink a sip of water before/after every single time... In conclusion this fills the bill for me, now i wish i could substitute metal parts with Curie alloys and toy around with the very 1st "Bi-Energy" IH vaporizer, where "B" in "Plan-B" stands for "Butane", of course:

    Hummm...

    Bi-energy hey?... [​IMG]

    I'm thinking all the sudden, if it were to ever become a project duplicated elsewhere then i'd expect the testers will prefer their transitions between "Plan-A" (magnetic induction) vs "Plan-B" (fire) to require as little adaptation as possible while still being sufficiently convenient.

    Here's what "Plan-B" was like in terms of timing after 3 evaluations in my veranda, under the sun of September and even using a different lighter, for the sake of curiosity i guess:

    • 3~4 Sec. Pre-heat to store enough energy into hybrid core
    • 3 Sec. final heating until Vaporisation hints (flow opacity)
    • 2 Sec. deep Inhalation once the jet-flamme is Removed
    • 6~8 Sec. Appreciation time and expiration

    :D

    PVIA... :hmm: As in Pre-Heat (3½ Sec.) then apply more aspiration force to cause Vaporisation (3 Sec.) followed by a "bottleneck" effect apparently linked to having increased flow-resistance in presence of cannabic vapor in the hot air stream, etc. That's when Inhalation (2 Sec.) can really start and then Appreciation (7 Sec.) shall begin!...

    :leaf:

    Total potential cannabic inhalation time being as long as 5 seconds it's plenty for a generous toke, i could say that.

    So, what does it mean if "Plan-B" happens to require fire-heating that never lasts as much as 10 Sec.?

    Euh...

    Lets see. If IH vaporization can equal the power of fire then i figure 1 IH heat sequence shouldn't last much more than while using a butane lighter to pre-heat then vaporize. Because experiencing that "Bi-Energy" pipe shouldn't feel too different between mode transisitons: it's got to feel obviously natural and a noticeable transition wouldn't feel natural i presume.

    Too bad i simply can't tell for sure, because i've lost my newbie-radar abilities by climbing the learning-curve associated to my modded VG pipe as it is today. E.G. a major chalenge of the past may only need minimal time & effort once training is over, etc., etc. Even if i were made amnesic chances are the 1st time will remain unique forever, the day after it's just not the same ever again... The new perspectives become history, whatever, etc. Etcetera!

    Which for me resonates like a signal.

    :peace:
     
    Last edited: Sep 19, 2014 at 6:20 PM

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