1. What does SSTB mean? See our glossary of acronyms.

Log Style Vapes

Discussion in 'Vaporization Discussion' started by Alan, Jan 10, 2011.

  1. lwien

    lwien Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    11,577
    Location:
    Arcadia, California
    But he didn't show how his unit worked. He showed how a Purple Days worked. Sorry guys, but that is tacky, to say the least.

    No different than when the Woodeez first came out and the picture on the site was not a Woodez but a Purple Days taken directly from the Purple Day's site. That was equally as tacky.

    He also states, "It is functionally more like the purple days. but without the 3 month order process, this is ready now!" Since when was the wait period 3 months on the PD? What the hell?

    TV, you got some explainin' to do.
     
  2. caseball2051

    caseball2051 Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    749
    "This is not like the volcano bag style or the silver surfer or hot box with a whip.
    It is functionally more like the purple days. but without the 3 month order process, this is ready now!

    As seen here
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CsA8mOF-dQA&feature=\"

    he states that it is like the purple days, "as seen here".

    and there was a time where the wait was nearly 3 months. not everyone is as informed on the wait time. I assumed it was still a wait that long because I dont follow the PD.

    not sticking up for him but I don't see anything wrong with that ad worth being upset about. If you really want to pick it apart then I guess he could have researched the wait time and worded it better.
     
  3. lwien

    lwien Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    11,577
    Location:
    Arcadia, California
    Guess it's just because of my marketing background, but that ad, and that's what it is, to my mind, is bogus on a few different levels.

    If you're going to introduce a new product, and if you have faith in that product, then let it stand on it's own.
    Coming up with a bogus wait time on a competing product and using that bogus wait time as a benefit as to why his is better, and then using a demo video of another vape rather than making his own with his own vape, to me, deserves to be picked apart.

    When I first saw this design here, I gave it compliments and I still think it's purty........but these kinds of marketing tactics causes a loss of credibility the way I see it. How in the hell can you sell a vape without showing how it works, and using someone else's vape to show how his vape works doesn't cut it.
     
  4. Alan

    Alan Master JedHI Manufacturer

    Messages:
    883
    A friend of mine in Denver was testing the market in Denver for me. He didn't get a chance to make a video of the Toasty Top in action before the Medical Cannabis Cup so he showed a similar unit since many people have never seen such a device. I agree that a video of the Toasty Top in action would have been better. I will get a video of a Toasty Top in action when I get a chance.

    I wasn't quite ready to roll the top it out to the world. My friend was just helping me out. His choice of words on the add probably could have been better. I didn't really have any input. If I had been trying to sell them, I would have provided the link. Need to have a chat with the moderators before thinking about advertising here.
     
    ogcook likes this.
  5. hereatlast

    hereatlast Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    1,100
    I'm definitely disheartened to see that link provided as such as well. Perhaps its just a misinterpretation or typo but it doesn't seem that way to me. Especially with opening lines like "I would not make a PD clone. That has already been done. It would be totally unique with the following additional features..." its a little weird to see that suspiciously placed PD link.

    All that said, its not clear that its the manufacturer/TV selling that unit on craigslist. Would definitely love TV to shed some light on this.

    EDIT: missed TV's post. Thanks for the explanation. Would love to see a video.
     
  6. lwien

    lwien Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    11,577
    Location:
    Arcadia, California
    Better? The way I see it, it should have been mandatory, ESPECIALLY being that you are using a video of a competitors product and then using that product to sell against it by stating a wait time that isn't true.

    Edit: Just saw your edit, TV. So you're friend is helping you sell your product and you didn't have any input as to how your product was going to be presented? Ummmm..............bad idea.
     
  7. Rick

    Rick Zapman

    Messages:
    1,216
    Location:
    Pacific Northwest
    Since I make a log style vape, I am going to comment, very shortly. If I get in trouble, so be it.
    The design looks very unhandy. You need that little stand to put it anywhere? I thought tops were for spinning.
    The insulating material in the plug, which is soldered directly to the heater, will probably melt very soon since it is so close to the heater.
    The wood will not last long with all that heat and so little wood.
    Just my opinion based on making log vapes for over ten years now.
    I also agree with lwein on most points regarding marketing.
    Saying that, I hope you sell plenty of them. Competition has always helped us over the years.
     
  8. Alan

    Alan Master JedHI Manufacturer

    Messages:
    883
    No trouble at all Rick. I was hope you get to see my creation in person some day. You are one of the main reasons it exists. Aromazap / Myrtlezap advanced the original concept. I wanted to advance it some more.

    Sometimes not knowing that something can't be done helps to discover new ways of doing things. I was very concerned in the beginning about the plug getting too hot and melting the plastic insulator. I thought that is why it had never been done before. The temperature of the conductor at the ceramic heating element is indeed hot enough to melt solder. The temperature drops quickly as you move away from the heater. It is not too hot by the time it connects to the power plug. The center wire is also thermally and electrically insulated with glass beads. Mine has been running 24/7 since November of last year. I was pleasantly surprised that the power plug does not over heat. I did place a wooden button over the metal so there is no chance of accidentally touching the hot metal.

    I am an avid wood turner and have learned a few things about wood (mostly the hard way). I mostly make tops. A top shaped herbal roaster just seemed the natural thing to do. I wanted it to be truly useful for other things too. Stealth was an important design parameter. Safety is very important. The basic design of log style vapes is very solid, so I feel pretty comfortable with this design. A friend of mine fell asleep with their Toasty Top beside them on the couch. It did not get too hot. I imagine the other log style vapes are safe that way too. I remember reading about someone leaving one upside down in a pillow without combusting? I was sold on the concept anyhow. Hopefully, the top will spend most of its time in someone's hands and not on the stand.

    I have only used maple wood so far. I wanted to use a type of wood that is used in smoking meat. Something very hard that would stand up to continuous exposure to high temperatures. I have not had one running for several years as the other creators, but I'm confident the wood should hold up at least as well and hopefully better. I tried to make the diameter of wood surrounding the heat sink to be about 2.5". It has been suggested I make a stand with a power plug built in. The plug is the support. Still working on that one.

    I'm better at wood turning than marketing, but I'm learning.

    If you put a tip in the power plug, they will spin.

    Edit: My friend told me he removed the CL add with the PD video link. He also told me he had shot a video using the Toasty Top this morning. Toasty Top The roasting tube he is using has a wooden mouthpiece.
     
    ogcook likes this.
  9. Rick

    Rick Zapman

    Messages:
    1,216
    Location:
    Pacific Northwest
    TV
    Nice reply. Looks like you have covered some bases well.
    Here are some tips for the top guy from the old log vape guy:

    With the help of the mods, start your own thread here on FC.

    Allow people to buy your product easily through a website. The personal connection is cool but people want to click and buy.

    Have some inventory ahead and be prepared to keep up with some extra demand if it happens. Fairly rapid delivery is an important marketing tool in todays world.

    Be prepared for a problem or two with a customer service response from you that blows folks away, positively. You can actually gain from mistakes if you handle them well.

    Always be positive on this and any other forum.

    Now the product:
    Make it handy. maybe recess the plug and flare the bottom so it will easily stand upright. You could use a right angle plug on the transformer.
    These things get set down all the time anywhere. Your design does not allow that without the stand.
    The wood calculation(diameter) is for a straight log, over 4 inches in length. That is more wood than you have? I dunno
    Figure a fair price and put it out there(the price for the package). Build some decent profit in or you will not be happy if you have to make them over and over.

    In conclusion, I really wish you success. Do it serious or do not do it. If you have had one or more running as long as you say, you have enough test time in to get them out there.
    The log vape business is a serious business. There will be demand if you make it happen but do it right. Your marketing did not get off super well here but you can make up for that if you want to.
    This will also take serious time from your schedule. Do not delegate at first(as with your buddy).
    nuff for now. Your name is cool and the insulating, stainless and other attention to detail are to be commended.
    Grab dem balls and go for it!
     
  10. Vamp

    Vamp Active Member

    Messages:
    12
    xxx://denver.craigslist.org/hab/2317764959.html

    Modnote: Please review the forum rules.
    • No selling or soliciting items on the forum. Exception for selling here and only here, but read the thread rules.
      • This thread is the only one on the forum where you can make any mention of items you may have for sale.[/*]
      • Do not use a listing here to direct members to an eBay or other auction.[/*]
      [/*]
     
  11. Alan

    Alan Master JedHI Manufacturer

    Messages:
    883
    Rick - Thanks for the suggestions, compliments and encouragement. Hope we can make more people happy with our creations.

    Just need to finish up one last big project. Then....
     
    ogcook likes this.
  12. Vapemania-original

    Vapemania-original New Member

    Messages:
    105
    Location:
    UK
    I can't possibly compare to Rick's brilliant advice, but i was thinking from a customer POV.

    I was thinking everytime I put the device down, I need to look for the stand (like Rick said).
    Surely, thats gonna be difficult for someone high on weed.

    Then I thought, what if there was no stand?
    Then all the cost for making the stands can go into improving the design of the device.

    Originally we had the Bud Toaster (which is only a concept model, really). Now we have the Toasty Top.
    It makes me look forward to breakfast, not prepare myself for an evening of smoking illicit ganja.
    Would names associated with herb be a good idea? Pot Smoker, Herb Pot, Dizzy Drop or Tear Drop, but not 'toast' unless it is actually a ganja term.

    I see the device as two things: shape and internal workings or 'module'.
    Can the internal workings be placed into a different shape?
    A shape which is universally recognised as something you draw from.
    For example a coffee/milkshake carton, a pilsner bottle (sorry WZ), a coke can (sorry PD, MZ).
    Or some crazy-shaped but instantly recognisable vase shape (like SSV or 'Cano).

    In my view, all the table top vaporisers are too small.
    Theres something rather disappointing to see how dinky they are.
    I have a vase which is 10inch height and 5inch diameter.
    Now, thats what I'm talking about.

    I expect that will be costly.

    But If I had a patented heating module which consistently and efficiently vapes herb (like a log vape), then I'd put it into a bloody mobile phone, anything, as long as it sells like hotcakes.
     
  13. Hippie Dickie

    Hippie Dickie The Herbal Cube Manufacturer

    Messages:
    2,027
    Location:
    where the Cube rules!
    well, it may not be a commercial product yet, but it is more than a concept. i have 4 working units and i'm making a dozen more.
     
  14. Vapemania-original

    Vapemania-original New Member

    Messages:
    105
    Location:
    UK
    Lol!!!

    Good point, Hippie.
    Apologies for my error.

    If I remember correctly, there will be 1000 Bud Toasters produced.
    Each selling at $500.
    Generating a turnover of half a million dollars.

    After this, you will continue with your full time job.
    There will be no further units produced.
     
  15. Hippie Dickie

    Hippie Dickie The Herbal Cube Manufacturer

    Messages:
    2,027
    Location:
    where the Cube rules!
    it's a bit more nuanced than that ...

    the total retail value might be half a million dollars, but my cut of that will be much, much less. i've been doing retail for 40 years, i know of what i speak.

    i am continuing with my full time (and a half) job all the time. this is why progress on the Bud Toaster is so slow right now -- who could have known the economy would recover?

    i think 1000 units of a piece of art is enough. i've already got ideas for the next model which will leverage the newest technology in batteries and electronics.
     
  16. Alan

    Alan Master JedHI Manufacturer

    Messages:
    883
    It should work in about any shape. Maybe a rocket ship like Egzoset's avatar. It would have a built-in stand. The nose cone could be removable or hinged to access the heat port. You could really get blasted that way.

    Keep asking those questions guys.

    Thanks
     
    ogcook likes this.
  17. Vapemania-original

    Vapemania-original New Member

    Messages:
    105
    Location:
    UK
    The Rocket!!!

    I think thats it!!

    Maybe the Ares I or Ares V rocket (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ares_V).

    Alternatively, you could patent the inner workings and arrange for a number of companies to design and make the exterior.

    Anyway, have you thought of a pepsi challenge for your vaporiser?

    You could blind-fold a few friends and get them to toke on a SSV, WZ or MZ, HA, EQ and your device.
    Then you can guage what you have.

    You could even do a youtube vid of it.

    Don't worry though, you can always have a secret signal so everyone chooses your vaporiser as the best one!!!
     
  18. Vamp

    Vamp Active Member

    Messages:
    12
    The top shape has been used before with regards to smoking. Top was a fairly iconic tobacco brand. Perhaps people would see a top and associate it with smoking?

    [​IMG]
     
  19. Alan

    Alan Master JedHI Manufacturer

    Messages:
    883
    Maybe Top Tobacco will want them for roasting tobacco?
     
    ogcook likes this.
  20. guardian

    guardian Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    70
    Location:
    underwater
    beat to it lol, my dad has smoked specifically top tobacco for almost half his life and still does,out working today probly smoked like 6 cigarretes :( it kills me though because i dont have any vapes i care to put tobbaco in, so i was hoping to get a log vape soon so he could use it as well, plus the top would be very iconic in helping him feel comfortable using it, but $200 is way to much so im considering a woodeez atm, any chance in the price going down some from your denver friend? or can i get one directly from you TV? plus i need atleast 2 roasting tubes with the package one for me one for him, most log vapes come with 3 bowls... :2c:
     
  21. hereatlast

    hereatlast Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    1,100
    Can you expand a little on why you feel this way? What's dinky about the models you listed I'm not sure of...my PD is small but pretty damn solid. Further, what's inherently better about a larger model for you? I don't see how making a vaporizer larger in this way benefits anything but personal preference?


    I'm sorry if this is derailing the thread but it sounds like TV is open to dialogue concerning possibilities and ideas for future vaporizers.
     
  22. Vapemania-original

    Vapemania-original New Member

    Messages:
    105
    Location:
    UK
    Guardian, please let us know if you find out whether WZ is a viable option.
    I've been wanting a WZ for a while now.
    Given your terrible predicament, and the fact that 420 is looming, I don't imagine there is any chance of you getting a Toasty Top, for free. Although if you reviewed it, I suppose many of us would be very enthusiastic about the product.

    Hereatlast. Love the name.
    Think of every item in your house which has a PA.
    Is there anything smaller than a log vape?

    I'm just used to having larger, more substantial electronic products around the house.
    My landline telephone is the only thing smaller. Barely.

    Essentially, a portable vape should be smaller than an Iphone.

    A table top should be the size of a small vase.
    If it sits on my table, I want it to take pride of place.

    Maybe Volcano decided the dimensions.
    But I wonder what the best dimensions are for a vaporiser these days. The 'Cano was sold from the 90s wasn't it?
     
  23. Ed's TnT

    Ed's TnT Woodsman Manufacturer

    Messages:
    2,045
    I have been looking at this for a while here and there, it will probably do well. When you see it on its side, it kinda looks like a shell, like a conch. You have great skills TV, I wish you luck with this!
     
    ogcook likes this.
  24. Alan

    Alan Master JedHI Manufacturer

    Messages:
    883
    Thanks Ed. I'm making some wood handles for my roasting tubes that I think you will enjoy seeing. 3/8" OD, 15/64" ID and 3" long.

    I am very close to launch now.
     
    ogcook likes this.
  25. Ed's TnT

    Ed's TnT Woodsman Manufacturer

    Messages:
    2,045
    Oh I am interested, I like your work, wanna see more and wish you much success with it, I know its gotta be alota fun right now putting it all together, I bet your anxious to make this work. good luck and pls let me know if I can help bro!!!
     

Support FC, visit our trusted friends and sponsors