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Tek Home Rosin Presses under $750 - School Me

Discussion in 'Concentrates' started by OldOyler, Dec 6, 2016.

  1. OldOyler

    OldOyler Fire it again. I can still find the ground.

    Messages:
    545
    Location:
    The War Room
    Peace everyone!

    I know our DIY rosin press thread is getting huge, and I was thinking that now that rosin is clearly here to stay, a lot of folks aren't technical like myself and need an "off-the-shelf" rosin press solution to press our flowers.

    I had actually been asking a lot in pm, and regularly heard the drumbeat phrase in almost Soylent Green panic:

    "Re-furbished t-shirt presses, they're all re-furbished teeee shiiiirt presses!"

    But I don't think that's *necessarily* the case any more.

    So let me kick off with one that someone turned me on to (peace out, turk!) that I really like for $300. It's the HIgh5 manual rosin press, $300.

    http://www.highfivevape.com/products/HIGH5_Manual_Rosin_Press_V2

    (My usual disclaimer - not a shill, don't get kickbacks, or any of that kind of sketchy stuff that you can take RIGHT out the door around me!)

    Okay:

    An extra $38 and you get a flat coil heater for an enail, they sell enails as well. (Yell at me if you will, I am putting a SIC HALO on mine if I order it here soon, slim series runs on a flat coil heater - but watch it, that will probably void your DNail warranty coverage of the nail).

    Most importantly, I need to get off solvents. I have always done QWET, mildly work intensive and Everclear isn't cheap.

    I had initially considered capping the amount stated in the thread title at $500, but I felt we should have some wiggle room. What I think is reasonably priced versus someone else, etc.

    What I am looking for is this: I put weed in (pucked first is fine), push a button or pull a lever, and BING - rosin in the wrapper.

    So...if a wire needs to be hooked on something, or a casing taken off, that's not what I was shooting for here. :)

    I won't attempt to moderate anything, just wanted a place to discuss this particular slice of the rosin community, give an easy place for new folks (or lurkers) to see what works with these and what's a sham, and to help clear the DIY rosin thread a bit - those folks have *really* run the gauntlet for our precious rosin!

    Peace and good pressing, everyone!

    :peace:
     
    killick, GreenHopper and Caelar900 like this.
  2. Caelar900

    Caelar900 Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    126
    So the problem with all the sub $2000 production presses I've seen so far is they just don't produce enough pressure... That does't mean that this will always be the case but at this stage in the game any rosin press worth its shit is still "some assembly required".

    Also not a shill but my recommendation and current setup is listed below:

    All of this should come out to in around your desired price and is not skimping in any way. This press will deliver an estimated 6666 psi with the included pre press mold and 2666 psi if using the entire plate area available. This falls directly in your "perfect" squish pressure range and allows for a range in amount of used material. All parts are well made and have good customer feedback, except for maybe harbor freight but there nothing you can do there.... This was my third rosin build after a hair straightener and clamps, a 12 ton harbor freight and Joel W. plates from here on FC and this is by far the most ideal. It won't take you more than 30 minutes to set up and costs thousand less than the competition for near the same level of quality.

    Hope this could be of some help and happy squishing!
     
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  3. herbivore21

    herbivore21 Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    3,621
    This thread is a great idea brother. I think we would greatly benefit from having separate threads for DIY rosin vs ready-made presses.

    One thing I'll point out is that your SiC halo ain't going to be warranty voided using another flat coil. This is because SiC is much much stronger than quartz and sapphire (where a non-dnail different sized/thickness/diameter coil may void the warranty because expansion can lead to breakage with these more fragile materials).
     
  4. OldOyler

    OldOyler Fire it again. I can still find the ground.

    Messages:
    545
    Location:
    The War Room
    Caelar and hb,

    I'll just say - *that's* what the f*#k what I'm talkin' about.

    :tup:

    Thank you!

    Peace everyone.
     
  5. herbivore21

    herbivore21 Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    3,621
    Oldoyler actually only runs a quarter ounce at a time for QWET generally, he just doesn't need more pressure than a 1 ton vise can give him (I can personally vouch for this setup being ideal for small-scale personal squishing - especially for those with limited space). The high-five press will give him that much pressure and bigger plates would be moot since there isn't enough pressure for larger scale squishes (which really are inappropriate for Oldoyler's case).

    However, almost all of the other sub-$2k setups are as you describe - that I will completely concede ;)
     
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  6. OldOyler

    OldOyler Fire it again. I can still find the ground.

    Messages:
    545
    Location:
    The War Room
    I just checked all that out in detail and I don't blow smoke - sweet setup there C!

    And I think "some assembly required" falls within what I was hoping would get presented and discussed here - which you nailed out of the chute, hb too, seriously happy over here.

    Peace!
     
    Caelar900 likes this.
  7. Caelar900

    Caelar900 Well-Known Member

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    126
    Not to mention at this point the DIY thread is pretty dense. If this thread could try to sum up some of that in the next five pages or so and let everyone know a good place to jump in as of now\ I think it could be great :)

    Thanks man took a little trial and error to get to where it is now but I think its pretty great, If I get a chance at some point here maybe I'll take mine apart and do a little picture tutorial when I put it back together!

    Now here is a discussion that I have been waiting to have! I'm not sure that's true... Right now the only High5 Press available on the site is one fitted with 2.5x2.5 plates, with a one ton arbor quick head math says that should be around 300 psi. I reckon that this is no where near enough pressure for an effective squish...

    Now I'll say that you probably aren't going to be using the full surface area of the plate. But even if you squish a 1 gram-ish nug in there, which usually correlates to about a 1 and a half inch puck for me, thats still only 1129 psi... And I reckon from my testing that you need at least ~2500-3000psi for an effective squish.

    I have looked high and low and never found a consensus on this though so would love to hear your take ;)
     
    Last edited: Dec 6, 2016
  8. herbivore21

    herbivore21 Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    3,621
    This is a great discussion point brother, happy to shoot the shit with you about it :)

    Back when I made much rosin (you probably know I'm a full-melt only guy these days), I used a vise based press. 2000 psi maximum pressure with 2 inch round plates. I could reliably do small squishes (.3-1g at a time) and get all of the goods out in 2-3 squishes).

    One issue with your calculations which leads to your understanding that the high five press doesn't get enough pressure is that you are working with the dimensions of the plates for calculating surface area of the squish. Actually, you should be working with the surface area of your nug to calculate psi, not the plates (I believe the best way to calculate is from the surface area of the puck after being squished). When we do this, we can see that if you squish a smaller amount of nug at a time, less pressure does the job efficiently.

    I don't tend to press more than .5g (more if you pre-puck, I don't) at a time in a press maxing out at ~1 ton of pressure - this works as well as larger presses with larger amounts, the difference is just the amount of raw material you can squish at a time. The additional pressure ends up being required when you try to put more flower into the press at once, because you increase the surface area that your limited pressure is being applied to :2c:
     
    Last edited: Dec 6, 2016
  9. Caelar900

    Caelar900 Well-Known Member

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    126
    :p
    Yeah, I don't know maybe it's just a preferential thing but I had used some 2" round Joel W. Plates (May they rest in peace :rip: and hopefully rise again some day :zombie:) which even when using the entire surface area, which I became pretty good at doing, had 7643psi available. This was too much pressure, I ripped parchment, caused rosin to leak through the parchment, broke the insulation wood, and eventually warped the plates; generally just messed things up. I found an ideal number to be around 6000, before things start going wrong, but still getting pretty much everything out in a single squish.

    The key to rosin seems to be getting it out of the plant and away from the heat as quickly as possible, and the best way to do this is with pressure, the true question is at what psi does return begin to diminish. My answer is 3000psi but I have had a lot of people tell me I'm crazy...
     
  10. herbivore21

    herbivore21 Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    3,621
    If we consider an average .5g of cannabis squished into a mostly round puck has an approximate diameter of 1 inch, we can say that this equals roughly 0.78539816339745 square inches. We'll round that to .79 square inches to save our brains all those extraneous digits lol.

    I apply as much pressure my vise can possibly exert onto my puck - nominally 2000 pounds of pressure. As such, the approximate pressure I am requiring to achieve full extraction (as compared with the yields I get using solvents with the same material) is roughly 2420psi. I use temps between 170-230 (230 is my hard maximum temp and I never need to exceed it and notice lesser quality when I do with no yield gains). Your estimated requirement of psi is not actually far off my findings ;) (which remember are approximate since we are working with the understanding that fully tightening the vise is applying the nominal pressure - strictly speaking, a gauge should be used to confirm this).

    BTW, I've never had my vise break the wooden insulators and I do not experience broken parchment issues at these pressure levels.
     
    Last edited: Dec 6, 2016
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  11. GreenHopper

    GreenHopper Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    119
    Just happened to be perusing www.vapefiend.co.uk and saw this:

    Pressie Heat Press

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    Was thinking, hey that seems like quite a neat solution for the UK market (we don't have a huge selection over here).

    It's £499 which was a bit pricey but thought I'd post it anyway as it fits the topic.

    However after reading the discussion between @herbivore21 and @Caelar900 I'm guessing the 1000-1500psi is just not enough to get the job done.
     
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  12. OldOyler

    OldOyler Fire it again. I can still find the ground.

    Messages:
    545
    Location:
    The War Room
    My thinking too gh, just waiting for the experts to finish filling in the blanks.

    I am going to do some more extensive searches online this weekend - I can't whine that we don't know, and need to know, and not get my arse out there and put some stuff in front of them to consider. I'll just try to find ones that fit our minimums.

    All I can think to check is pressure, plates size, temperature.

    Heck not even 100% what mix of those I should necessarily consider, but I'll try for some educated guesses. Yeah greenhopper I need to get something figured out too, and I'm glad not to be wandering around looking by myself. These guys are good.

    :tup:

    Peace!
     
    GreenHopper likes this.
  13. herbivore21

    herbivore21 Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    3,621
    I'd be wanting to see it in operation before purchasing something like that. That is pretty light on pressure and a home made vise/straightener rig will give you more pressure. Pneumatic equipment is generally loud to operate too, who wants to run a noisey compressor if they're not even getting better performance than a vise? lol

    On the basis of the components and design/manufacture costs, the price of the unit is not necessarily unreasonable/unjustified - the unit is just not necessarily adequate for the job, which is of course a much more significant problem though!

    Of course, being in prohibition UK, it will probably not be possible to see one in action until someone takes the gamble and buys/tries one. It isn't like the vapefiend are going to be able to give people advertising material that shows the unit being used for rosin!

    BTW I need to be very clear that if they calculated the PSI based off of the surface area of the plates, then this press should have no problems getting enough pressure to squish up to about 1g at a time.
     
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  14. GreenHopper

    GreenHopper Well-Known Member

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    119
    I've been reading the threads on 'School Me On Making Bubble' as well as the 'Rosin Technique....Easy DIY Solventless', you guys have been fascinating and hugely educating. I totally agree with @OldOyler you have knowledge and experience so I read what you say, then I read it again. Sometimes I have to read it a third time as I forgot what I was doing. Can't think of what causes that ;)

    I can't make my mind up on if I should go for Rosin, Dry Sift or Bubble hash. Well I say that but this week I'm thinking I'd start with the one I'm most likely going to have success with and Rosin seems fairly straightforward.

    Not sure I'm quite ready to invest £500 in a press just yet though.

    That's actually doable for me, I think vapefiend is about 1.5 hours by car for my place.

    @VapeFiend.com does do a lot of YouTube vids of the gear they sell so they might chuck up a demo vid? Maybe? If I subtlty include them in this post :brow:
     
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  15. Caelar900

    Caelar900 Well-Known Member

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    @herbivore21 Okay, so I think we can both agree then that 2500 would probably be a good bottom end to use as reference ;) When I put together my first press I thought Joel's plates where going to be 3 inches and I was doing the maths wrong as well... Ended up with wayyyy too much but left a lot of room for experimentation!

    @OldOyler I've looked before and I'll take another quick look because I don't have much better to do but the cheapest I've found that seemed at all expectable was 2300? I think I talked them down to 1750... Which when I can build it for 1000 less I just can't justify it.

    @GreenHopper Yeah, I don't think so... If you can give the pressie a try at some point or check it out first please do and report back, always like more data! As far as different extraction methods go, if its something that your not going to want to throw a lot of product at right away rosin might be the way to go. Bubble was an expensive learner for me and dry is only good if your growing really...
     
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  16. herbivore21

    herbivore21 Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    3,621
    Thank you for the kind words, my friend!

    Not to single you out, but given that you mention the cost of rosin press being too much and suggest you are also considering making bubble and dry sift; I need to hammer home some realities of solventless concentrate processing that I frequently see people ignoring at their own financial risk:

    Rosin tek is much, much easier to learn than bubble and dry sift. Rosin tek can be done with a very small amount of starting material (as little as .5g). It is very hard to get bad results so long as you get a press with the right temps and pressure. The size of the plates beyond 2 square inches is irrelevant if you are not getting a bigger hydraulic/pneumatic press or similar which are much more expensive.

    Bubble really requires a few ounces to be worth the effort since you can only expect a maximum 5-10% yield - and 10% will only ever come from the absolute best flowers out there (I'm talking top shelf cali flower quality - flowers this good may or may not exist in the UK at all!). Bubble tek involves a lot of physical labor; it is much more time consuming than rosin and solvent extractions and if you don't do it right, your yields will be negligible, or high but full of ground up plant material that defeats the purpose of extraction in the first place!

    Dry sift requires even more time and manual labor, but doesn't entail the drying step after processing that is required with bubble. The drying of bubble is likely to be a major challenge in the UK, one of the most cold/wet places in the world! This leads to moldy bubble if you are not 110% on top of your drying technique. With this being said, the first word in 'dry sift' implies that you need a dry environment for this process too, you really need a processing space with relative humidity as close to 30% as you can get which could be a challenge. Generally, dry sifting is only justified in terms of yields and labor in the event that you have a very large amount of flower, more than what you'd get away with for bubble - as @Caelar900 said above ;)

    I can also confirm that bubble has a very steep learning curve. You will need to be prepared to have shitty results from your first few attempts - obviously, this is a costly learning curve given the amounts of material needing to be run. If you attempt this, you should start off practicing with trim if it is at all possible to find some.

    Do not expect to be making bubble like you see in my pics right away. It will usually take plenty of experience and practice running bubble before you ever see any full melt at all - also bubble is only really worthwhile for the absolute best quality flowers which are caked with mature resin! If you don't regularly get top shelf Cali quality flowers you really are much better off with rosin. Yields for less mature, lesser quality (even if they are still otherwise reasonable and useable material for vaping or other rosin/solvent extracts) flowers are disappointing as fuck and will leave one questioning why they bothered when you use them in a bubble run!!

    Rosin is MUCH MUCH easier to run than any other kind of extraction, including solvents. You are 100% on the money in identifying this as the best place to start. If the vapefiend unit works for small personal presses that suit your needs, this is probably still going to be cheapest for you without going DIY.

    We have to consider that buying a cheaper press from the US for use in the UK is going to cost a fuckload in shipping (presses are big and heavy!). Further to this, where multiple heater coils are being used on an American made press at 110v, you will require a stepdown converter to achieve the voltage required to run the heaters; that stepdown will need to be an expensive one rated for higher energy consuming devices, given that multiple enail coils can use a lot of power when they are first starting up.

    @Caelar900 glad to see we're agreed on the psi brother :)
     
  17. OldOyler

    OldOyler Fire it again. I can still find the ground.

    Messages:
    545
    Location:
    The War Room
    Peace all!

    Okay, so I admit I am just a bit off in clarity on the psi requirements.

    Is the High5 still meeting that requirement?

    Like, do we now have consensus as to a rough formula, like xx psi minimum for xx diameter plates?

    And...not sure we talked about temps yet. There seem to be two distinct types - max 300F and max 500F (like the High5).

    Are these...too low, high, etc. and is that also somehow related to psi and press time? Puck size?

    Just trying to get it "roughed out", thought I was approaching a light bulb moment of finally getting it, but not quite there I think.

    :hmm:

    Peace!

    EDIT: Takes forever to get to the pressing part, but I finally watched the High5 manual rosin video, and I was pretty impressed. Seemed legit, and the guy was getting something right in press/heat combo. I know it lists at 2000psi, and there seemed to be a consensus on 2500 as the minimum. Peace.
     
    Last edited: Dec 8, 2016
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  18. Dangus

    Dangus Yeah, well, that's just, like, your opinion, man.

    Messages:
    495
    Here's another company doing presses as well as just the plates/controllers (to add to a harbor freight press etc)

    http://www.cencalrosin.com/~shop/main.html

    I use the 1/2 ton set up for home use and am still happy with the results, but considering eventually buying a larger press and moving the plates over.

    I mainly press sift, but might be pressing some flower here in about 3-4 weeks...
     
  19. Caelar900

    Caelar900 Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    126
    Sooo the consensus that we reached is that as long as your press produces a ton of force and you aren't pushing more than .5 at once the psi shouldn't matter because its the surface area of the nug you calculate from not the plates. To answer your question, Yes under those requirements the High5 is good to go, though I would say that is still a little low on PSI and large on plate size..... If you could find a high5 without the 2.5x2.5 plates I would be more inclined to say it was okay but thats just a lot of surface area for your rosin to move across to get outside of the heat zone if your only pushing .5 at once.

    As far as temp goes I push 180-220 Never really go higher or lower, unless I'm pushing hash and then sometimes I go down to 160, but yeah... You really aren't going to need more than 300 degrees thought Im sure the one that is capable of heating to 500 would reach 220 a but faster than the one that maxes at 300.

    I have found that I am able to press dry sift and hashes at lower temps and pressures, 160-200 degrees instead of 180-220 and 2000-4000psi instead of 3000-6000. If you think there is a chance you will star pressing flower I would defiantly upgrade, don't think I've seen that company so thanks!

    I was always a little partial to this company but I love what newvape has to offer:

    Plate sets I would use on 6 ton and 12 ton harbor freight myself but 1 and 6 are adequate I suppose :rolleyes:

    http://www.newvape.com/rosin-press-1-ton-arbor-kit-9073/

    http://www.newvape.com/6-ton-rosin-press-kit-9075/

    And their full setup if I had the money to blow I would throw 4 inch rounds on this thing and it would be in my living room lol:

    http://www.newvape.com/errlpress-20-ton-rosin-press-9079/

    Here are a couple other companies that I have found with plates:

    https://710snob.com/product-category/rosin-tech/

    http://www.medisunfarmsconcentrates.com/product-category/d-i-y/

    And remember to check Instagram too there are still a few shops scattered in there:

    https://www.instagram.com/timewizard_greyfox/
     
  20. GreenHopper

    GreenHopper Well-Known Member

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    119
    Hello mate,

    Yep if I'm still able to function after Crimbo celebrations I might see if I can get a visit in to @VapeFiend.com. If they are up for it I'll take a few snaps and report back.

    @herbivore21

    I'm going to definitely play with Rosin tek first as it seems like a fairly straight forward process, you and @Caelar900 have convinced me to give that a go first. :rockon:

    I have my own grow so I will hopefully have plenty of material to play with 'dry sifting' during the summer, I have an AC maintained room so I'll be able to control the temp and humidity which should help.

    I may move on to bubble later, lets see how I get on with the other two.

    I'm mostly doing these tek's for fun and experience rather than need so high return isn't crucial but I'll be wanting to improve as much as possible just because the point is to get good at these teks.

    Again many thanks to @OldOyler for starting this thread as well as @herbivore21 and @Caelar900 for your advice so far.

    I'm going to leave the 'dry sift' and bubble talk for other threads as this is an 'Off the Shelf Rosin Tek' thread and I feel I've somewhat hijacked it. Sorry about that @OldOyler :peace:
     
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  21. GreenHopper

    GreenHopper Well-Known Member

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    119
  22. Pyr0

    Pyr0 Stoned Roses

    Messages:
    489
    Location:
    Wirral, U.K.
    I wish there was more selection available in the UK.
    I'd just like something small for personal use, with more pressure than hair straightners in an irwin clamp.
    The pressie press caught my eye the other day on the vapefiend site. I like the idea of it needing no effort on my part :p lol but I think I'll wait for more info/user experience as I couldn't find any when searching the other day.
     
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  23. GreenHopper

    GreenHopper Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    119
    Hey Pyr0,

    Same here, I like the compact look of the Pressie but the word on the street is 3000psi is a minimum target to aim for and the Pressie is rated at 1000-1500. As mentioned above I'll report back if I get a chance to go check it out IRL.

    An alternative source of UK Rosin presses is http://concentra710n.com/product-tag/rosin-press/
     
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  24. Pyr0

    Pyr0 Stoned Roses

    Messages:
    489
    Location:
    Wirral, U.K.
    Hi @GreenHopper :wave:
    Thanks for the link I'd never seen that shop before :tup: but I think those plates might be a little too big for my needs :cool:
    I wonder if the pump could be upgraded in the pressie? :hmm:

    Edit: do the manual presses need to be fixed to a bench to get the leveraged on the arm?
     
    Last edited: Dec 8, 2016
  25. GreenHopper

    GreenHopper Well-Known Member

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    119
    No worries bud,

    I've not used that shop so it's just based on searches, buyer be ware type thing, blah blah blah.

    I think the arm you are referring to is used to build up pressure in the pump before you squish. So I doubt the device would need fixing to the bench.

    Basically you pump the lever until you meet the pressure requirement, so I'd expect you could do this easy enough although it can be quite a workout. I've not used a manual pump like that in this context but I had something similar for a 'HPS Aeroponics Grow' setup I was testing (waste of time BTW, way too much effort), the resistance was medium but it took a good ten mins to build up pressure in the 18L expansion vessel I was using. I suspect the Rosin press would have a much smaller pressure tank capacity so maybe not such a pain to pump up to pressure.

    The others here can probably give you a better idea of the effort and forces involved.
     
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