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herbalAire

Discussion in 'Plug-in Vaporizers' started by Hudsonrulez, Nov 9, 2008.

  1. RUDE BOY

    RUDE BOY Space is the Place

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    2,621
    Yeah @mrweed I think its that and some people wanted to blow up a bag in 30 seconds.

    g0ldk0va I've read some pretty good reviews of the HA with bags the biggest advantage I see to a volcano is that it reaches higher temps, a valve on the bag would be nice.

    Does anyone know of a valve system for bags that can be used with Herbie bags?
     
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  2. g0ldik0va

    g0ldik0va Member

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    Location:
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    Thanks @RUDE BOY. I'll have to look into it some more if I ever plan on buying a Volcano. But if it's just higher temps and a valve, I'll probably save my £300+.

    A valve on the HA would be nice though, that's for sure.
     
    RUDE BOY likes this.
  3. zor

    zor Member

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    9
    Whelp, after about 3.5 years I think I shall be shelving my HA. Ive borrowed a friend's volcano which suits me far better as bag vaping is concerned, and over the years I just haven't been able to enjoy the whip vaping as much as I do from a hotbox (i achieve good browning but effects are abysmally weak in comparison).

    I do wonder about the unit, however. I replaced the pump on my own since I got the HA when only a singular version was available; is there any functional difference between the 2.1/2.2 models specific to the heating elements? From what I've read the changes seem to be specific to the pump and the LED colors.

    I read this thread periodically and it warms my heart to see how many satisfied users there are :) Happy trails to all!
     
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  4. g0ldik0va

    g0ldik0va Member

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    Location:
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    Out of curiosity, was that one unit during those 3.5 years? If so, I'm impressed with its durability and hope mine lasts as long.
     
  5. zor

    zor Member

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    9
    Yup! I didn't use it all that heavily after the newness wore off, however, so I'm not sure what deductions can be drawn :( i just checked my email receipt, actually got this on 12/29/08, so it's even older! 2.1 model supposedly, although again that confuses me since I thought that model had the new pump whereas mine certainly did not
     
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  6. g0ldik0va

    g0ldik0va Member

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    Location:
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    Wow, good to hear!

    I wish I could help you with your pump query, but I'm pretty new to the game and only started vaping in November so can't help I'm afraid.

    I'm sure there are plenty here who do know though and will help :).
     
    Last edited: Feb 6, 2014
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  7. RUDE BOY

    RUDE BOY Space is the Place

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    2,621
    Newer Pump and Auto shut off after 30 min was the big change in the 2.1 upgrade I think.
     
  8. nicelytoasted

    nicelytoasted Vaked Chemist

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    Location:
    In the lab
    I've been running my HA 2.1 now for almost six years now as my daily driver, with no problems whatsoever, and can answer some questions, here.

    The 2.1 originally came with the low flow pump, but that was replaced with the medium flow option in response to the times they took to fill a bag. The low flow pump takes a couple of minutes, whereas the medium flow pump takes around a minute, iirc. I prefer the low flow pump myself, since it adds less air to the bag overall, giving a higher vapour-to-air ratio. There is also a high flow pump to use with the 3 or 5 way mouthpiece, to make many bags at once, which is great for groups, or demos.

    The 2.2 included changes to the newer pump, as well as a different LED lighting indication. It also included upgraded electronics connection types on the inside. Both the 2.1 and 2.2 have the 30 minute auto shutoffs included. The reason that they go to ~ 400F only is to make it impossible to combust.

    As far as a valve, I found that after the first hit, the inside bag pressure more or less equalizes to ambient pressure, and leakage is not a factor at this point, imo. For times where you want to space out your bag sessions, I use a simple cap, as shown below. Keep in mind that you don't want to take too long when hitting the bags, as the vapour will oxidize, and become stale (lose taste) after ~ 30 minutes or so.

    A couple of tips for the new users:

    First, always keep the mouthpiece in the unit as it heats and cools as this will ensure that it seals much better, long term.

    Second, I suggest you use a finer mesh screen in the bottom of the crucible (cruc), as well as on top of the herb, in the cruc. This not only helps to keep particles from the vapour stream (and the inner core itself), but allows you to invert & tap the unit, to get the cruc out, without the herb spilling out. Of course, the cruc is very hot, at that point, but it cools very quickly.

    I rarely use the bags anymore, aside from groups/demos, and much prefer my HA, inverted into my bubbler. This mode is where the HA excels, imo.

    Cap I use for bags, and on top of the unit, if I space out my seshes:

    http://imageshack.com/a/img196/4309/o9si.jpg

    Hope this helps.
     
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  9. GratefulVapor

    GratefulVapor Phish Head

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    159
    Location:
    The Dirty South
    Very well said, my fellow Herbie enthusiast. Indeed, the HA does excel as a multi-function Vape attached to Water-Pipes (not to mention the multiple ways to connect the HA to 'x' water-pipe. So many options.. :science:)

    Now, about this 'cap' you have linked to & mentioned above. Are you saying you actually place it onto the Main Mouthpiece, & have noticed less 'lost vapor' while have a session? That is the only downside to the herbie; once you drop that crucible in ... you SHOULD finish it IMO/IME (unless you like to waste your meds that is). The conductive heat of the HA, while minimal is still a double-edged sword. :ninja:
    Explain this mysterious/mystical 'Cap' which has been picture above, please sir. Where are it's origins, & does it truly serve much purpose when NOT using bags? :peace:

    BTW - I feel like some of you guys are missing out (the ones that are using bags.....& enjoying them :uhoh:). Why would you want to buy a Volcano?!?! If a vaporist has limited mobility of their hands (strength, etc.) & also has excess flowers to power the inefficient Volcano; then I would say the 'Cano suites the person. Otherwise, it is a relic :myday:. If you literally 'NEED' a dedicated Bag vape...then I guess it is a viable option. It seriously happens to be one of my pet-peeves; when new vaporists/ill-informed vaporists say "Wow, I think vaporizing is great. I am going to buy a Volcano now!" :mental: :disgust:
     
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  10. zor

    zor Member

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    9
    Heh, I dunno man, gram for gram I find the volcano to be far more efficient for me, especially as far as intensity and duration go, than the Herbalaire. I prefer bags because they are far easier to pass around with friends or just fill a certain amount for a session and inhale that; the crucible setup with the HA makes it less convenient to remove when using the whip, and leaving it in (and not pulling on the whip or filling a bag) will result in heating and subsequent vapor loss.

    I also feel a psychological satisfaction from visual confirmation when I see and inhale from a vapor filled bag :p

    But again, the HA served as a great device, especially as my first vape and gateway into vaporizers in general!
     
    jerseydvd likes this.
  11. The Shrike

    The Shrike Well-Known Member

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    32
    Location:
    Scotland
    O.K. i'm in a bit of trouble here, and need some advice from the more experienced users on this forum.

    I use the Herbalaire in vape-bonging mode - with a Black Leaf Honeycomb bong and the HerbalAire Ground Glass on Glass Adapter 18mm from Planetvape.

    If I turn the Herbalaire upside down, then place the adapter into it, the adapter does not fit all the way in. (This is when cold.)
    Once the Herbalaire heats up, the Herbalaire will suddenly drop down fully over the adapter, (you can hear a click as it meets the bottom of the heating chamber,) but it does not give an airtight seal - I can lift the Herbalaire off and back onto the adapter very easily.

    I have been onto Plantvape who said this was not right, that it should tighten up against the bottom of the walls of the heating chamber so they sent me another one, (to the UK - very good service!)
    Unfortunately, this one was even looser. I await their reply to this news, but they have already said it is possibly the Herbalaire at fault, spec-wise.

    I'm beginning to wonder if Planetvape might be right for the following reasons:-

    1) My vapour is very thin.

    2) Sometimes, the draw is VERY difficult, like there's a blockage, then suddenly it clears - no I'm not blocking the air intake!

    So, I would be very interested to hear any comments, ideas, advice from fellow members, thanks.
     
  12. The Shrike

    The Shrike Well-Known Member

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    32
    Location:
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    Update

    Planetvape have got back to me offering to refund cost of the original adapter if I want to return them.
    They reckon the Herbalaire is indeed faulty:- "Yeah something is up with your herbalAire, if you look online about our herbalAire adapters you will see that they fit very tight and if pushed in too hard become difficult to remove. They are made in a mould so tolerances are very precise, even a tenth of a mm will fit a little looser or tighter but they all lock in. Something is definitely not right with your herbalAire unit, it should produce clouds!"

    So, as I only bought the Herbalaire at Christmas, looks like I'll be sending it back. I bought it precisely because of the ability to vape-bong with the vape mounted on the bong.

    Choice of vapes is very limited here in the UK, but are there other vapes which can meet my vape-bong requirements? I'm concerned if I get a replacement Herbalaire, I may have similar problems.

    Thanks for readng.
     
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  13. RUDE BOY

    RUDE BOY Space is the Place

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    2,621
    How well does the HA white mouthpiece fit ? I really don't see the HA being the problem, I do know some users have had the PV adapter Damage and ruin their HA. I would try herbalaires adapter for glass instead.
     
  14. The Shrike

    The Shrike Well-Known Member

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    32
    Location:
    Scotland
    "How well does the HA white mouthpiece fit ?"

    I would say snug -certainly not tight.

    However, you got me thinking - I'll go back to using the mouthpiece tonight to see if there are the same problems with lack of clouds, blockage.

    Thanks.
     
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  15. RUDE BOY

    RUDE BOY Space is the Place

    Messages:
    2,621
    Good luck @The Shrike. Hope it's something simple to overcome.
     
  16. nicelytoasted

    nicelytoasted Vaked Chemist

    Messages:
    197
    Location:
    In the lab
    Thanks GratefulVapor, it's always nice to see you join in the discussions here.

    I started using that cap when I was using bags, especially when I spaced out my sesh a bit. We use all kinds of 1/4" and 6 mm OD teflon tubing at work, so we had lots of these caps that I could "borrow"... I believe that we got them from McMaster-Carr: http://www.mcmaster.com/#rubber-end-caps/=qnbf9v part #92805K14, 10 caps for $2.78.

    When I went to HA-bonging mostly, I just snipped a small length of the teflon tubing and put a cap on the end, which I inserted into the mouthpiece, in between hits, especially when I spaced my seshes out.

    Is it really worth it to do this? I'm not sure it is, tbh, but it's so simple to do, it became a habit for me. I don't believe that the loss of vapour is really relevant overall, but if it saves any precious vapour, then I'm down for it. I have noticed that when you go to clear your glass at the end of a hit, if you slowly remove the mp as you hit, it does clear the vapour out of the HA as well. This may be where most of the whisps of vapour come from as the HA sits (in addition to the convection). Either way is fine, imo.

    How did you arrive at this conclusion? There are different forms of efficiency when it comes to vaping. I've hit the volcano many times, including side by side with the HA and can't say which is better, can we agree that both are good, solid vapes that have stood the test of time?

    @ The Shrike: I don't use the gong adaptor myself, I just use the stock mouthpiece, but I would suggest that you try keeping the piece inside the HA as it heats & cools for a few cycles to see if it fits better overall. The other option is as Rude Boy suggests, getting the adaptor from HA. Cloud production can be controlled by the user, you can grind, pack tighter, or use more bud. Good luck either way.
     
    Last edited: Feb 12, 2014
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  17. The Shrike

    The Shrike Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    32
    Location:
    Scotland
    I have informed Planetvape that I'll be keeping the adapters after all, as the convenience of hands-free using the Herbalaire with their adapter and a bong outweighs the slight looseness of the adapter for me personally. Also, there's no risk of it getting stuck!

    I have also informed them that when comparing the 2 adapters, the replacement one is, in fact, 3mm longer - this is between the four protruding glass grip points and the bowl where the gauze is. So they are not all exactly the same as they claim. Being in the UK, we obviously can't send them back and forth till I get one that fits properly due to the shipping expense.

    I'm going to order the Teflon GonG to see how that goes.


    As regards, clouds from the Herbalaire, I realise I made a mistake. My understanding is that clouds refer to exhalation of vapour, which is fine with this unit. I was referring to milk; density of vapour in the bong which is thin. However, I am getting medicated, but strangely, not as much as the first few times I used it, whether I use the teflon mouthpiece or Planetvape adapter. I think I must have put more goodies in back then!

    Thanks for all the replies, much appreciated.

    P.S. How do you log out of this forum - I can' find it!
    Also, I asked this before, but didn't get any answer -
    is the auto-shutdown feature supposed to switch the unit off - because mine does not do this.
     
    Last edited: Feb 12, 2014
    GratefulVapor likes this.
  18. GratefulVapor

    GratefulVapor Phish Head

    Messages:
    159
    Location:
    The Dirty South
    I agree from my personal experience, about the PlanetVape adapters, & possibly having to exchange adapters to get the 'correct' size .... as well as the first I received being far too large which almost broke my herbie. Once contacted, they claimed "Impossible. It is probably your HerbaleAire. These come from a mold & do not differ in size. However, will you ship it back to us at your expense, so we can have a looksy?" (basically saying: "We don't believe you"). This all happened ~8 months ago, those were not the exact words exchanged. Anyways, I am sorry shrike about the trouble you are having. I am sure you will find some use in it; as you said it's better loose than large. :tup:
    The second one I received has actually worked quite well, & I am very pleased with it. I simply wish they would have dealt with the exchange, in a much more friendly manner. I do plan to purchase another in the future; 14mm Shorty. :nod:

    As for the inquiry about the auto-shutdown, I will be of service. :myday:
    When the auto-shutdown 'kicks-in', the unit doesn't switch off (as in no electricity running to it), the HEATER turns off. This is what it is "supposed to do"; not sure what is actually going on with your Herbie. :shrug: :peace: :2c:
     
  19. The Shrike

    The Shrike Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    32
    Location:
    Scotland
    Gratefulvapor

    Yes, Planetvape's policy of blaming the Herbie is not good plus they told me I was the ONLY person to have trouble! I knew this to be false due to your experience. Also, as you can see above, it made me start to doubt my Herbie. Considering the price, (well, I think they're expensive, especially adding on shipping to the UK,) you'd expect them to be EXACTLY the same. I have to say I am not impressed when it comes to their own custom products. Incidentally, last night the replacement one was standing upright on the counter, fell over onto the counter, and promptly snapped in half! Glad I hadn't paid for that! Another minus as far as I'm concerned.

    Thanks for explaining the auto shutdown feature. I know mine doesn't switch off the electricity, as the lights are still on. But I did not realise the heater switched off while the lights were still on - I'll have to check this. Really, they should give a more detailed explanation of this. Of course, it could just be me misunderstanding their explanation.

    I am expecting delivery from a UK supplier of the teflon GonG tomorrow, and will report on how I get on with that. I assume it would be better to use a screen at the bottom of the heat chamber with this adapter?
     
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  20. GratefulVapor

    GratefulVapor Phish Head

    Messages:
    159
    Location:
    The Dirty South
    Shrike - Agreed. A set of more detailed instructions is far over-due for the herbalAire. :2c:
    Now, back to the *Adapter Acquisition Assessment*. As far as I know, YES it would probably be 'better' to use a screen at the bottom of the heat chamber. Heck, even though the crucible has a screen built into the bottom, I still place an extra screen at the bottom of my crucible :lol:. I started to do it a long time ago, & now it is simply habit. IME, having a screen below the material definitely doesn't harm the airflow or performance (plus it was originally designed to be used with the Crucible, which obviously has a screen). :spidey:

    Sorry to hear that your adapter broke :argh:. Look forward to hearing about the new GonG adapter!

    -GV-
     
  21. The Shrike

    The Shrike Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    32
    Location:
    Scotland
    O.K. here is my *Adapter Acquisition Assessment* of the Teflon Gong which I tested last night. I haven't seen much info on it in this forum, so if any details here have been mentioned before, my apologies.

    First off, the extension which inserts into Herbie is about half an inch compared to the quarter of an inch of the Teflon Mouthpiece. These measurements are by eye, so approximate. So in comparison, it is not as long as the PV GonG. It is also very loose-fitting, BUT, this becomes tight and solid once up to temp. Unlike my PV GonG. The other end is also very secure going into my 18mm bong. In fact, the whole assembly is very secure with Herbie not moving around at all. i.e. swiveling as with the PV GonG.

    Now, I am a big fan of the crucible idea. I like it because it prevents any possibility of goodies going down into the workings, and to me it is very practical and convenient. The fact that Herbalaire said you could NOT use a crucible with the Teflon GonG is why I initially dismissed it as a possibility and bought the PV GonG.

    But the Teflon GonG does not, as outlined above, take up much more room inside the heating chamber than the original Teflon Mouthpiece. So, it occurred to me, maybe I could cut the crucible down to size? After all, it is only aluminium. So, with a pair off snips, I cut a series of quarter inch vertical slits from the top of the crucible. This left a series of vertical strips which I then bent back and forth with a pair of pliers until they broke off. I then put both the crucible and Teflon GonG into Herbie and further adjusted the crucible height in aforesaid manner until the Teflon GonG was flush.

    I was left with a crucible which had more than enough room for a bottom screen, goodies, and a top screen. It functioned just the same as with the Teflon Mouthpiece. The internal airway diameter of both Teflon units is also the same.

    This setup suits me and I am very pleased with it - I CAN still use the crucible, I have a GonG which is very secure in the Herbalaire and the bong, and cannot break accidentally. If you don't mind 10 minutes of DIY, I can heartily recommend this Teflon GonG.

    On reflection, it seems to me, that since Herbalaire went to the trouble of producing a Teflon GonG for the h2.2 to facilitate use with water tools, (it comes standard with the Elite,) rather than saying you could not use the crucible, why don't they produce a cut-down crucible?

    Oh, and yes, I do play and also teach drums, hence my avatar!
     
    Last edited: Feb 15, 2014
  22. MG23

    MG23 Relaxin'

    Messages:
    465
    I had been using my HA 2.2 exclusively with a Solo GonG from PV, but it recently shattered, as glass is prone to do; so I purchased a TonG mouthpiece from Herbalaire thanks in part to your recommendation, @The Shrike. I couldn't be happier. I was skeptical at first, having prefered Solo GonG to the stock MP/Cruc combo; but after a day of using the TonG mouthpiece and a mini-crucible I am converted.

    I have noticed when I leave the HA inverted on the bubbler there is very little conduction compared to stock MP/Cruc combo. I assume this is because the mini-crucible is no longer touching the bottom of the HA's "oven". The flavor is fantastic all the way through 400, and as always the UNGROUND material is extracted thoroughly and evenly; resulting in a uniform dark chocolate color all the way through to the core.

    I second @The Shrike in highly recommending the HA Teflon to Glass adapter to anyone that has 5-10 minutes to spare trimming down a crucible.

    PICTURES SOON; FC IS LONG OVERDUE FOR MORE HERBALAIRE APPRECIATION!!!
     
    Last edited: Feb 27, 2014
  23. The Shrike

    The Shrike Well-Known Member

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    32
    Location:
    Scotland
    Glad to see someone else has tried this "mod" and liked it. Thank you MG23 for posting your thoughts on it.
    I like the term "mini-crucible" - why didn't I think of that?

    I also noticed I no longer had vapour "leaking" from the Herbalaire - is this what you meant by very little conduction?
     
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  24. BalzaSteel

    BalzaSteel Member

    Messages:
    26
    Location:
    in a big cloud of vapor
    Hold on a second, did you say ALUMINUM crucible? as in that stuff that's been linked to Alzheimer's when used in cookware? as in the stuff I've often worried about causing myself brain damage from all the times I've used it for impromptu pipe screens? in the airway of a medical vaporizer? that's some scary shit.

    BalzOut
     
  25. The Shrike

    The Shrike Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    32
    Location:
    Scotland
    Well, to me, it LOOKS like aluminium. And it is pliable. But then, it is VERY thin. It may be steel - perhaps someone else has more accurate info on this.
     

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