1. What does SSTB mean? See our glossary of acronyms.
    Dismiss Notice

Divine Tribe atty's

Discussion in 'E-cig Based Portables' started by divinetribe, Jun 12, 2014.

  1. nosmoking

    nosmoking Fogmonger

    Messages:
    1,217
    Location:
    DC Area
    I would think this is a very subjective question with to many variables to easily answer. How big of a dab and the consistency of the material as well as what the end user refers to as completing a dab are going to make this a very hard question to answer definitively IMO.

    I would like to know what settings @divinetribe is using in the video? Are you just giving it straight power or do you use TC settings currently? If so, what are they?

    My experience with trying to heat a quartz dish with a mod box in TC mode often leads me into a non-heating battle with the temp protection lock-out which delays my heat cycle, however it appeared in the video as if there was no such struggle even though it sounded like @Vape Donkey 650 experienced similar results to mine.
     
    JCat, Vape Donkey 650 and tennisguru1 like this.
  2. invertedisdead

    invertedisdead trance-form

    Messages:
    2,494
    Location:
    Colliefornia
    It looked like about 3 power cycles in the video from start to finish of that dab. My mod is setup for 15 second cutoff, but I'm not sure it's a great idea to continuously discharge for 45 seconds straight at 70 watts so I'm really curious.
     
    JCat, Danksta, KeroZen and 3 others like this.
  3. KeroZen

    KeroZen Chronic vapaholic

    Messages:
    2,539
    Location:
    On Air
    On a single cell you would need one of the very few super high discharge cells: LG HB6 or Sony VTC3.

    With a dual or triple cells mod it should be ok even with our more modest but more common cells we use.
     
  4. Kanna_Kult

    Kanna_Kult Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    66
    Weren't these supposed to be on the site yesterday? Really want to buy one lol
     
  5. looney2nz

    looney2nz Research Geek, Mad Scientist

    Messages:
    332
    Location:
    So Cal
    Matt said he hopes for them to land Wednesday, so we'll see what happens.
     
  6. Danksta

    Danksta Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    705
    Can't wait to pick one up this week! :rockon:
     
  7. divinetribe

    divinetribe We are trying our hardest to become Medical Grade Manufacturer

    Messages:
    223
    Location:
    Arcata, Humboldt California
    Last edited: Jan 10, 2018
    graydeh1, FMSQ, tepictoton and 11 others like this.
  8. mephisto

    mephisto Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    1,047
    Thanks Matt! Got my fresh Green QQ on the way.
     
  9. Other Side

    Other Side In the clouds

    Messages:
    225
    Ditto! Can't wait!
     
  10. nikcorda

    nikcorda Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    86
    hell yeah ordering one today!!
     
    tennisguru1 likes this.
  11. Smoke1ForMe

    Smoke1ForMe Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    239
    Location:
    Los Angeles, Ca
    Just ordered one!
     
    tennisguru1 likes this.
  12. tdog49

    tdog49 vapingOregon

    Messages:
    22
    Green QQ ordered! I think the green is gonna look sick on my Voopoo Alpha 1... like some old time vacuum tube....
     
    Danksta and invertedisdead like this.
  13. 21stCenturyVape

    21stCenturyVape Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    10
    @divinetribe - So glad you were able to make this concept a reality! About to order one... any solder exposed in the air path? Would be great to separate the air path from the heating element in version 2.
     
    tennisguru1 likes this.
  14. mephisto

    mephisto Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    1,047
    As far as I can tell, there is no solder anywhere......In essence the air path is separate from the heater.
    Welcome to FC!

    Might I suggest we have a full birth before we discard this latest edition and reach for the 2.0.
    Matt works his ass off to follow our suggestions, and it shows in this edition of the QQ.
     
  15. huffmybrd

    huffmybrd New Member

    Messages:
    14
    Got my order in! Didn't realize it was free shipping so I opted for the extra green glass aswell. Super stoked!

    Wondering how a single vtc6 will hold up though (sinuous p80 mod), it could possibly be time to invest in a new mod :(
     
    tennisguru1 likes this.
  16. JCat

    JCat Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    1,751
    Location:
    Ontario, Canada
    Mine ordered too! Pretty sure the green is an "extra" mouthpiece which is awesome :) (at least that's what it seems to indicate on the order page)

    @divinetribe ... is the following the correct config for the eleaf istick pico? Trying to follow your instructions on your site as I'm not very familiar with this stuff yet ... it says a temp of 300F (ie. ~150C) ... is that correct?

    Thanks!

    [​IMG]


    Edit:

    On the divine tribe site the battery they sell with the full kit is the eleaf istick pico 75W which is single battery ... so I'm guessing it shouldn't be too bad! :)
     
    tennisguru1 and PandaLee like this.
  17. PandaLee

    PandaLee Active Member

    Messages:
    48
    I'm gonna go check out some of them three battery mods now haha - can't wait!
     
    tennisguru1 likes this.
  18. joekar

    joekar This IS my happy face..

    Messages:
    155
    Cool, I'll be grabbing one ASAP...Thank You.:tup::clap::nod:
     
    tennisguru1 likes this.
  19. elmoe420

    elmoe420 Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    408
    Location:
    Seattle, WA
    Glad to hear there is no solder and that is not surprising given @divinetribe knows his stuff by now.

    However, you can clearly tell from the pictures that the air path is in no way isolated from the heater. The heating element is entirely exposed and most liking has to be in this current gen design to dissipate heat.
     
    FMSQ and tennisguru1 like this.
  20. looney2nz

    looney2nz Research Geek, Mad Scientist

    Messages:
    332
    Location:
    So Cal
    ordered a green AND a clear, along with some parts and batteries :)

    too tired to re-digest the thread, was there a feeling on if this would be a waste of time (battery swap-wise) with my eJoy VTwin Mini's or should I start looking at a 2 or 3 battery mod? (opinions? @Vape Donkey 650)... if so I'll have to look at a larger battery charger too.
     
  21. Vape Donkey 650

    Vape Donkey 650 All vape, no smoke please.

    Messages:
    358
    Location:
    Northern California
    This is from the ineedhemp website listing for the QQ:
    If using TCR 470 or TC-Ni mode (TCR 600) I think that high # is probably "padding in" some additional heater-coil warmup to factor in for the delayed heat transfer to the quartz cup. I would expect the "real" accurate TCR # of the rods themselves to be in the 200-300 range, for matching surface temps and mod screen numbers on direct-conduction vaping, like with the V3 or the new jetstream RDA.

    My new, final version QQ is in the mail too, so I'll look forward to testing out these ceramic rods in a stand-alone TCR tuning session, and then try to convert that to a fairly stable, accurate, higher TCR # to combine the rods + quartz cup heat profile. Maybe Matt is already pretty close at TCR 470?

    This could be quite a project for the TC nerds to find the best way to tune the QQ. TFR / FSK modes are probably useless for this atty. Plain TCR mode has it's limitations, but when used with PI control and some pre-heat, maybe we can get something closer to the stable temp control we seek?

    Should be no need to discharge 70 watts anywhere near that long, that would exceed the limits of most people's equipment and will probably break stuff. TC operation should regulate max watts to just a few seconds at a time.

    15 second cut offs may be annoying, but it seems the QQ atty might benefit from brief, non-button-pressing breaks in between power cycles, as to not over-heat the quartz cup.

    This also makes @funkyjunky's "tubomyevic" firmwmare a tempting option to free up your thumbs during an extended session with the "cruise mode" :cool: It works with many mods that people use with DT products. (many joye-leaf-smec models) I've already mused about how that firmware could be a great match for the DC Gen 2 herb atty also, but I don't use that vape much, and the good word is slow to spread :shrug:

    I think you'll be ok with the Vtwo mini single-cell mod and the new QQ. Running 70w isn't necessary, you can go lower for a slightly slower warmup to be easier on the batteries. It looks like Matt is lowering the recommended wattage a bit, also. It looks like he did all his testing on a 75w pico, while I used 2 cell mods, I think it is more advisable to get a 510 adapter / heat sink to protect your mod on extended usage. The battery and mod work alot better if they can stay cool, and the new QQ atty radiates much more heat than the V3 :o (but similar to the Gen2 herb?)

    But don't let that discourage you from getting some bigger mods if you want that to be a pretext :D A 2 or 3-cell mod will let you get many more sessions between charges, obviously, and it won't work the batteries as hard and hot, although extended QQ use can still overheat the CPU on a multi-cell mod too, with a little more work (that might take 4-5 very rapid back to back sessions? who wants to force-feed vape to themselves to make their mod's CPU overheat with the QQ? :ko: for science! :science:)


    Just my :2c:, I think you should just buy the whole QQ kit, (not just the parts) b/c the cup stand-alone is very tall, narrow, and would be difficult to mount in a very stable way in the type of e-cig RDAs you use, and it could be even more difficult to target some airflow into the cup. This quartz cup without well-targeted airflow would probably work poorly, if at all.

    Get the whole atomizer/kit, and you can remove the quartz cup and heaters to try it in an RDA application if you think it may work, and then you can fall back to the complete QQ atty setup after that fails :)

    The ceramic rods are neither "solid ceramic" nor "porous" IMO, it's somewhere in between. It's not like a really smooth, crystalline macro-surface like a quartz banger; it does have some texture. But it doesn't "wick up" or absorb much oil into its surface like a generic silica ccell coil, or the SiC wick on W9 products do, oil can "roll off" the rods like on a ceramic donut. These alumina ceramic rods actually can wipe / swab clean pretty easily when you heat them mildly, like the donuts. And you can give it a good scrape or scratch, the ceramic will stay intact, not falling to dust or flakes.

    In the configuration shown there, I can see some oil rolling off the rods during usage, but NBD, that's what dab tools are for, just scoop it back up on top where the heat is to finish the session if you want. Lots of people are already doing that with toothpicks and skinny dab tools with the V3 donuts and cups.

    I do agree it would be nice to have more mouthpiece options, like a removable 510-drip tip. (An 810 drip tip would probably be an invitation for splashed oil to touch your lip, and all that extra airflow & diameter at the MP opening will be un-needed and wasted with the limited airflow tubes on the cap)

    Metal tips are ok sometimes, but they do get that lip gunk. I have big crusty vaper lips so I know about that. :D Just gotta wipe it off as needed :shrug:

    Adjustable airflow would be really cool, but I don't know how you can implement that on this jetstream RDA? The whole concept is heavily reliant on the angled-air-tubes shooting air diagonally, from up top, onto the build deck. Maybe with some airflow control ring regulating the air intake to the 2 tubes, like on some of the better RTAs, but that would be rather large and complex (never been done yet in a concentrate RDA? Not in the VV pulse? But in the govad yes?) so I don't see that in the future of this product...fun to speculate though....:sherlock:
     
    Last edited: Jan 11, 2018
  22. Vape Donkey 650

    Vape Donkey 650 All vape, no smoke please.

    Messages:
    358
    Location:
    Northern California
    I thin you guys are overlooking what you do not want to see. There is indeed solder on the new ceramic rods. Take a closer look at the pics / videos on the jetstream (same ceramic heaters as the QQ) and the pics for the replacement ceramic rods alone.

    [​IMG]

    From the DT v1, v2.5, v3, DC Gen 1 & 2, (pretty much all of Matt's best products) as well as just about any 510 dabbing atty that uses an alumina ceramic heater....all those atomizers have heaters with metal solder!

    If you guys have been using and enjoying any of those atomizers / heaters and knowing it has solder joining the metal wire to the alumina donut all this time, why are you guys suddenly concerned about that now? :suspicious:

    I sometimes see people talk with implicit condescension or suspicion regarding heaters for vaping that have solder, but if these things are knowingly to be used on vapes and are known to be unsafe, how can so many companies and countless vapers who are health-conscious gone along with this for so long?

    Is there any specific or concrete data that shows atomizers with solder are not suitable for vaping when used at reasonable temps? Any MSDS to look at? Any lab tests? (I'm not trying to posture here, I'd really like to know) Not all solders are the same, too. All of DT's donut's and heaters have a silver colored solder, expect the high-resistance 1.5 ohm 7mm donuts, which is blue. I've wondered how they are different, but I still use them :D

    There was some talk about the solder on the donuts in the early-early days / pages of this thread, but I didn't see any damning or obvious evidence against solder presented. :huh:

    From a vaping performance / taste standpoint, I think alumina ceramic heaters with an integral solder are the best heaters you can use for concentrate vaping in a 510 atomizer, tank or RDA. They can heat up quick, stable and steady and impart the least flavor in my vapor, to what I can tell.

    Those generic silica ceramic "cCell" atomizers which every concentrate tank uses these days, does not have any solder, but it also exposes a large section of the metal coil wire directly to your oil, leaving a taste I can notice. The ceramic wick and wire on the bubbleman trinity tank is similar, in which you're heating a ceramic rubble pile indirectly through a metal coil wire that also touches your oil. Most people are fine with this, but I don't like hot metal wires doing most of the conduction-heating work to vape my concentrate.

    If there's a downside to ceramic heaters with solder? Maye that the part of the ceramic touching / adjacent to the solder tends to be the "cool spot" on the heater; when you burn clean a donut, you can observe this. The solder area will glow more faintly, but these donuts still offer large, evenly heated surfaces, doing nearly all your conduction heating work (not the wires) so I'll take that trade-off :tup:

    edit: dug up from page 49 of this thread, info from Matt's suppliers


    edit: more


    No follow up on the fluorides in the silver flux / solder material. Is that true? How concerned should I be about it if it is true? I think @fernand's (who is a toxicologist) response puts those concerns in a good context:

    Where did you go fern? I miss you :D :cry:

    And @OF's follow-up post on the solder / flux is perhaps even more informative, if less cutting


    That is correct here. The 2 open cylinders / tubes where the ceramic rods slides into are not sealed, so you can remove and replace the rods in the event they fail on you. If it was sealed in there like han solo, yes, that would "isolate" the heaters from the airpath and probably improve heat transfer, but that would also be much harder to design / produce economically, and make the whole atty less "RBA" :(

    So a little bit of hot air swirling around from the mouthpiece tube will mix with air heated from touching the ceramic rods, but that's of little concern to me, other than wasted airflow potential maybe
     
    Last edited: Jan 11, 2018
  23. wileycoyote1103

    wileycoyote1103 Active Member

    Messages:
    47
    Location:
    Colorado USA
    @Vape Donkey 650 I ordered me a green Eleaf Invoke, just for this on your recommendation, a few posts back.
    Curious if you had settings to share. It should be in the mail any day.

    I'm also just curious too if the MP's will be interchangeable with the RDA. I think it has 2 airtubes, if I'm not mistaken.
     
    Last edited: Jan 11, 2018
    tennisguru1 and Vape Donkey 650 like this.
  24. Vape Donkey 650

    Vape Donkey 650 All vape, no smoke please.

    Messages:
    358
    Location:
    Northern California
    Cool, glad my mod-mania was of interest to you. :D I like my new white invoke enough that I purchased black and silver ones too, pre-emptive mod purchases for new attys that I anticipate but don't even have yet. Cmon, China boat! :lol:

    The green looks cool too, but the color doesn't match well (clashes, almost) with the colors of all the attys I currently use...but with that new green glass MP for the QQ...:hmm: that has me reconsidering those aesthetics...

    The settings you would use on the eleaf invoke would be no different than you would use from any other similar TC mod that lets you set the TCR # and max wattage, so that's good and familiar.

    As much as I'm saying, I still don't have the final version of the QQ with the ceramic rods, so I can't say for sure, myself, but the recommended settings that Matt posted on the website should be a good starting point.

    Ni mode around 310F, or TCR 470 around 300F, those are 2 different, suggested settings. The Ni suggestion, just in case your mod doesn't support user-set TCR #s?

    I look forward to testing out the final version when I get mine just like some of you guys too :p:drool:
     
    Last edited: Jan 11, 2018
  25. KeroZen

    KeroZen Chronic vapaholic

    Messages:
    2,539
    Location:
    On Air
    For what it's worth, the iHeat is also using solder between the electrodes and mesh for better connections.

    Also the most common flux is rosin, and I don't think it contains fluorides?

    :2c:
     

Support FC, visit our trusted friends and sponsors