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cleanest concentrate?

Discussion in 'ABV' started by Jman5280, Jun 10, 2014.

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  1. Jman5280

    Jman5280 Active Member

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    whats the cleanest type of concentrate? i was under the impression at shatter was cleaner than wax and budder...

    im trying to use the cleanest safest stuff bc the reason i moved to vaping is to be healthier and take car of myself better.

    my dispensary carries TC Labs shatter, anyone ever buy their stuff? whats your take? i cant find much about them but its what my dispensary carries.
  2. Dr. Plutonious

    Dr. Plutonious Well-Known Member

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    636
    I don't think there is too much of a difference in the cleanliness. It's more about how clean the process is done.

    I could be wrong though, but I always thought it was more about temperatures, purging techniques, materials used, etc more than it was about form.
  3. clouded vision

    clouded vision Well-Known Member

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    What's your definition of clean? Are you looking for a concentrate completely free of plant material waxes and lipids, then you want to find something that is properly dewaxed or winterized. If you want something completely free of residual solvents then make sure you buy concentrates that have been tested, or better yet use truly solventless (not just labeled that way to circumvent local laws like in CA) concentrates such as ice hash.
    The form of the concentrate has very little to do with the cleanliness of it. If you are really concerned buy from reputable dispensaries that test their products and use reputable testing companies or better yet make your own so you can be sure of the process. Also if worried about residual solvents then do your own iso or ethanol wash at home (could even winterize in the process) with store bought concentrates.
  4. Jman5280

    Jman5280 Active Member

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    396
    I just want to be inhaling the healthiest stuff for me. Butane or solvents left in your material can't be good for you and nobody knows the possible long term effects.

    I have asked this question several times on this forum, but the answer is always unclear or not answered...What's a idiot proof way I can clean up store bought shatter or wax?
  5. SpruceGruve

    SpruceGruve Bag of sand in hand,Eyeing up the gold statue

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    If your worried about the quality of material your buying,I'd suggest getting from a reputable source that lab tests their stuff.like clouded vision suggested.
    Also if you have the money you could buy a vac chamber and pump and send it through again to make sure it's clean
    SSVUN~YAH and clouded vision like this.
  6. clouded vision

    clouded vision Well-Known Member

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    1,153
    There is no "idiot proof" way because if you are an idiot then your purge will probably be worse than the original purge. If you are willing to put in the time to read and learn and purchase the correct tools such as a vac chamber and pump, electric griddle, ir gun, etc then you can be sure your purge was done correctly. The easiest way to make sure all solvents have been removed is to redissolve them into a solvent then properly purge them.
    Without purchasing extra equipment though you can redissolve into grain neutral spirits then evaporate off the alcohol. You may be left with some residual ethanol but inhaling the vapor from this is no more damaging to you than having a beer, any residual butane in your concentrates will evaporate long before all of the ethanol does. This is also a good time to winterize as long as you have already dissolved it in ethanol. I suggest poking around on skunkpharm for proper techniques on everything related to concentrates.
  7. Jman5280

    Jman5280 Active Member

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    I get TC labs shatter...they are "award winning" here in CO. Not sure how to find out if they test. I have asked numerous dispensaries in Denver if they test their stuff, I have yet to find a place that does. They all say that the concentrate manufacturer tests the stuff but they don't know or have the results...
  8. Caligula

    Caligula *results not typical.

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    5,785
    Location:
    So Cal
    You can have your own stuff tested. Only way to know for sure.

    Try SC Labs or Steep Hill Halent.

    FWIW, Colorado has a legal limit for concentrates sold there. IIRC its limited to 500 PPM. In contrast, SC Labs determined that you get an average of 700-1200PPM of butane residuals by lighting up with a modern day Bic style lighter.

    In either regard, people have been inhaling butane resuduals for a long time (how long have butane disposable lighters been around again?), and we haven't seen any links to lighters and any illness over all these decades.


    edit: They have been around since 1947

    Now Im not saying inhaling butane is good for you by any means, but I believe there are more important things to be worrying about.

    In either regard, the only way to assure that there are 0 solvents in your concentrate is to get something like ice hash... which doesnt use any solvent other than water.
    Last edited: Jun 10, 2014
    Jahannum and clouded vision like this.
  9. Bouldorado

    Bouldorado Well-Known Member

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    Location:
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  10. syrupy

    syrupy Where the gas is greener.

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    About as good as it gets for what I see around:

    [​IMG]
    SSVUN~YAH and Caligula like this.
  11. tuk

    tuk Well-Known Member

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    279
    Smoking tobacco has its own health concerns, coupled with the prevalence of gas lighters over the last half century if there is a health problem it would be a difficult thing to untangle from all the other poisons/effects to prove conclusively that Butane is a culprit of some kind.

    As I understand it, Butane cannot escape the flame, even if some did manage to get through it would likely get trapped in the tobacco then burnt up again...all this before we get to the filter! So I imagine very little if any Butane residue at all would enter the smokers mouth.....this path dynamic is entirely missing when vaping so I don't think Butane lighters used for smoking are a valid indicator that Butane is safe to vape.

    Sadly it will probably take another 2-3 decades of people vaping concentrate polluted with Butane before we have a data set with enough resolution to crunch out a conclusion either way.....In the meantime if your vaping for health reasons I don't see why you would not be concerned about vaping polluted concentrate as the health effects are completely unknown, although common sense should tell you it's a bad idea...evidence or not.

    At the end of the day it should always be about the cleanest possible product.

    Just my 2 pence..
  12. max

    max This space available Staff Member

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    Some notes on butane-

    "Permitted levels of butane should not cause adverse health and welfare effects. Butane is a low molecular weight aliphatic hydrocarbon which is an anesthetic and asphyxiant. It is essentially non-toxic at low concentrations and has a low acute respiratory toxicity to experimental animals and humans at moderate concentrations. Inhalation of extremely high concentrations exceeding butane’s lower explosive limit (LEL: 1.8-1.9%) may cause effects and depression of the central nervous system with symptoms such as headache, nausea, dizziness, drowsiness, confusion, and unconsciousness. There are no human or animal studies indicating butane has a potential to be a human carcinogen." http://www.tceq.texas.gov/assets/public/implementation/tox/dsd/facts/butanes.pdf
    "Vapour Density: 2.0 (Air = 1)
    Negligible hazard at ambient/normal handling temperatures. Inhalation of lowconcentration
    vapours may cause headaches, nausea and drowsiness.
    Persistence & Degradability: Butane is unlikely to cause longterm
    adverse effects in the environment.
    Aquatic Toxicity: Unlikely to cause long term effects in the aquatic environment.
    Bioaccumulative Potential: Butane does not bioaccumulate."
    http://www.flogasni.com/assets/flogas/images/downloads/Safety-Data-Butane.pdf

    If you're not getting the adverse symptoms of headache, nausea, dizzines, etc., then you're not getting anywhere near any kind of harmful level, and again, butane does not bioaccumulate. In today's world I'd worry a lot more about accumulation of heavy metals in my body than a minor dose of butane.
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  13. tuk

    tuk Well-Known Member

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    279
    Humans didn't evolve inhaling butane, unless the data-sheets also reference multiple studies based on large, diverse data sets going over several decades......then the health risks of inhaling vaped butane repeatedly over a period of time are completely unknown! ....this is what basic science says, if the manuf says different they are talking out their ass, but I suspect your manuf quotes relate to a very narrow generic test which has nothing to do with the practice of vaping bho.

    But as you say there are known general health risks with Butane, so we do know it's not completely innocuous not even close.

    If you're not getting the adverse symptoms of headache, nausea, dizzines, etc., then you're not getting anywhere near any kind of harmful level, and again,

    You can't state that as fact, nor is it workable, what do you do once you have the adverse symptoms? there is no rewind button & some of the symptoms could be caused by mj, so knowing the dizzines you're experiencing is from the huge dab you've just had or is it down to the butane in the dab product itself or maybe it's a bit of both? it's difficult to know for sure & thats before we get to the fact the observer is wasted....goes without saying it will be near impossible for any meaningful science-led data collecting on the subject.

    There will also be a ramp-up: 0-->adverse symptoms, what are the effects of being subjected to this ramp-up daily over a period of years( if bho is your thing )? ...again no one knows, unless someone can provide links to multiple *studies based on large, diverse data sets going over several decades.

    *studies dealing with bho specifically not unrelated, so no A = B so B must also = C or thats-true-so-this-must-also-be-true type studies or popular journalistic articles about studies or youtube videos :)
    -------------------------------------------

    The thing I don't understand about this topic is why so many people seem resistant to Butane free concentrate?

    Good BHO can be produced with very tiny amounts( 5-10ppm) of Butane, if the consumer continues to demand clean product and votes with their dollars then clean product & techniques to make(&test) clean product we shall have.
    Last edited: Jun 12, 2014
  14. Bouldorado

    Bouldorado Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    929
    Location:
    CO
    Some people may seem resistant to butane free concentrate, because as @max said, unless you're inhaling excessive amounts of butane, the health effects are negligible.

    Here's a gov't study on butane. Scroll down to average daily intake, and you'll find an estimated daily exposure:

    "According to the National Ambient Volatile Organic Compounds (VOCs) Database, the median urban atmospheric concn of n-butane is 9.174 ppbV for 546 samples(1). Based upon this figure and the value for average daily inhalation by a human adult of 20 cu m of air, the average daily intake of n-butane via air is 183 mg."

    Peer reviewed so I'd consider it trustworthy. Anyways, 183 mg of butane. Makes 1000ppm seem like nothing.
    Last edited: Jun 12, 2014
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