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Bongs vs Low & Slow

Discussion in 'Vaporization Discussion' started by TeeJay1952, May 2, 2014.

  1. TeeJay1952

    TeeJay1952 Well-Known Member

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    I am curious about the fascination of water tools (bongs) with vaporizing. I can see how the bong lets you cool (dissipate) vapor but if there is more vapor in your lungs ...and then you exhale it (painting the air with your meds) you lose the possibility of medication from the cloud. I much prefer less of a hit, held longer (stir that bowl! and count to ten).

    My theory is that vaping is better than combustion because the we don't burn everything up in a conflagration. Our lungs are not filled with smoke and we ingest available meds in a greater proportion than if we have combustion. By slowing down the process we have greater exposure to meds and our ability to absorb them.

    If you watch the many various videos of vapor bonging you see the money shot is the exhale. We see the tremendous hits inhaled and then the users paint the air with their meds. Looks like fun but how effective is that?

    All that being said I haven't "bonged" since switching to vapor. Your Mileage May Vary, results are not guaranteed and I am in a minority.
     
  2. Grim Chiclets

    Grim Chiclets Well-Known Member

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    Whenever I ghost hit, I get too vaked and the room spins- only reason I like clouds
     
  3. MinnBobber

    MinnBobber Well-Known Member

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    Me too, low and slow is the way to go. Shortest vapor path so purest flavor. IMO, see no need for water to change the flavor in any way.
    If I wanted monster hits, then water might be the way to go.
    My money shot is nothing visible on the exhale---all the goodness and flavor is in my mouth and lungs.

    Fine for others to use water but not for me
     
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  4. SSVUN~YAH

    SSVUN~YAH You Must Unlearn, What You Have Learned...

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  5. RUDE BOY

    RUDE BOY Space is the Place

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    Water Tools are used for different reasons. I have a couple smaller pieces that really help smooth out the vapor when for whatever reason I'm gonna cough with every hit, Helps a lot.

    Then I have a larger bubbler that's for taking giant ass hits. And yes it can be worth it if you want the effects of getting a quick kick in the head from your bud and you don't mind a coughing fit. Most of the time I do enjoy long drawn out sessions starting at lower temps and ending around 400F-410F then sometimes I wanna get wasted fast.

    Options are always nice to stave off boredom. I like direct draw, whips and water tools, low temps, high temps. Mix it up and have fun.
     
  6. syrupy

    syrupy fumed

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    I just like the sight of water bubbling like an ancient volcano's lava.
     
  7. Abysmal Vapor

    Abysmal Vapor Shaman of The Pyramid of Orlin'Malah

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    +1 :D .. I do some fat rips to get into space.. and switch to low and slow for taste and efficiency to keep me up and amused :)
     
  8. lwien

    lwien Well-Known Member

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    I don't use water to cool my vapor. I use very warm water to moisturize it, which for me, allows my lungs to better absorb whatever I am inhaling. Just helps to open things up.
     
  9. FlyingLow

    FlyingLow Team NO SLEEP!

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    I am also a fan of using warm water every so often. But, keep in mind though, even using 210*F (nearly boiling) water, you are still using water to cool the vapor. By it's very definition water is a cooler medium than vapor. Most of us are vaping between 280* and 400*F, some choosing to vape at even higher temps. By comparison, water boils at 212*F
     
  10. lwien

    lwien Well-Known Member

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    Do you know the temp of the vapor AFTER it leaves the herb, after it travels through the screen in the WPA, travels down the downstem and enters the bong before it hits the water?

    I would venture a guess that it's cooler than the very warm water that I fill my bong with, but that's just a guess.

    What's kinda interesting with your quote above is that boiling water at 212 degrees would cause my skin to burn but yet, this is not the case with vapor coming out of our vaporizers, regardless of the temp that it is vaped at, eh?
     
    Last edited: May 2, 2014
  11. Puffers

    Puffers Micro-Climate Mastermind

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    I know that when I use my mechanical mod ecig even vaping at over 60 watts with super sub ohm coils the vapor feels very cool. I am wondering if the state change from liquid to gas makes it cooler... And if a similar but less dramatic effect might be at work here also.
     
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  12. FlyingLow

    FlyingLow Team NO SLEEP!

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    That is clever! Perhaps someone with some physics experience might chime in here... I am not sure why that is, but it is true. I have spilt boiling water before, and as one might assume- it burns like hell. At the same time, I regularly vape to over 400* and at worst all I get is mild throat irritation.:hmm:
     
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  13. MinnBobber

    MinnBobber Well-Known Member

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    I believe it's because of the mass/density element. If you heat a cup of water to just under boiling and pour it thru a 4" tube it will still be hotter than h@ll. It has a lot of mass that is energized. It takes longer to heat up AND then longer to cool down.
    A cup of 400 degree vapor has little mass/density. It quickly heats up to 400 degrees and then quickly cools from 400 down to an easily inhaled temp.
     
    Last edited: May 2, 2014
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  14. Caligula

    Caligula *results not typical.

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    Wat? I couldn't hear you over all the awesome.

     
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  15. 4tokin

    4tokin Well-Known Member

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    Probably similar to when some one is showering and the room is full of steam.
     
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  16. syrupy

    syrupy fumed

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    You kind of answered your own question. @lwien pointed it out in his questions too. The temperature of vapor decreases greatly as it travels to your mouth. I don't need to know the physics behind it. We can investigate it through our sense of temperature sensitivity. Drink a hot cup of coffee or tea, and feel how hot it is in your mouth. Then take a vape, and sense how hot the vapor feels. There's no comparison which is hotter. Even a tool with a short vapor path like the MFLB will never get us hot as a piping cup of coffee.
     
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  17. herbivore21

    herbivore21 Well-Known Member

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    Water is for high heat vaping, unless you wanna cough your gizzards up every time you toke.

    I love dry vaping flowers and kief (separately), but when I get to the temps where I get the most out of kief or any concentrates, I need to go to a water tool or I am coughing like I'm gonna die!

    As was said here, there are various different kinds of bubblers and dry pipes that suit various different situations. If I wanna get sky high and listen to some Hendrix for the day, I go straight to the bubbler and hit some QWISO/Kief doughballs, then go to dry kief and dry flower hits for the rest of the day to keep me floating.

    Today is one of those days.
     
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  18. Quetzalcoatl

    Quetzalcoatl SPACE GOD

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    The worst you can really get is hitting concentrates on the trays at max with the power adapter and a Launch Box, with no stem (native). It'll irritate your tongue for sure since it's concentrated on one point, but as to why it doesn't burn your lungs up, @MinnBobber has that covered.

    I like direct draw. I can start on level 2 with my Solo and slowly work my way up to 4 over the session. I can go up to 5 if I really want to but I don't care much for the taste of it directly and the vapor starts to become a little warm to me. Direct draw is what I do first with every new strain I get. I do a few different kinds of sessions, one at just 2, one at 2-4, and then one each of the two on my j-hook. Part of what attracts me to vaporizing is the "ritual" aspect of it. I don't really have much order in my life due to a health issue so being able to do that same thing with a cup of tea and some music is a nice way to put a few hours aside.

    There's another aspect to it as well that I usually enjoy, and that's the taste and smell of it. Relaxing aromatherapy where I try to figure out what X tastes like, how fragrant and light Y is, etc. I say usually because I will occasionally get a strain that tastes weird. It's usually not because it wasn't flushed (it is) but just the specific strain. Once, long ago, I had a Blackberry Kush that was the cannabic reincarnation of grandpa's sweaty feet and a duffle bag of sweaty gym socks left in a hot car for a week :ko: Of course it was dank as fuck but the smell was ridiculous!!

    Like I said I have a health issue which causes chronic pain and nausea from my medications (trying to stay on the lowest dose of everything I can) which in turn really messes with my appetite. When I wake up at 3 in the morning after 2 hours of sleep breaking out in a cold sweat, lips tingling, salivating, and feeling my face flushing constantly... I don't have time for going upstairs to draw up a cup of hot water and having a snack. I need something that will work yesterday and I couldn't care less about how "it resembles such and such parent but with this cross instead of that one" or whatever. I also seem to give flavor a pass more often when my pain is causing me to have a hard time walking or moving around. It's that or more pills, after a while you start to involuntarily not want to swallow the pill all of a sudden, and you're miserable with or without it for the next 25-40 minutes anyways. A couple nice pulls of your choice through the 2 footer will set you back about 10 minutes max before you're feeling it (setting up and everything, unless you have an Evo or Sublimator or similar)?

    Whether it's recreational or medical I find that direct draw can result in surprisingly strong effects with excellent taste, and while water paths sacrifice some taste they provide a quick wallop that you can't get as fast otherwise. The water cooling/moisturizing the vapor is just helping you take bigger hits, it's up to you to hold them or not. I find that 5-7 seconds is fine for me. Sometimes I'll go longer (up to 15-20 seconds if I care) but it's all personal preference.

    And you'll have to excuse this essay of a post... it's being sponsored by about a quarter gram of kief in my Solo through a bubbler :science:
     
  19. Detonator

    Detonator Well-Known Member

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    257
    with concentrate I use no water, but flower I use water, hot water is awesome when vaporizing weed I've gone very hot like boiling water pour in then let it cool for just a min.... hot water is really diff.

    I've also just stuck on Sublimator in the down stem and turn the whole thing upside down and hit that - looks like your shooting yourself - do some shatter in a sublimator like that and you will know what Direct means, lol
     
    Last edited: May 3, 2014
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  20. lwien

    lwien Well-Known Member

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    For me, water that is too hot is more uncomfortable than no water at all.
     
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  21. flotntoke

    flotntoke thoroughly vaped

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    539
    No matter how large or cloudy the hit, your lungs can only absorb so much vapor without fresh air or oxygen. IMO large hits are pretty wasteful - tho fun!

    Don't do it all the time, but when I want to get really ripped pretty fast I take larger, cloudier hits and try to only exhale 1/2 of it then inhale fresh air on top of it. Do this a few times for each of 3 or 4 hits and it seems to work pretty well. I'm no scientist or doctor, so it may just be I get more buzzed due to lack of oxygen. But, I am a pragmatist and can testify this works very well when you're in a hurry to get there! The level of buzz seems to linger a bit longer, also. Then again.... I've learned not to trust such judgements too much when I'm vaked silly, so ymmv.
     
  22. Hippie Dickie

    Hippie Dickie The Herbal Cube Manufacturer

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    must be my advanced age (66 2/12) or something, but i eschew bongs/water tools. i'm OCD enough that i would have to clean the glassware every session (or really hate the process as it's going on).

    i recognize i'm a special case, in that i have a personal, direct, intimate relationship with my vape. hell, i've seen her with her clothes off - we have no secrets - i usually spend the first 60 seconds of the session, during the warm up (foreplay), running the algorithm in my head while she does the same. (trust but verify, eh?)

    and the draw tube just doesn't get that messed up - once a week or so (say, 35 sessions) i will run a paper towel through the draw tube, depending on the dankosity of the herb - so, usually (unfortunately), not an issue. for an all glass vape, it is very low maintenance - a toothpick cleans a blocked hole in the vial or draw tube.

    and, definitely, long and slow ... the herb needs to be gently embraced by the warm breeze. i absolutely love to see the draw tube go white with vapor, and feel (and sometimes taste) the vapor streaming in - puts a smile on my face every single time. slow: about 15 seconds, followed by some fresh air to complete the inhale. i only clear the draw tube before a stir and after the session. total session time is 7.5 minutes. with an occasional (again, depending on dankosity) 3 minute extension. (i'm thinking about doubling this.)

    damn, got wordy there ... classic avoidance strategy ... back to work.
     
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  23. Caligula

    Caligula *results not typical.

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    Location:
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    Whats the difference between a glass draw tube accumulating buildup and a glass WT like a bong? Seems like the only extra step involved here would be rinsing the glass and changing the water?

    Doesn't seem like too much of a chore... at least to me anyway. Also, I'd think that the buildup from the vapor would be considerably less noticeable over the (much) larger surface area of a WT. In fact I'd say buildup is much less than any dry piece regardless of surface area, if you use CE or Resblock in conjunction with the water.
     
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  24. herbivore21

    herbivore21 Well-Known Member

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    @Hippie Dickie gotta agree with Caligula here: my dry pipe is actually harder to clean than my water tool. It gets absolutely filthy from much less use than my bubbler does. Still love dry hits. I get it though man, I have a lot of friends who are your age (almost all who still combust rather than vape), and it seems a generational thing that water tools are eschewed both by older vapists and smokers. I actually hated bongs until I went to vaping. Vaping through water and smoking through water are completely different ball parks.

    Bongs don't get disgusting when you vape through them in the same way as combusting through them. Old habits die hard too, I know it took forever to kick my spliff habit to stick to vaping (still a work in progress, but almost completely there :D ).

    I too am fastidious about cleaning my glass as you would be. It really makes all the difference having clean vaping implements! I have also seen my vapes with their clothes off (and performed repairs/diagnostics on my Nano myself).

    There are different cases though where water is called for. High heat dry vapor (hotter than 7 on my E-Nano) causes me to cough more than any smoked/vaped ingestion of any drug I've ever tried (READ: A LOT OF DIFFERENT, SOME QUITE DANGEROUS DRUGS!). I can enjoy kief and flowers at these temps very well. However, my oilier concentrates require considerably more heat to get everything out of them. This is where water comes into play. I don't mind about losing resin to the glass as it just means more oil for later :)

    Still, I do try to dry vape my kief and flower as much as possible, to get that amazing taste out of it!
     
  25. Deja Vu

    Deja Vu Show compassion to animals

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    It's also a visual thing for me too. It also helps if you have a sexy tornado recycler or something else to stare deeply into while you vape :)
     
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