Best of the Magic-Flight Box thread

Discussion in 'Best Of' started by magicflight, May 16, 2009.

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  1. magicflight

    magicflight Manufacturer Manufacturer

    Messages:
    671
    Location:
    USA
    Hi,

    We have wondered that exact same thing ourselves -- its a question that needs to be asked of the vendor for the butcher block oil. For our purposes, the important part is the FDA certification. We require certain assurances that the (otherwise minimal) finish is absolutely safe to use, and we get them so as to be sure that what we are selling is a good product for everyone.

    People are welcome to reapply the finish at any time themselves so as to preserve the natural color of the wood. We recommend the Jasco brand -- they have an off the shelf consumer version that is generally available.

    -- Magic-flight

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    Last edited by a moderator: Dec 26, 2014
  2. MoeOnTheMoon

    MoeOnTheMoon Medical Marijuana Activist Company Rep

    Messages:
    566
    Location:
    S. California
    Don't read this - it's long - unless you're interested in putting cheap oil on your wooden vapes like the Launch Box to preserve the wood:

    Magic-flight, I certainly understand and appreciate your using FDA approved butcher block oil and think you are absolutely correct in doing so, just to be safe. That is just another example of how customer-oriented you are and we appreciate it!

    The following is only for those who want to preserve their wood on the LB and perhaps on other vapes etc, who do not want to shell out the $ for "butchers block oil", which tends to be a little pricey:

    My research on using oil on my wooden cutting board led me to believe that plain old mineral oil is just as good and WAY cheaper for personal home use. I put some mineral oil on my MZ and it worked great, darkened up the wood a little and it feels much less dry. I also use it on my cutting board and some wooden carvings I have.

    As to whether or not butcher block oil is better in any way than mineral oil, I don't really know, though I've read some opinions on the web that say it is not.

    I did find this:
    "MOST block oils are just food grade mineral oil. The cheapest version of this, as you stated, is laxative mineral oil from the pharmacy. I can't comment on any others but Boos oil contains mineral, linseed, and tung oil. The latter two are drying oils which cure to a harder state to form a cross-linked polymer. From my experience this oil seals much better and lasts much longer than anything else I've used. It does impart a deeper yellow color than mineral oil though."

    I also found some info that says the manufacturers of wooden cutting boards use mineral oil on them before selling them. This leads me to believe that Magic-Flight could save some money by also using mineral oil if they wanted to.

    And this:
    "Mineral Oil is the most traditional finish for a butcher block. Used for years by butchers around the world to keep their blocks in good shape. All of our cutting boards come standard with mineral oil and countertops, island tops or workbenches can be purchased with this finish as an option. When applied, Mineral Oil seals the pores of the wood blocking the penetration of moisture. This of course extends the life of the Butcher Block. While Mineral Oil is a great finish it does require maintenance. This is highly dependant on the environment and the amount of use the surface gets. The owner of an oiled block should be sensitive to the color and feel of the block. When the block begins to look dry the block should be re-oiled. We do NOT recommend any oil made of vegetable or animal fats. These types of oils run the risk of going rancid and can be a health issue. Mineral oil remains safe throughout its life.

    Pure mineral oil can be purchased at your local drug store."

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    Last edited by a moderator: Dec 26, 2014
  3. magicflight

    magicflight Manufacturer Manufacturer

    Messages:
    671
    Location:
    USA
    Hi,

    First off, we will be updating the brushes to be a little stiffer -- this will probably help with cleaning. Also, dont forget to use a little ISO to finish -- will help with the stickiness.

    Yes. This has been thought of.

    With batteries, until the battery runs out. Leaving the battery in overlong could potentially overheat the battery, but will not damage the Box.

    With the power adapter, the Box cannot be left on (high power) for more than 12 minutes continuously.

    No. The bonding energy is *much* higher than the operating energy. There are no situations where the bonding is at risk from overheating with time and a battery. The main concerns with the screen are mechanical (pulling, tearing, puncture, etc).

    You are most welcome! We would love to hear stories of the most interesting/unlikely places where the Box has been used. I am sure that other readers would be interested too. Who has the most outrageous story?

    -- Magic-flight

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    Last edited by a moderator: Dec 26, 2014
  4. Haywood

    Haywood Onward Thru the Fog

    Messages:
    623
    I don't know about "outrageous", but I've used the Launch Box at the White House. More than once.

    Really.

    Haywood

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    Last edited by a moderator: Dec 26, 2014
    MrNaturalAZ likes this.
  5. magicflight

    magicflight Manufacturer Manufacturer

    Messages:
    671
    Location:
    USA
    Insofar as the power requirements of the Box can be calculated (assuming sufficient physics/math skills) or directly measured (assuming that someone is willing to go through a fair bit of setup effort), they are not regarded as 'trade secrets'. However, there are a fair number of subtleties associated with powering the Box -- it is the case that the batteries power the Box in a difficult to emulate manner. The basic demand load is about 0.75 volts with a current draw of about 15 amps. At about 12 watts, this is -- by a huge margin -- the lowest power consumption and most energy efficient commercial/practical vaporizer on the planet! Only in the Lab have we been able to do any better with a custom (fully functional and optimized) vaporizer able to run on a mere 4 watts -- without a doubt THE worlds record in that regard (the details of this design, are however, a secret).

    Our production power supply is capable of delivering a fully regulated temperature compensated 16 amps at 1.42 volts, and has a tuning screw to set the constant operating voltage at 0.71, (or higher if people want their units hotter). The power converter is expected to operate at about 93% efficiency (still being confirmed in testing). All of this, and a push-button switch, fits in a standard AA package format -- a rather remarkable achievement in itself (but that is another story). As you can easily see, such specifications are very uncommon indeed -- very unlikely that most bench-top power systems will have any chance with it. Also, as a purely custom converter, these are difficult and expensive to build (particularly since they involve somewhat rare and exotic parts -- to our misfortune and delayed schedules).

    -- Magic-flight

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  6. magicflight

    magicflight Manufacturer Manufacturer

    Messages:
    671
    Location:
    USA
    Hi,

    In regards to the paper ring on the positive end of the battery, it is our opinion that it does not much matter. We leave them on only for cosmetic reasons and remove them if they ever come loose or get in the way.

    Also, people should note that as of Jan 1 2010, we have been shipping Eneloop batteries exclusively as bundled with the Box. The battery maker claims 2000 mAh on the label, but your mileage may vary.

    Chainsawdomy (and others) who are reporting that the screen is permitting materials to pass into the draw channel, our recommendation is to use a flat toothpick to push the screen back into the groove provided for it. If necessary, a broken off part of a toothpick can be used as a wedge to hold the screen in place. If these approaches do not work, it is recommended that you contact us privately by email so that we can diagnose a little more closely and figure out some working option for you.

    In_Rainbows: please contact us via email for further assistance/diagnosis.

    -- Magic-flight

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    Last edited by a moderator: Dec 26, 2014
  7. magicflight

    magicflight Manufacturer Manufacturer

    Messages:
    671
    Location:
    USA
    Hi,

    Going a 'little' past the shoulders is probably ok (not recommended), but filling completely all the way to the cover is definitely not ok. When overfilling, the issues are 1) there is no room the the material to move when shaking (which is important for providing even heating), and 2) there is no room for the cyclic airflow patterns over the top of the load (which also contributes to even heating). Also, any material not near the trench is not going to get heat, and will not therefore get vaped. As such, overfilling will lead to much reduced efficiency.

    -- Magic-flight

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    Last edited by a moderator: Dec 26, 2014
  8. magicflight

    magicflight Manufacturer Manufacturer

    Messages:
    671
    Location:
    USA
    Hi,

    It depends on the construction of the device, but in general it is a risk. The problem is that most devices use two batteries in series, usually packed right next to one another. In that case, one of the batteries can side short -- releasing a LOT of heat and potentially damaging the device. The labels DO have a safety function in that they make it much harder to accidentally short the battery, particularly when it is in some device. The best recommendation is to put tape over the battery so as to have the same coverage as the original label. Leave the two ends uncovered, but completely wrap the main body of the battery with exactly one layer of tape with no gaps.

    IMPORTANT: Peeled batteries should only be used with the Box. If wanting to use the batteries in other devices -- make a new covering for the battery! Failure to do so can result in device and/or battery damage.

    Depending on the details of the specific device, you might get away with it, but I would not recommend trying the test without really understanding what is involved.

    -- Magic-flight

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    Last edited by a moderator: Dec 26, 2014
  9. magicflight

    magicflight Manufacturer Manufacturer

    Messages:
    671
    Location:
    USA
    Hi LockStock93,

    One thing you might try to remove any residual smells is to clean the Box as best you can with the provided brush and some ISO, and with it empty and the lid open, put the battery in with firm contact for 1 or 2 minutes. Check the battery from time to time to ensure that it is not getting too hot -- ie, don't let it get any hotter than fresh cup of coffee.

    Another trick you might try (after the above) is to blow a lot of warm air through the Box (lid open again) with a hair-drier. If you try this be very sure that the lid is completely open and as far from the hot air stream from the hair-drier as possible (else the cover will soften and distort shape). A couple of minutes of this treatment should be plenty, if it is needed at all.

    -- Magic-flight

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    Last edited by a moderator: Dec 26, 2014
  10. magicflight

    magicflight Manufacturer Manufacturer

    Messages:
    671
    Location:
    USA
    A minor design point with the Box is that it can be used in native mode while lying down flat on your back. The draw hole is positioned near the bottom edge of the Box allowing for one to hold the Box overhand (if you are right handed) and still be able to draw from the Box while keeping it level to the floor. Your lower lip would be on the bottom face of the Box and the upper lip is just above the draw hole. This makes using the Box accessible to people who are in a bed and cannot raise their head up (for whatever reason).

    -- Magic-flight

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    Last edited by a moderator: Dec 26, 2014
  11. magicflight

    magicflight Manufacturer Manufacturer

    Messages:
    671
    Location:
    USA
    We recommend using the Box native -- without any stem at all. This has the dual advantage of not confining and directing the vapor stream to any one spot (avoids the issue mentioned above) and allows for greater sensitivity to taste. Personally, we agree that the long whip attachment is somewhat awkward -- we provide them due to continuing popular request and because we have no better alternative at this time.

    -- Magic-flight

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    Last edited by a moderator: Dec 26, 2014
  12. magicflight

    magicflight Manufacturer Manufacturer

    Messages:
    671
    Location:
    USA
    Hi,

    ISO is fine when applied to the screen with the brush or q-tip, but do not soak/dunk the whole Box. Also, a certain amount of screen discoloring is normal and probably does not require cleaning -- the Box was designed to not to really need it. Another approach is to let the Box heat with the battery for a minute or two with it empty and the lid open to burn off any residue. This will not affect the color but will ensure that the Box is clean.

    There are other comments/remarks elsewhere in the thread -- may wish to read back some pages for more info.

    -- Magic-flight

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  13. magicflight

    magicflight Manufacturer Manufacturer

    Messages:
    671
    Location:
    USA
    Hi Progress,

    Sorry for the long delay in responding to your questions -- we have been on the road a lot lately and have not had a chance to check in for awhile.

    We recommend fully charged batteries for performance reasons only -- so that people get the best possible experience with the Box, particularly on their first try when they are just learning how to use it. There are no problems with using partially charged batteries, as long as there is enough charge for them to be usable/useful.

    There is also no issue with cycling batteries through the charger as you describe. However, it is recommended that you let the charger complete its charge cycle whenever possible as the microprocessor in the charger may attempt to implement a conditioning cycle on the batteries. If it senses that the battery is low, it may discharge the battery before recharging it so as to extend the battery life. The charger that is being shipped is a smart charger and is designed to make the batteries last as long as possible.

    Yes, it is OK to do this, as long as you perform these steps in immediate sequence. This is a technique that anyone can use once they have become fairly familiar with the performance characteristics of the Box, etc. The fast cycling method is an alternative for using the Box, but requires that the person be fairly accurate in their timing, else they will either get too little vapor or significantly changed taste.

    -- Magic-flight

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    Last edited by a moderator: Dec 26, 2014
  14. magicflight

    magicflight Manufacturer Manufacturer

    Messages:
    671
    Location:
    USA
    Part of the reason is that, used as directed, the Box only produces vapor when you need it -- there is never any vapor/odor directly vented to the room. Most vaporizers, once started, will also stay going until the load is completely spent (constant heating). Since the user can only take in vapor intermittently with the breath, that means that with most vaporizers there will always be occasions where the heated materials will be venting to the room -- hence the smell. With the Box, the heating is itself intermittent and matches consumption. The user consumes and adsorbs the smell along with the medicine -- hence no aroma is ever directly vented to the room.

    The Box is designed to produce only as much vapor as the lungs are likely to adsorb, whereas most others vaporizers are designed to produce a significant excess of vapor (looks more impressive). This has the dual advantage of both being more efficient in delivery as well as being more discrete. As with viability of exhaled vapor being an indication that better performance/technique is possible, excess smell is also an indicator of potential improvements in the usage pattern. Unlikely as it may seem to some, it is possible to get full medicinal effects from the Box with nearly zero resulting additional smell in the room (ie, any odor more than the baseline of what the unheated load would produce in an unused Box). Again, effective and optimized user technique makes all of the difference with the Box.

    -- Magic-Flight

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    Last edited by a moderator: Dec 26, 2014
  15. magicflight

    magicflight Manufacturer Manufacturer

    Messages:
    671
    Location:
    USA
    Hi,

    Little bit of trivia -- the design size of the draw hole on the Box was originally sized to be compatible with one of the common straw sizes used in many fast food restaurants, and I believe that specification is still unchanged. In a pinch, you might collect and try some soda straws and see if you can find a match. That and a pair of scissors, you might get a temporary solution. Of course, the specifically manufactured version is more likely to be useful.

    -- Magic-flight

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  16. steiner666

    steiner666 Serial vapist

    Messages:
    1,068
    Location:
    Lost in the clouds
    pretty much:
    grind herb up fine as possible

    fill to almost level, i usually fill it about 3/4 way though, make sure its all in the trench

    put a fresh battery in and look down the suck-hole, make sure you see the LED (if yours has one) light up pretty brightly. If you dont see it light or if its dim, twist/wiggle the battery a bit until it is.

    once you see vapor start forming and escaping the hole, start sucking as slowly as you can. I sometimes have trouble hitting my LB because of how soft i have to hit it, I have a hard time gettin my hit speed that low if i'm taking it right to the lungs, so i kinda use my mouse/throat to pull, hard to explain. I usually try to make my hits last as long as i can, 15-20 seconds is ideal.

    a second or two before you stop hitting, pull the battery, which of course gives a bigger flow of air to clear the trench area of any vapor still in there.

    turn LB up-side-down to get the herb away from the heat source while you're not hittting it.

    shake it all around, turn it right-side-up, shake it side to side to get stuff in trench, and repeat.

    Try hitting it with and without the stems. Make sure your lips aren't blocking the holes and keeping you from getting a good hit.

    it took me a while to get the hang of the LB (a lot longer than my DBV, which just came more natural to me, since you can hit it however fast you want by adjusting temp). The herb i had when i first got mine was really moist, so i had trouble getting it to vape in the LB or getting it ground down as fine as i wanted it. What i ended up doing was grinding up the whole bag and sitting it out on a tray to dry for a while, and then i would regrind the stuff even finer in a small grinder b4 loading it. Helped a good bit, but a different drier type of herb helped even more.

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    Last edited by a moderator: Dec 26, 2014
  17. magicflight

    magicflight Manufacturer Manufacturer

    Messages:
    671
    Location:
    USA
    Hi,

    A minute or two of ISO for cleaning the stem should not be any sort of problem. The previous issue was from a long time soak of several hours.

    -- Magic-Flight

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    Last edited by a moderator: Dec 26, 2014
  18. magicflight

    magicflight Manufacturer Manufacturer

    Messages:
    671
    Location:
    USA
    Hi,

    With the box open and empty (brushed out), put a fresh battery in and let the screen bake itself clean (a minute or so of battery heating time). Let cool, brush out again, and then use ISO and a Q-tip to remove anything that remains. This is the usual approach and should work for most things. Note -- this is to open
    the screen -- not to change its color. It is normal for the screen to be a brown or darker color -- this has no effect on the operation of the Box.

    -- Magic-flight

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  19. chloe

    chloe Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    156
    From my experience, even though there is no temp. control via battery (although I do recall MF stating that the power module may be able to control temp), once you get the hang of it, you can control how thick the vapor is and how cool it is...for instance, if you want cool vapor, just use the hose..feels like your just sucking in air....or alternatively draw faster...there are many ways to control these variables..such as even while drawing, say after the first 10secs, give it a quick shake so you expose fresh herb to the heating element and continue to draw so it doesn't combust...you can leave the battery in longer before drawing to create thicker clouds or draw within a few secs so it doesn't get too hot...

    but personally, i can only compare this to a few other vaporizers (VW and buddha)..and this LB is my fav....

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    Last edited by a moderator: Dec 26, 2014
  20. magicflight

    magicflight Manufacturer Manufacturer

    Messages:
    671
    Location:
    USA
    Hi Obelisk,

    Give your clearly stated objectives above: that evenness and completeness of extraction (extraction efficiency) as being of a higher priority than any other, I would not recommend purchasing the LB! As the manufacturer of the device and as someone who is knowledgeable about the design, etc, I can state positively that the LB was not designed for perfect extraction -- rather it was designed for convenience.

    For perfect extraction, you need to consider lab chemical methods first, and then perhaps fractional distillation as a distant second. Even reference standard lab grade vaporization equipment is not going to give you perfect extraction -- and such equipment is FAR from portable. Even if such equipment was generally available -- which it certainly is not -- it would be too complicated for anyone without special training to operate! Inconvenient to the max.

    In any design, there are multiple, sometimes competing, objectives to be attained. Ultimately, decisions are made about which objectives exactly are going to have a higher priority than which others. Convenience, as measured in terms of availability/portability, reliability, ease of use, stealth, is/was considered to be of a higher priority than simple measures of total herb extraction. Furthermore, the notion of herb extraction 'efficiency' is considered to be significantly less important than the overall measure of the average rate of delivery and total bio-available yield of medicinal components. For example, simply getting the actives out of the herb basis and then letting it condense on some tubing sidewall somewhere is NOT making those actives bio available. Measuring how much active component is left in the spent ABV is NOT therefore an indication of how much was bio available -- in many (most, if not nearly all?) vaporizer devices simply vent a large portion of vapor to the air (by delivering at a greater than bio-adsorption rate) or allowing it to condense somewhere. The real measure of interest is the actual bio-delivery efficiency of the device. Which is better: A device that extracts 95% from the herb but then looses 60% of the actives to indirect venting or condensation, or a device which extracts 70% of the actives but then ultimately delivers nearly 90% of that extract to the bloodstream? Which would you rather have: a device where the ABV looks good, or one which actually gets the job done?

    This whole over-driven emphasis on "extraction efficiency" and "ABV examination" is completely bogus marketing hype and does nothing to actually educate the potential vaporizer buyer. Metaphorically, it is a bit like trying to decide what car to buy based *solely* on the criteria of how much unburnt gasoline passes through the engine unburned -- while all along completely ignoring the facts that the transmission might only allow you to go into second gear, the tires are under-inflated or flat, and there is no power steering at all. Sure the engine runs fine and you *could* drive it if you really had to, but it would definitely be so inconvenient to operate that you only rarely actually use it -- rendering the efficiency of the engine's capability to completely burn the gasoline a totally moot point. Personally, I would rather have a car that is decent to actually use and actually gets me where I want to go -- even if there is some unconsumed fuel lost along the way. The real important metric to measure is how many dollars I have to spend every day getting where I need to go, not whether every single drop of purchased fuel is actually burned by the engine. If overall I am buying less fuel every day, than it is a win even if that particular car is less than totally perfect in its engine efficiency.

    Overall, my suggestion to you Obelisk is to either love the Box for what it is or to get rid of it -- give it away or sell it to someone else who might benefit. Trying to coerce the Box into being something it is not is only going to lead to disappointment and frustration all around. The Box is about convenience first, and then absolute bio-delivery efficiency second -- it was never about simple post-op 'extraction' efficiency.

    This reference to the factor of convenience being important is somewhat ironic. No one requires you to keep the ABV -- go ahead and dump it if you find that keeping it is inconvenient. The wonderful thing about life is that we each to get to decide for ourselves what we think is important, what matters to us. You are of course, welcome to your own opinions on that -- indeed this ability to choose, and re-choose for ourselves, is ultimately the basis of all freedom. Please have some (freedom, that is!)

    -- Magic-Flight

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    Last edited by a moderator: Dec 26, 2014
  21. magicflight

    magicflight Manufacturer Manufacturer

    Messages:
    671
    Location:
    USA
    Hi Obelisk,

    It is entirely possible -- and for that I apologize. I will attempt to answer your questions.

    This is true, and largely a function of the usage technique. The pictures posted probably represent a lot of different situations, and also reflect multiple and widely different user prefaces. Some people like to optimize for a light taste, and are willing to discard a complete load when the taste begins to shift even a little bit (cost of herb is not so important to them). Others like to optimize for total effect, and will want to cook it down to a dark brown (they used to be smokers, and want a similar rush). Depending on this, photos of the results are going to vary widely. Some people will dedicate considerable time and care to getting their technique "just so", optimizing constantly, whereas others really don't care about the fine points and are simply interested in a quick and stealthy hit. However, in each case, good technique will result in a better quality result (whatever that means -- in this case, more even, less green, if that is what you want). The hazard here is judging the results of other peoples techniques without knowing our own assumptions as to what is best, preferred, or tried for.

    Higher temperatures and also longer times -- together both will make the result darker and generally indicate a more complete extraction. Note that "Complete" here refers to the variety and range of actives extracted, rather than the measure/degree that any one particular active is extracted. In general, higher temperatures are needed to get the more "body oriented" effects. Middle temperatures are needed for THC related mind/energy effects, and lighter temperatures for the aromatics (taste components). The number of seconds of battery and hitting time (the technique) will determine what temp range is extracted.

    The degree of evenness is primarily a result of four factors: 1) the degree of load mixing (via stirring, tumbling, or shaking), 2) the fineness of the grind, 3) the volume of the load, and 4) the average length of time in any given heating cycle (or hit). To achieve optimal evenness: grind fine, load less, heat longer (but don't wait for the battery!), and mix/shake often and thoroughly. Under these conditions the Box can deliver very even and complete extractions. For the sake of objectivity, I will leave it to those members of FC who optimize their technique in this manner to post pictures of evenly cooked ABV loads to validate this.

    This is a good forum question -- I shall leave it to the members of the forum to speak out as they will. My personal experience is that most people toss the ABV. That may simply be the result of a local cultural effect, however.

    Understood -- none taken -- apology accepted, etc.

    -- Magic-Flight

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    Last edited by a moderator: Dec 26, 2014
  22. magicflight

    magicflight Manufacturer Manufacturer

    Messages:
    671
    Location:
    USA
    Hi,

    The reason I did not suggest baking is that even that can cause many of the lighter aromatics and some of the active volatiles to be lost. Further, the digestive system can also degrade some components, making them less bio-available. However, baking does have the unexpected advantage that some of the first level reductions in the liver are ALSO mind-active, thus creating something of a 'second wave' of effects. This is not something that is generally available via vapor ingestion, nor are they components that are extracted, and thus cannot be counted towards the absolute extraction efficiency. Finally, it has been observed that more material overall must be used in baking to achieve a threshold effect than would be needed with vapor -- partly this is the result of the time dilution of effects via digestion relative to those via the lungs.

    Thank you for being an example of what I posted earlier -- every persons method of usage is valid, as long as they are happy with it.

    -- Magic-Flight

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  23. momofthegoons

    momofthegoons vapor accessory addict

    Messages:
    12,725
    Not that I consider myself an authority, but I think I can answer this. You wont really see vapor through the lid, you see it coming at you through the stem after a couple of seconds. With a fresh battery, it will happen faster and thicker. The only time I've seen anything under the lid is when I've combusted by leaving the battery in when I wasn't drawing or if I didn't empty the stem of vapor during my hit.

    How long you let the battery make contact also is somewhat determined by how freshly charged the battery is. A weaker battery will need to make contact for a longer period of time. It also depends on your draw. I keep my battery in contact as long as I am drawing and withdraw it just before I can't hit it anymore. That way none of the vapor in the stem is wasted.

    Try looking directly into the stem after making contact with the battery. You should be able to see the vapor approaching.

    Hope this helps. :)

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  24. magicflight

    magicflight Manufacturer Manufacturer

    Messages:
    671
    Location:
    USA
    Hi,

    Agreed, you observations are most likely to be the result of a poor contact with the circular wire ring. The shine/silver is ok -- what matters is that the ring makes a good firm contact with the side of the battery, without being too tight to insert/remove. If this continues to be an issue, go ahead and try the fix you suggest, and if that fails, contact us privately for further assistance.

    -- Magic-Flight

    PS: these same comments apply to anyone who might be having trouble in this same way, not just Steiner666.

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    Last edited by a moderator: Dec 26, 2014
  25. magicflight

    magicflight Manufacturer Manufacturer

    Messages:
    671
    Location:
    USA
    Hi,

    We use an odorless butcher block oil (a food grade light mineral oil) -- usually the Jasco brand. We do recommend that people that use the Box frequently treat the outside of the Box every few months to preserve the color of the wood.

    -- Magic-Flight

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    Last edited by a moderator: Dec 26, 2014
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