Advanced E-cig users and oil/wax, how-to "one-hitter-quitter"

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gladthaturaglide

Active Member
lol got stoned forgot to post. It went well, seems to be working great now. I just need to mess around with new builds and stuff. I have this idea for a build i feel will work well I just need to order that low pro rda.
 
working4buddha

working4buddha

New Member
CalyxSmokr said:
Hi all. New member with a couple noobish questions if anybody has time or an opinion.
Been reading this thread and just now getting into variable voltage mods.

I have gotten a IStick 30W and running that with an Evil Monk built with a ss stovetop coil wicked with ReadyXWick. So far this is working 1000% better but still not dialed in. Does anybody have an opinion on what ohm I should make the stovetop. 0.6 seems a little hot and 0.9 seems to take a while to heat but I am still getting used to the variable power. Any wattage or volts that you think would be good to start target especially on the 0.9 on there now? Still pulsing on and off to prevent any burned taste.

Most importantly I wonder if there are any opinions on a need for a different mod. Would I see better functionality with the 40W TC IStick if I am running stainless karanthal? Is that just for nickel wire or can I get a more gentle dab with that mod and this RDA/coil? Will I still be pulsing to prevent burn on the 40W TC or can I dial that in smoother than the 30W when using stainless coils? Is that the border of the game changer I see being referred to here? - the TC on the 40W vs. the 30W?

I have 18650s that I can use so I wonder if there is another mod that would suit my purposes and accepts these batteries. If I understand correctly we don't need a huge amount of power for wax vaping so I don't want something with huge power capabilities but am looking for functionality and a nice low temp dab. I see the Kangxin Mini VF 50W Mod KX - 50D Chip Variable Wattage Mini Box Mod Temperature Protection VW Mod mentioned. Is that a good option but just bulkier than the IStick rechargable line?

Any recs as far as mods and builds/coils/rdas is greatly appreciated.
Click to expand...

What awg wire are you using? I am using the same Evil Monk RDA with a RxW stovetop. I'm still using kanthal and haven't tried temp control. I was using 26 awg but switched to 24 awg which created a much sturdier coil. But it was around .2ohm and heating up very fast even at the lowest setting. I made a slightly bigger coil which is reading around .5ohm and it works great on my Smok Xpro m65 at close to the lowest setting of 6w.

But on my iStick 40w I have to put it in between 15w-20w (still haven't found the sweet spot). It seems to ramp up a bit slower than the Smok box which takes one 18650 battery. It is a little too smooth for me to be honest but sounds exactly like what you want.

But I don't think it is your box. Experiment with the coil size and the wire gauge. I posted a pic of one a month or two ago, the current one I use is probably half a loop smaller. I find that 24 awg at .4-.6 ohm is perfect. Also a friend told me to put the center of the coil in the negative and the outside on the positive, not sure if that will help.
 
CalyxSmokr

CalyxSmokr

Well-Known Member
working4buddha said:
What awg wire are you using? I am using the same Evil Monk RDA with a RxW stovetop. I'm still using kanthal and haven't tried temp control. I was using 26 awg but switched to 24 awg which created a much sturdier coil. But it was around .2ohm and heating up very fast even at the lowest setting. I made a slightly bigger coil which is reading around .5ohm and it works great on my Smok Xpro m65 at close to the lowest setting of 6w.

But on my iStick 40w I have to put it in between 15w-20w (still haven't found the sweet spot). It seems to ramp up a bit slower than the Smok box which takes one 18650 battery. It is a little too smooth for me to be honest but sounds exactly like what you want.

But I don't think it is your box. Experiment with the coil size and the wire gauge. I posted a pic of one a month or two ago, the current one I use is probably half a loop smaller. I find that 24 awg at .4-.6 ohm is perfect. Also a friend told me to put the center of the coil in the negative and the outside on the positive, not sure if that will help.
Click to expand...
I am using 24 karanthal - and I think a little too big. Too much wick to heat up I think. Latest is 0.7 ohms and using 10 watts so I will probably make it a little smaller. Still trying to gauge when to put more on and when it is done.
Biggest pain is how short you have to make the lead ends. Do you measure or just eye it out - they get too tall very quickly
 
CalyxSmokr,
working4buddha

working4buddha

New Member
CalyxSmokr said:
I am using 24 karanthal - and I think a little too big. Too much wick to heat up I think. Latest is 0.7 ohms and using 10 watts so I will probably make it a little smaller. Still trying to gauge when to put more on and when it is done.
Biggest pain is how short you have to make the lead ends. Do you measure or just eye it out - they get too tall very quickly
Click to expand...

That is actually pretty good, .7ohm and 10w. Just a little smaller would be good. I just eyeball the leads, basically bend down the smallest amount I can which is usually pretty close. I think my current one is a hair too tall because sometimes I have to scrape some stuff off the inside of the cap. If the cap were a bit taller this would be the perfect RDA for this purpose.

2clicker said:
leave your leads nice and long. makes it easier to install. then just trim them after they are all tightened down.
Click to expand...

On the Evil Monk the screws are hidden so you can't trim any off after you screw it in. So you have to get it right. But you can leave them long, sit them in there to see, and then take them out and trim before screwing down, just to make it easier during the part where you spin the coil. My issue is that sometimes the wick slides while I'm making the coil and the wire slices the end causing it to fray before I'm done. That's how I ended up with a coil that was too small actually, I had to keep trimming it.
 
2clicker

2clicker

Observer
working4buddha said:
On the Evil Monk the screws are hidden so you can't trim any off after you screw it in. So you have to get it right. But you can leave them long, sit them in there to see, and then take them out and trim before screwing down, just to make it easier during the part where you spin the coil. My issue is that sometimes the wick slides while I'm making the coil and the wire slices the end causing it to fray before I'm done. That's how I ended up with a coil that was too small actually, I had to keep trimming it.
Click to expand...

oh i failed to realize that we were working with a postless RDA. carry on!

gladthaturaglide said:
Anyone tried this place for titanium wire? Price is real good IMO

http://www.wireandstuff.co.uk/produ...n---26-AWG----Vacuum-Annealed-218.html#SID=84


Think I'm going to try an order soon. It's just going to take a while getting here being in the uk.
Click to expand...

nice find. looks like they have 24, 26, and 29 gauge. interested to see how clean it comes in.
 
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2clicker,
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ixtapa

Well-Known Member
Have you seen this video? Back up to 2:48 - sorry, couldn't embed with time cued up.

A wickless fused clapton (a regular clapton with two central wires rather than one, nothing crazy) can suck up 3 drops of eliquid from a dropper entirely within its own coils - that's a ton of volume relative to a dab!
 
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gladthaturaglide

Active Member
^That's really impressive how much the coil held with no wicking. . I'm doing some reading but having a hard time finding someone who has a tutorial on how to make a titanium fused Clapton. Apparently most people are using kanthal as the outer wire when wrapping the parallel titanium/ni200 wires. Supposedly the device follows the lowest resistance that is detected by the mod when using temp control. Thus as long as the inner wire is titanium/ni200 and is running at a lower resistance than that of the kanthal then you are all good. Someone correct me if I'm wrong, this is just from what I've found from Google.
 
gladthaturaglide,
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ixtapa

Well-Known Member
gladthaturaglide said:
^That's really impressive how much the coil held with no wicking. . I'm doing some reading but having a hard time finding someone who has a tutorial on how to make a titanium fused Clapton. Apparently most people are using kanthal as the outer wire when wrapping the parallel titanium/ni200 wires. Supposedly the device follows the lowest resistance that is detected by the mod when using temp control. Thus as long as the inner wire is titanium/ni200 and is running at a lower resistance than that of the kanthal then you are all good. Someone correct me if I'm wrong, this is just from what I've found from Google.
Click to expand...

From a purely circuit point of view, what you say is correct. These wires would be connected in parallel, and thus 1/(large resistance) = small contribution to total resistance. So wrapping with high gauge kanthal would not significantly alter the resistance of just the titanium core.

There is, however, another aspect to consider. If the whole point of Ti wire is TC, I'm not so sure this is a good idea. My understanding is that with Ti wire, the power through the circuit is adjusted over time as heat changes the resistance of the wire. So at any given moment current is sent with the assumption that the wire is Ti and thus a preset temperature can be maintained. But it's not yet clear to me that that same power level that is perfect for a certain temperature with Ti won't send the kanthal wire to a much hotter temperature, defeating the whole point of using the Ti in the first place. I need to reflect on that more.

When I get time to play again, I will be trying Ti/Ti. I can't see the procedure being markedly different from the Nichrome videos that are everywhere. Ti is apparently "springier", but it seems that some extra tension or possibly a little heat could resolve that issue. I think we also need to factor in the viscosity of dabs compared to ejuice - it seems to me that higher viscosity might require larger spaces, and thus lower gauge wire, to achieve the same effect. Need to think on this more too.
 
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CalyxSmokr

CalyxSmokr

Well-Known Member
working4buddha said:
On the Evil Monk the screws are hidden so you can't trim any off after you screw it in. So you have to get it right. But you can leave them long, sit them in there to see, and then take them out and trim before screwing down, just to make it easier during the part where you spin the coil. My issue is that sometimes the wick slides while I'm making the coil and the wire slices the end causing it to fray before I'm done. That's how I ended up with a coil that was too small actually, I had to keep trimming it.
Click to expand...
switched out caps with another rda and it has a shitload of room now. Plus it actually fits better than that thing the EM is supplied with.
It is hard enough clamping those leads down with the tiny allen wrench much less doing it with tiny tiny ends
 
CalyxSmokr,
fernand

fernand

Well-Known Member
What a gorgeous clapton! This is all part of the metal wick story, be it clapton, screen/mesh or whatever technique to make the wire become the wick/basket. Ye olde Launch Box Muad-Dib Concentrate unit has a screen that heats up, laser light even, but no TC.

The e-juice situation is a little different. I vape 100% VG e-juice and there all I want is to prevent ruining the more fragile flavoring compounds or decomposing the VG. So the target temp is below those, that's not very demanding in precision.

For erl the Temp Control of course prevents burning, but the target temp can also determine the effects by picking specific distillation fractions. We're just getting started with what can be done. Lower temp fractions are known to be wakier, and higher temp fractions give more sedating/couch locking effects.

We can theoretically get more selective? So I think we would like accurate TC, and need good ways to measure temp, IR guns don't work very well. Anybody here using thermocouple type meters ?
 
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ixtapa

Well-Known Member
fernand said:
So I think we would like accurate TC, and need good ways to measure temp, IR guns don't work very well. Anybody here using thermocouple type meters ?
Click to expand...
I don't know how I didn't put this together. Yes. I have a K-type thermocouple that maxes out around 500F (which is cutting a little close for comfort) and a cheapo IR gun for comparison. I will definitely have data for you in the coming weeks.
 
jpdnkstr

jpdnkstr

Well-Known Member
I use a k type thermocouple temp sensor on my multi-meter to calibrate my e nail, but not sure how to get it to stay on a coil:hmm:, it made my SiC Halo w/sapphire insert divine!:drool: I am using an IGOW Plus now with Ti01 5-6 wrap(.534 Ohms) around fc 2000 ceramic at 410 F, 15.5 Joules on my SX Mini M class. Wow that was a lot to get out!, This set up rivals the flavor, and punch of my enail! I can't believe I didn't start building my own oil coils sooner. I can't wait to try some of the other atty's you guys and gals are using(stumpy, derringer etc.)
 
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ixtapa

Well-Known Member
Started doing some clapton math. If we have a low resistance core and high resistance wrap, the power to each part can be calculated. Not sure if there are nerds here who want to see the gory math (link below), so I'll skip to conclusions.

From what I gather, power is what generates heat (at least in the case of Joule heating, which is what we are doing). If the high resistance path is say 20 times higher than the low resistance path (eg .1ohm vs. 2ohm), the power going through the high resistance path is 1/20th the power of the low resistance path! This is due to the fact that less current will flow through the high resistance path.

If both coils in the clapton were the same gauge, but one had much greater resistance, that high resistance path would heat much more slowly since it gets much less power. However, this is not the case in a clapton - the outer high resistance wrap is typically of a much higher gauge, and has less mass/cross sectional area. This complicates things. That said, I think I know where to go from here. My guess is that in the .1ohm/2ohm example, the "heat capacity" (not the right term, but something along those lines) of the 2ohm path will not be 20 times greater, and thus it will still heat more slowly than the low resistance path. This would be good news for wrapping kanthal around Ti.

Note: I am not an EE, just a math guy picking up stuff from around the net. If you are an EE and can correct me on anything, I would be appreciative! Here's the math: http://imgur.com/dlAUROy.
 
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gladthaturaglide

Active Member
http://i.imgur.com/wxNJ7Yah.jpg



This is the low pro rda I was foaming at the mouth over earlier this week. I just got it in. Finally got a chance to try out my little idea for a build I had when I saw this rda. So I essentially made two dual coils of kanthal (I'll try TC once I know this works) at about .4 ohms. I put one piece of fc-2000 inside each coil and one resting on the deck between the coils with nothing wrapped around it but each coil touches the side of the ceramic. Creating a little mini ceramic "V" shape. Going to try this out in just a bit. Wish me luck!





Update:

This thing is amazing. This is the first time I've had 0 reclaim at all. It completely vaped the entire dab In one hit too. Also there is virtually no backsplatter in the mouth or mouth piece. Very satisfied so far. Hope y'all have a great Friday!
 
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2clicker

2clicker

Observer
gladthaturaglide said:
This is the low pro rda I was foaming at the mouth over earlier this week. I just got it in.
Click to expand...

ive been eyeing up a low pro as well. 3Fvape has them for $7.99. what i dont like is that it does not accept a standard sized drip tip. i dont think i want that chuff style large diameter drip tip. i do like that the tip that comes with the low pro has a sort of screen on it. another concern for me was how close the coil would be to your mouth. i would imagine this would make for a warm vape right?

can you check to see if a reg drip tip will fit inside the large tip that comes with the low pro?
 
2clicker,
Cheerful Dub

Cheerful Dub

Spaced Station
Really excited to find this thread. I have been waiting for the perfect moment to invest in a proper future proof box mod and the time has finally arrived with the DNA 200 devices. Ordered a Lavabox and some Titanium wire for TC builds, should all be here by the end of this week.

Converting one of my old Igo RDAs using the old FC-2000 wicks I have on hand from my old ProVari Genesis style tank atomizer. Wow, I have a lot of old stuff in the vape drawer and it is all turning out to be useful for once! :lol: When I find a build that I like, I will buy a cheap FT clone of a Mini Vertex or a Low Pro as I like their looks and airflow better than the old style. Personally I prefer the chuff cap style unrestricted draw with the built in screens, particularly for vaping nicotine e-juice at sub-ohm.

When that's all figured out I am going to sell my old concentrate vape exclusive equipment. Really excited, seems like I waited most of the last year for this to coalesce. Temperature Controlled concentrate dabs on the go with no claim and all the taste of my D-Nail, I am all about that right now. I will gladly sacrifice preloading and switch to "load-as-you-go" style if it means better taste, no reclaim and much higher uptime outside of stripping the deck and rebuilding.

Exciting times in the vape world, onward and upward my friends! :worms:
 
G

gladthaturaglide

Active Member
2clicker said:
ive been eyeing up a low pro as well. 3Fvape has them for $7.99. what i dont like is that it does not accept a standard sized drip tip. i dont think i want that chuff style large diameter drip tip. i do like that the tip that comes with the low pro has a sort of screen on it. another concern for me was how close the coil would be to your mouth. i would imagine this would make for a warm vape right?

can you check to see if a reg drip tip will fit inside the large tip that comes with the low pro?
Click to expand...


It's not that warm because I don't really push it past 35-40 watts but I know what you are saying. After a weekend of use, I really think this thing performs perfectly as far as the build deck but the topcap comes down too low causing the oil to splatter up and stick on the top of the cap pretty bad after a some use. If the top cap were just a bit taller and the drip tip had a standard connection then this thing would be the perfect rda for concentrates IMO. Maybe I can find some fast tech clone one day that will have a top cap that will fit on top of this one. Most other top caps I had laying around didn't fit by a hair.
 
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ixtapa

Well-Known Member
Some updates:

1) I finished the clapton math. Generally speaking, the outer wrap heats at a ridiculously lower rate than the core wires. The greater the difference in resistance, the more this is true. In the case of 2x24ga Ti core wrapped with 28ga kanthal, the wrap worked out to 1/250th the heating speed as the core. The Ti does in one second what the kanthal does in 250, so the kanthal can essentially be ignored. Good news.

2) I spent two hours yesterday teaching myself how to make fused claptons following several you tube vids. Got the hang of it now; future builds will go rather quickly. The result of yesterday's labor is a 9in stretch of a pair of 2x24ga Ti twisted cores (so four total cores) wrapped in 30ga kanthal. The whole length reads .28ohms mounted in the stubby.

3) I am holding off wrapping a coil until I get a couple new RDAs in. Most of my coil ideas are pretty massive, so I want to wait till I have the new decks in my hand to see what size restrictions (post holes, platform area) I am up against. @gladthaturaglide, that Low Pro looks amazing - so much room, and forgiving posts for multiwire builds.
 
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farscaper

Well-Known Member
do long pieces of fc2000 wick well?

ive got this royal hunter mini and its only dual coil airflow. so I thought longer pieces to span the dripwell more might make it an oil cloud machine. ive only used short pieces of fc2000 like what comes with w9tech gear.

I cant tell if its better thermal mass it provides for oil or if its actually wicking well enough to work as an oil sponge... if that makes any sense.
 
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