Sleeping issues

biohacker said:

I can attest that @lazylathe does not have a tolerance from daytime vaping. He doesn't vape during the day, and he has the lowest tolerance of anyone I know.
@lazylathe let us know if sativas are still working for you! thanks

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Hey! That was a secret! LOL!!!

It is really odd these days!
If i vaped a Sativa a few months ago, i was high as a kite for hours! Heavy sweats and all!
Now i can vape a Sativa before bed and BAM off to sleep i go...
Not sure what is going on!

biohacker said:

OMG I think I just made a huge personal discovery with respect to temperatures! Recently fell for the VripMaster and as a result have dialed back the temperature for saliva-inducing flavour, and even though I still get clouds (awesome vape) and feel medicated and beyond, I wonder if my body is lacking higher temp compounds?

My only other vape ATM is the Mighty which has a ceiling of 210c, although the abv is nice and brown, that could just be the function of conduction.. so could a different vape with a higher ceiling help sleep issues? I have an EQ and Solo on the way.

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Another weird discovery that is most likely my own phenomena...
I max out my EQ at 210 and a Sativa or Indica will put me to sleep...BUT... If i use my Herbie at MAX (229) i do not get the sleepy effects i am after. However, after a few days use it turns around and Herbie will put me in a coma.

And i use a LOT less in the EQ than in my Herbie, so that is great!

@biohacker i still have the 19 to 14 adapter and the PVHES for the Solo, you can have it again!

Damn dude, we are very very similar. (Shit, you are the first Vaporist I've met with our common affliction, check that; you are the first Cannabis patient I've come across with AS)

I wait till bedtime to partake in Vaping, I can't do it during the day, or I'd be asleep all day (Side effects from Pharma)
However, I take Humira as well. ..which causes random nausea during the day, when this happens, I must Vape, or I'd be too nauseated to function.

Well cured bubble hash, along with well cured cannabis in my Vape gives me 7-8 hours solid sleep.

Even when I was dabbing shatter, then I quit the Hydrocarbon Extracts, dabbing water hash.. I'd still wake up at 3am to hobble/crawl to my dab rig to dab myself back into slumber.

Since switching to a Vaporizer with both herb and bubble together, I have never slept better.

Truly a miracle for me, as I've dealt with the excruciating pain at 3am for over a decade.

Before my double hip replacement, I'd wake up in tears from the pain.

My recommendation is to possibly source some well made Bubble Hash that has been cured properly, in coalition with Herb utilizing higher temperatures.

I'm glad you are getting back to sleep bro..

I've been there many, many of times.

All the best @lazylathe .. I hope your day is somewhat pain-free (as I know, with AS, no day is ever truly pain-free.)

lazylathe said:

We have a Tempurpedic mattress! Would not trade it for the world!!

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Just went from sleeping on springs my whole life to memory foam about 2 weeks ago. Wow......I'll never go back to springs. The only thing I didn't like about it was the off-gassing. Weird smell for a few weeks. Got me a bit loopy too but not in a good way.

Other than being poisoned for two weeks, my back feels great.

That's the problem with all these "foam" beds...serious VOC's from non-natural materials. I heard "latex rubber" is supposed to be natural and not have these issues? I've looked into "organic" all natural beds and they look amazing, but they are like $4k+!

@lwein, you probably don't care, especially considering you already have lived longer than most of us here ever will, but just because you can't "smell" it doesn't mean that it's not there. Just like vapes!

Apparently another thing about spring mattresses is that they become giant magnets for non-native EMF. Same kinda principle as steel wires in bra's.

Started vaping first thing in the morning yesterday, got up to 2.5g for the day, took 3 capsules that each have 45mg of THC/ml, 1mg of CBC/ml, 1.5mg CBG/ml, and .5mg CBN and was out cold at 8:45pm until 12:45am and then again until 4:45am. This is huge! Even had 3 green tea's in the morning, and a beer in the afternoon, and obviously it didn't negatively affect my sleep. Vaping before bed maybe helped instead of stopping at 6pm.

Feel a bit foggy probably due to the capsules but overall this is the best morning in weeks! Not a single drop of sweat all night either.

@lazylathe - could both of our issues just be not vaping enough!? LOL

Silver420Surfer said:

Here's a good read from a very talented, respected industry testing lab,

@herbivore21 --- You know I'm gonna say I disagree with you lol



When it comes to getting high on marijuana, the conventional wisdom is that one of two species of the plant—cannabis sativa or cannabis indica—will determine whether you get an up high or you get couch lock. (A third species, cannabis ruderalis, has also been identified, but it doesn't have much psychoactive effect and is more hemp-like.)

There is a good bit of truth to the conventional wisdom—indicas do tend to produce stuporous, narcotized highs, while sativas tend to produce giddy, exhilarating ones—but there's a bit more to it than that. And those relying on the good old sativa = up / indica = down as a guide may find themselves in for a surprise.

The differences between the two species are evident to the naked eye. Sativas typically are tall and lanky, with long narrow leaves, while indicas are shorter, stouter, bushier, and have thicker, stubbier leaves. That, says Krymon deCesare, chief research director at Steep Hill Halent Lab in Oakland, is because the two cannabis species developed in different environments.

He told High Times that marijuana's origins are in South and Central Asia, and that the plant differentiated itself into distinct species to accommodate different humidity regimes. The thin, lanky stems and long leaves of sativa plants allow the plant to respirate more efficiently and prosper in high humidity, while short, squat indicas evolved to deal with hot, dry conditions.

Thus, landrace varieties — "pure" original strains of indica, such as Afghani and Hindu Kush— developed in the dry foothills of the Himalayas, while pure sativas evolved in humid lowlands and river valleys. But in the US market today, landrace strains are a rarity. The vast majority of the weed grown and consumed in the US is one indica-sativa hybrid or another.

That makes sense, for both growers and consumers. For growers, even if they want that trademark stimulating sativa high, they don't want to spend extra weeks waiting for it to mature, so they use hybrid strains with varying amounts of indica that will ripen faster than a pure sativa.

For consumers, hybrids are similarly attractive. You can get couch lock and the giggles without being thoroughly sedated or completely zonked. Pot buyers will look for a hybrid they think will satisfy their desires: Do they want to be mainly up with just a hint of a body high? Then they may want a sativa-heavy hybrid such as Haze, Blue Dream or Strawberry Cough. Do they want to get stuporous, but maybe laugh a little, too? Then they'll go for indica-dominant strains such as Hash Plant, Blueberry or Girl Scout Cookie.

But you don't always get the high you think you're going to get. That's because growing conditions make a difference, and even stabilized strains, pure or hybrid, can exhibit new traits when grown in conditions to which they are not accustomed. But part of the reason is a bit stranger—and calls into question the traditional reliance on the indica/sativa distinction.

"The terms sativa and indica are only really valid for describing the physical characteristics of the cannabis strain in a given environment," deCesare told High Times. "They are not nearly as reliable as terms for making assumptions about energy versus couch lock."

He explained that the effects of THC, whether in indicas or sativas, are the same: It creates a euphoric, uplifting sensation when smoked. That sound pretty much like a sativa high, so if indica contains THC just like sativa, why does some indica leave you in a prostrate stupor?

DeCesare has the answer. While both indicas and sativas generally contain the full complement of cannabinoids in addition to THC, and the same terpenes—chemical compounds that create odors and essential oils—some indicas are especially heavy in one terpene that flips the switch on the up THC high. That terpene is myrcene.

"We found consistently elevated levels of the terpenoid myrcene in C. indica, as compared to C. sativa," he explained. "Myrcene is the major ingredient responsible for ‘flipping’ the normal energetic effect of THC into a couch lock effect."

In fact, deCesare says, myrcene rather than THC is probably the most important variable in creating the psychoactive differences between indica and sativa. That conclusion is based on the analysis of more than 100,000 marijuana samples taken over the past seven years.

He points to the theory of the "entourage effect," developed by his colleague, Ethan Russo, as a better explanation for different highs than the indica/sativa distinction. That theory postulates that it is the combination of different cannabinoids and terpenes working together that creates the distinctive highs of various strains.

Myrcene isn't limited to marijuana. It exists in many fruits and plants around the world, and some of them provide additional support to deCesare's theory.

"Notice the warm, relaxed feeling you get from a couple of hoppy beers?" deCesare asked. "That effect is, to a good extent, due to the myrcene present from the hops."

In his work at Steep Hill Halent, deCesare has found that myrcene levels make a difference. A level below 0.4% doesn't seem to effect the "upness" of the high.

But go beyond that and "the strain becomes increasingly more sedative and stony,” deCesare noted. “OG Kush is considered by most to be a strong couch lock flower at about 1.25% myrcene. A few strains have a myrcene content in excess of 3%. Other chemicals may well play minor roles in the couchlock effect, including CBD, CBN and linalool, when they are present in couch lock strains—but they aren’t always present or as influential."

Once marijuana is widely legal, myrcene content should be part of the labeling, he suggested.

"Moving forward to a time when the USDA and FDA oversee cannabis-distribution regulations," he replied, "they will insist on accurate labeling to assure that if a customer purchases an energetic strain—or a couch lock strain—then what they get is what they paid for. And the only reliable way to make this determination is by lab-testing for myrcene content."

Can't wait for that USDA-certified couch lock sticker.

Old myths going by the wayside, and probably the reason "sativas have changed" for you. You finally got one with a higher myrcene content. We are actually trying to get the owners where I work into having our flower tested, where I work, for myrcene so we can try to replicate SHHL's results. If true, this will change all the "sativa"- "indica"- hybrid" listings on Weedmaps dispensary menus and shake up the industry. It'll be a rush to see who can provide a highest myrcene-containing flower.

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Thank you for an awesome post!! This makes so much sense to me as I have experimented to manipulate couch-lock effect from rather uplifting herbs.

And the stuff that works for me is;

- drinking an alcohol-free beer before my night vape session (I've been avoiding alcohol for medical reasons)
-Mixing herbs from a sleeping/relaxing tea (including hops) with my MJ

biohacker said:

@lwein, you probably don't care, especially considering you already have lived longer than most of us here ever will, but just because you can't "smell" it doesn't mean that it's not there. Just like vapes!

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As the smell dissipates, so is that loopy feeling that I was getting. It really was a strange feeling. Like having a bit too much adrenaline pumping through my system. When you have that without the need to fight or flee, it's really kind of strange. It's the exact same feeling I got when I took Benadryl, which I'll never take again. Not a good feeling but now, starting the 3rd week in, that feeling has disappeared. Really had to air that puppy out with windows open and the ceiling fan going at full speed.

Ah, but the quality of sleep has improved tremendously. I always thought that getting up feeling kinda stiff (not the morning wood kinda stiff), and tired was just a sign of gettin' old and feeling a bit achy after a run was a sign of getting' old as well. Not true. This mattress made those feelings go away completely.

Feel totally rested with no aches or pains when I first get out of bed.............just like in the commercials.

btw, as far as living longer than most of you ever will, back in my late twenties, I never thought that I'd live long enough to see the other side of either 45 or 50 considering all of the different recreational drugs I was putting in my body along with smoking 3 packs of cigs a day and being 50 pounds overweight. And actually, I still feel the same way if I hadn't stopped all that stuff 35 years ago and started really taking care of myself. The body has a miraculous way of healing itself if you give it a chance. Good genetics helps a lot also.

There is a technique that I am too impatient to practice but was taught in a class in college called "Fundamentals of Movement" that was my P.E. credit and taught by a dancer. She had us mentally walk through out body relaxing certain muscle groups while breathing deeply and regularly.

Lay on your back with your knees bent. Putting a rolled towel under your neck helps to support your neck. Starts with eye sockets, imagine them expanding wide and the eye balls themselves getting heavy and dropping to the back of your head, then the jaw, imagine the hinge getting loose and wide, the flesh, essentially melting off to pool on your chest...but keep your eye sockets relaxed, if they tighten up, go back and relax them and then do the jaw again, then you imagine the "hinge" area at the base of your skull, where head meets neck widening and the neck loosening...continue working all the way out to your extremities. It was pretty detailed but it was so relaxing. Really helped relax your brain, too.

I used to sleep like a log, but no more. Exercise during the day helps me sleep at night. Went through 6-8 weeks of max 4 hrs a night when I started a new job. That sucked. Glad you are sleeping better now.

Bubba Kush helps me relax at night, but I have read cannabis can fuck with R.E.M. sleep so I do not know if I should be vaping before bed or not. If the strain makes my skin super sensitive (a hazard for me because my skin is already sensitive to touch) I have a harder time getting to sleep because I keep noticing the fabric against my skin, the wrinkles in that fabric poking me, etc. Some strains make my appendages slighty itchy and i rub my forearms red without thinking. Bubba Kush works best for me without weird side effects. Grape Ape is sleepy, but, uh, it causes another side effect that isn't helpful for sleeping - libido boost! I was pleasantly surprised that Headband, which is a great motivator and can help launch me into my naturally occurring hyper-focus, made me relaxed and sleepy when vaped at higher temps. I think HB is a sativa-Dom hybrid.

I think vape temp has a great impact on the effect of the herb.

Maybe try your hand in gardening?

I find the process of growing to be extremely therapeutic, it really works my brain, as I'm always trying new un-researched methodological techniques.

This in combination of the light-moderate physical exertion wears me out.

It doesn't even have to be Cannabis, just something you have a passion for.

Gardening also gives me something to look forward to upon going to bed, I run to the garden every morning like a child runs to the Christmas Tree on Christmas Morning..

I'm lucky enough to live in a legal state, and my passion for pristine Cannabis is only over shadowed by my passion for my wife.

Up until my acquisition of my DBV, all I did was Garden and read about gardening, living Organics, Microbiology vs. Synthetic fertilizers etc..

Now, a new passion has been lit... Vaporization.

I'm finding the harder I work my brain, the easier it is to drift into slumber.

I also would like to to echo @lwien and @woolspinner regarding the mattress and the sensation of touch in relation to the sensations of the skin.

My wife and I went out on a limb and shelled out over 2k$ for a nice mattress, the difference is unreal, combine that with some high quality bedding and pillows...

I've never looked forward to going to bed with such enthusiasm.

Spent 150$ on a shredded bamboo pillow... Aside from my DBV, possibly the best 150$ I've ever spent. It stays cool to the touch throughout the night, and provides a firm but soft feel.

Hashtag46&2 said:

Spent 150$ on a shredded bamboo pillow... Aside from my DBV, possibly the best 150$ I've ever spent. It stays cool to the touch throughout the night, and provides a firm but soft feel.

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Shredded memory foam with a bamboo cover? That's my next purchase.

We spend a third of our lives in bed. To me, it makes perfect sense to make it the best that it can be.

I've been sleeping on a queen-size inflatable bed for 5 months

I've got the memory-foam costco mattress, and a memory-foam pillow with a gel topper for coolness. The bed's great, the pillow's okay but nothing to write home about. Shredded bamboo next up for me too.

Tried memory foam.

Kapok & eco wool futon on wood slats. I posted a link once. ..I'm on my cell so the usual linkage or photo is a no go. .. zafu.net

We've been sleeping on this for over a year now. .. still better than any other we've tried, together or separately.

Another amazing night's sleep simply from increasing my consumption and starting from morning until evening. I can't even keep my eyes open past 8-8:30 and one cannabis capsule does the synergistic magic and knocks me out. The only problem is that i'm up every 3 hours to use the washroom, but at least i'm getting some sleep now. Way better than tossing turning night sweats all night!

All this mattress talk made me curious, so I found this article by one of my favourite biohacker's, Ben Greenfield. Memory foam just screams chemicals to me and I had to return a pillow because it smelled like a factory full of chemicals right in my face.

http://www.bengreenfieldfitness.com/2014/10/what-is-the-best-natural-organic-mattress/