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Gear Nails, bangers, honey buckets, etc. Best for beginner?

doubledown

Well-Known Member
I don't have any hands on experience with dab rigs, only pens. There are many others I presume who are just gaining access to concentrates and have similar questions. I get the jist of nails, bangers, and honey buckets, but without any experience it is hard to know which and what material (Ti, quartz, ceramic, etc) to start with. Please share experiences and opinions as to what you prefer and why.
 

DieHard

Accessory supplier
Accessory Maker
Before I got my Errlectric Enail, my fave was a Quartz banger. I also have a HE DualTi and carb cap. IMO the carb cap is nearly as important as the nail. Not necessarily the material it's made of, rather, the fit. Low temp dabs with a carb cap are where it's at!
 

Quetzalcoatl

DEADY GUERRERO/DIRT COBAIN/GEORGE KUSH
I'd have to agree with the quartz banger. I use one of the super thick 4mm quartz bangers with a carb cap and ir temp gun for consistent analog low temp dabs and couldn't be happier.
I've been using a thick banger as well with a carb cap. I like how it retains heat longer than my other 14mm (regular) nails. I don't use an IR gun though, I've gotten pretty good at doing analog low temp by feel, though it took a little getting used to the different thermal mass. So far the bangers are my favorite and I haven't reached for my other stuff. The only thing I have to remember is that it's still warm enough to piss me off if I touch/bump it for whatever reason. I dunno, I guess I like the nail + dome over a domeless... yet I've changed my mind now... I'll definitely be using the banger more. Dunno about getting an enail personally as I don't feel like I use enough oil for it to be worth it. As it is I buy maybe 2-3 cans of butane for my torch every year...
 

herbivore21

Well-Known Member
Why no SiC here? Hands down tastiest torch nail on earth. More durable than anything else other than ti (and that is even a close one). No need to torch the nail evenly, it will distribute the heat extremely evenly on its own - also there is no way that you can oxidize this nail with a butane or even propane flame anytime soon, and even if it does start to get oxidative degradation, this just forms a harmless quartz layer over the top of the SiC :D

SiC dish on a D-nail/HE base (probably not infiniti) with d-nail 2.0 universal carb is to me the clear winner for taste and durability - produces a finer aerosol too for denser clouds! No sapphire insert if you're using a torch though, sapphire and torches don't play nicely!

May cost more than other materials but hey, the manufacture of aerospace ceramics is gonna cost more than you're gr2 ti and quartz and ordinary ceramics ;) and also SiC won't look expensive when sapphire dishes are released lol

SiC, SiN and Sapphire seem to be where dabbing is headed and with good reason. Doesn't really make sense to buy last-gen tools when the next-gen is here - unless you absolutely need to save a buck, in that case, I'd recommend ceramic over quartz/ti - still if you don't absolutely need to save a buck, SiC is the obvious best option for you IMO :2c:
 

doubledown

Well-Known Member
I'd have to agree with the quartz banger. I use one of the super thick 4mm quartz bangers with a carb cap and ir temp gun for consistent low temp analog dabs and couldn't be happier.
What temp or range is the sweet spot ?

And while I'm sure I'd enjoy the ease and consistency of the electric route, it's something I may want to visit at a later time, not now.
 

MileHighLife

Blower of glass, grower of grass
What temp or range is the sweet spot ?

And while I'm sure I'd enjoy the ease and consistency of the electric route, it's something I may want to visit at a later time, not now.
My sweet spot is 690. For smaller dabs I'll go a bit lower but I feel like there's excessive residual oil left in the banger if I do a big dab at 670 or lower.
 

Melting Pot

Sick & Twisted
With the Errlectric & the t1 my temp is 540 if I use the Quartz insert I'll bump it to 640 would love a sic..

Seems at 640 on t1 as soon as dab hits nail its gone cap don't do much. Imo

And the Flavor @ 540:mmmm:
 

ClearBlueLou

unbearably light in the being....
Why no SiC here? Hands down tastiest torch nail on earth. More durable than anything else other than ti (and that is even a close one). No need to torch the nail evenly, it will distribute the heat extremely evenly on its own - also there is no way that you can oxidize this nail with a butane or even propane flame anytime soon, and even if it does start to get oxidative degradation, this just forms a harmless quartz layer over the top of the SiC :D

SiC dish on a D-nail/HE base (probably not infiniti) with d-nail 2.0 universal carb is to me the clear winner for taste and durability - produces a finer aerosol too for denser clouds! No sapphire insert if you're using a torch though, sapphire and torches don't play nicely!

May cost more than other materials but hey, the manufacture of aerospace ceramics is gonna cost more than you're gr2 ti and quartz and ordinary ceramics ;) and also SiC won't look expensive when sapphire dishes are released lol

SiC, SiN and Sapphire seem to be where dabbing is headed and with good reason. Doesn't really make sense to buy last-gen tools when the next-gen is here - unless you absolutely need to save a buck, in that case, I'd recommend ceramic over quartz/ti - still if you don't absolutely need to save a buck, SiC is the obvious best option for you IMO :2c:

I appreciate your obvious knowledge on the subject, Herbivore, but as one of the previously mentioned folks who are new to the dab/oil world, I find it impenetrable. I'm sure SiC and SiN are synthetic nail-making substances, but other than forms of silicon, I'm lost. I'm not nearly familiar enough with the rest of the jargon to parse it. In a nearly identical thread around the same time, the question was also not really answered, but there were references to enails, which I guess are thermostatically-controlled dabbing surfaces? Sounds like a good thing to know something about.

As an absolute beginner (1 dab, at a friend's, ceramic nail of unknown origin), I want to find out what y'all started with & how it worked out for you? Why (how soon) did you replace it and what did you replace it with? What are you HOPING to end up with? If you only HAD $20/25/35 to get a nail, a banger, a bucket, WHICH banger/bucket/nail, and WHY THAT ONE? And what ONE THING do you feel you've learned the hard way, that you wish you'd known before your bought your first glass?

My first post, been reading like a fiend for weeks, still have HUNDREDS of pages to catch up on, but so glad to be here: in imminent danger of purchasing 1st oil/dab/wax rig & need to get it as right as possible the first time through. Finally broke down & registered to get involved in the many conversations I've become silently involved in, this being the one with the most push behind it.

Guess I mis-read the title as "Nails, bangers, honey buckets, etc FOR BEGINNERS"

Anyhow, thanks. Hi!
 

herbivore21

Well-Known Member
I appreciate your obvious knowledge on the subject, Herbivore, but as one of the previously mentioned folks who are new to the dab/oil world, I find it impenetrable. I'm sure SiC and SiN are synthetic nail-making substances, but other than forms of silicon, I'm lost. I'm not nearly familiar enough with the rest of the jargon to parse it. In a nearly identical thread around the same time, the question was also not really answered, but there were references to enails, which I guess are thermostatically-controlled dabbing surfaces? Sounds like a good thing to know something about.

As an absolute beginner (1 dab, at a friend's, ceramic nail of unknown origin), I want to find out what y'all started with & how it worked out for you? Why (how soon) did you replace it and what did you replace it with? What are you HOPING to end up with? If you only HAD $20/25/35 to get a nail, a banger, a bucket, WHICH banger/bucket/nail, and WHY THAT ONE? And what ONE THING do you feel you've learned the hard way, that you wish you'd known before your bought your first glass?

My first post, been reading like a fiend for weeks, still have HUNDREDS of pages to catch up on, but so glad to be here: in imminent danger of purchasing 1st oil/dab/wax rig & need to get it as right as possible the first time through. Finally broke down & registered to get involved in the many conversations I've become silently involved in, this being the one with the most push behind it.

Guess I mis-read the title as "Nails, bangers, honey buckets, etc FOR BEGINNERS"

Anyhow, thanks. Hi!
Greetings sir.

I understand that much of what I say may be very dense to the unitiated. I also appreciate your position, I only dabbed for the first time about 2 years ago, and I live in a location where NOBODY DABS. There is no oil here, there is no dabbing culture. I import everything I use and make my own concentrates. Rest assured that I came to dabbing more in the dark about the whole thing than you did :) There is hope for all of us!

If you only have a very small amount of money to spare like you describe, then I recommend cheap ceramic nails for the tastiest option, maybe cheap quartz if you can't quite afford a domeless.com ceramic nail or similar with a carb.

However, for absolute beginners who have enough money, in my view you should not waste your time with quartz or ceramic (especially not titanium!). Just get a SiC nail. Regardless of whether you intend to use torch or e-nail. You will not regret it, you should not need to buy another nail - it'll last forever with minimal care! Remember, quartz and even ti nails are gonna degrade/decompose over time through oxidation. Traditional ceramic nails can break over time quite easily too.

I have a Sapphire Halo, the unequivocal best nail on the market (but sadly not yet publicly available with no ETA) and I still regularly use my SiC nail when out and about - every dabber should have one. Better taste than anything but Sapphire IME, almost indestructible (unless dropped/thrown from a great height onto a hard surface while hot or something), huge thermal shock resistance (best torch nail ever hands down) which means that drastically fast changes from cold to hot temps are handled without problems - this is the Achilles' heal of quartz and even sapphire as they break from considerably less thermal shock. SiC also has the fastest and most even vaporization at the lowest possible temps of any material - including sapphire!

If you're absolutely broke on a bare minimum budget and absolutely cannot wait til you can afford a little extra for ceramic (no shame in that!) then I suggest cheap domeless quartz with a carb or cheap dome and quartz nail setup compatible with your rig. This is where I started out back when I had much less funds myself :)

If you are broke but can in any way afford a little more than the above quartz setup, get a cheap ceramic nail/carb. It'll taste much better and give more full vaporization/less pooling of oil.

For the record, I do not rate bangers above standard nail form factors. Still, for torch use they can be quite good and many like them! I would stay away from bangers with diagonal openings at the top rather than a flat rim that a carb can be left to balance on top of in use. I prefer to be able to leave my carb cap on top and not hold it in place to prevent a fall off the downward facing diagonal outer rim of the banger!

I find that quartz bangers on enails (this may not be relevant to you) have too much pooling/slow vaporization for my liking (and I've used a good cross-section of these, including quartz bangers that cost almost exactly as much as my sapphire halo!).

Hope this helps you in your search my friend :)

P.S. SiC is Silicon Carbide, it is a ceramic, not a silicone rubber or anything similar (silicone rubbers should never, ever be anywhere near the temps that we heat a nail to!). It is a very strong ceramic, the one used to make bulletproof ceramic plate inserts used in body armor to stop bullets. It should not ever oxidate from our intended usage, and even if it somehow did degrade from too much heat, the byproduct is a silica oxide layer. Silica oxide is also known as quartz ;)

Silicone Carbide is so inert that when you degrade it from too much heat (a very difficult thing to do by dabbing!) it just gets a layer of quartz over it!

P.P.S If you need any further explanation on any of these, feel free to ask, happy to help you man :)

@grokit holy shit bro, for some reason I'd thought you'd been dabbing for ages! I look forward to seeing how you find dabbing :D
 
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BeardedCrow

Well-Known Member
I have a a quartz banger that works fairly well.

But finding the correct temp is difficult for me, the little quartz sticks work easier for me.

I got a laser temp gun coming tonight, hopefully it helps!
 

grokit

well-worn member
Starter rig :freak:

d-nail-web-hickory-bonsi02-sicnail.jpg

http://www.d-nail.com/vaporizers/bundles/digital-organics-7-by-hickory
 

herbivore21

Well-Known Member
NO WAY!!!! You bought it!? I always thought that was fucking BEAUTIFUL!


I have a a quartz banger that works fairly well.

But finding the correct temp is difficult for me, the little quartz sticks work easier for me.

I got a laser temp gun coming tonight, hopefully it helps!

Unfortunately for quartz, optical (laser/IR etc) temp measurement tools are not the most useful/accurate. This is due to the optical properties of quartz. We need to use an appropriately rated Stainless steel k-type thermocouple or similar for more accurate measurement of temps.
 

grokit

well-worn member
I wish! Nopes.
In addition to the sub, oil kit, and some cheap glass nails this will be more my starting speed.
I also have a "cheap chinese 510 battery" with usb charger for it.
And an 710 fc diffusion pump bubbler. I'm ready!

rBVaGVRtW3SAa_hDAAG_aYks0bY840.jpg


:shrug: I may also have a cheap ceramic or ti nail thingie somewhere too.
 
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herbivore21

Well-Known Member
I wish! Nopes.
In addition to the sub, oil kit, and some cheap glass nails this will be more my starting speed.
I also have a "cheap chinese 510 battery" with usb charger for it.

rBVaGVRtW3SAa_hDAAG_aYks0bY840.jpg


:shrug: I may also have a cheap ceramic or ti nail thingie somewhere, plus an unused 710 fc bubbler.
Lol we can all dream can't we?!

Actually I have a buddy who has a similar rig/perc to what you showed there. Very cheap entry level piece he uses with an ULTRA-cheap china ti enail (infiniti knock-off, sorry don't know which controller it is, will try and find out). The rig actually hits quite nicely, no need for massive piece or insane percolation for low temp enail dabs anyway ;)

The e-nail has some sketchy elements, I am not at all sure of the heater coil especially or even the ti, but it does taste reasonable when seasoned though, much better than torching cheap ti or quartz. I would definitely dab my rosin on it, it tastes nice. I would not use it for full melt due to some loss of taste compared to SiC/Sapphire but this very cheap setup is no slouch!

I do wonder if other brands of coil could be connected to that controller, it really was crazy cheap and with a known safe coil I would be far more comfortable using such a setup.

I am also finding lately that I think SiC and especially Sapphire can really make lesser extracts seem much better.

I am finding that 4.5 star not quite full melt hash is actually much nicer dabbed on the sapphire halo at 550f or so than in a convection vape! The key is to spread it around the dish though. This is nice for those occasional hash runs that for whatever reason just don't give the full melt...
 

ClearBlueLou

unbearably light in the being....
NO WAY!!!! You bought it!? I always thought that was fucking BEAUTIFUL!
That IS STUNNING. I love everything about it!
(except the whole never-being-able-to-afford-it part)

I wish! Nopes.

In addition to the sub, oil kit, and some cheap glass nails this will be more my starting speed.
I also have a "cheap chinese 510 battery" with usb charger for it.
And an 710 fc diffusion pump bubbler. I'm ready!
:shrug: I may also have a cheap ceramic or ti nail thingie somewhere too.
looking at that rig makes my brain hurt...

I've been giving a lot of consideration to the FC-710, too - currently settling on one or two of: FC-710, FC-187, FC-UFO, FC-MINI; also settling on quartz for MY OWN break-in period, give myself a chance to discover what I like and don't like about it, so maybe I'll pick up a few(?) castle-style & bangers, maybe a down-drop, maybe an adapter, and call that good for the next few years.

I have no idea if this seems like a reasonable path to go down, so if anyone cares to compare the rigs I mentioned, I'd LOVE to hear - are any of 'em the 'One Rig'? Which two would you pick for your basics, or is each too special? Feel free to pontificate...

ObData: interest is concentrates, and flowers. expanding, upgrading, updating - and switching away from combustion (yes, lungs, I'm listening!). Open to the idea of "one Rig to rule them all" but not a condition. $100 is the condition: can and will get one for each if quality, value, fitness-to-purpose & design focus support - otherwise, extra $$ for The One...but must all come in functionally complete for $100

Also curious which adapters do folks find MOST useful, size or gender?
 
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ClearBlueLou

unbearably light in the being....
really want to say the comments have been invaluable - I get in a place sometimes where I have to involve other people and views for my own opinions to crystallize, and boy, talking thru this with you has been crucial. Choice of a quartz start evaporated so many other questions, hoping to precipitate a choice in the basic glass now, and so still making my way thru no-kidding THOUSANDS of posts looking for data, so chime in w/ anything. Kind of like juggling butterflies....

@grokit, you mention a sub and an oil kit - care to run those down, please? What's a sub? What's in an oil-kit?
 

grokit

well-worn member
@grokit, you mention a sub and an oil kit - care to run those down, please? What's a sub? What's in an oil-kit?
The silver surfer/dbv vapes have an optional ti hot-plate setup available called the flavor oil kit.

And there are a couple of sublimator threads, it's a vape that makes reclaim called sublimate.
 

ClearBlueLou

unbearably light in the being....
Cool, and thank you so much - I'll check into it!

Was curious, as my one-and-only-vape-so-far is a sub-ohm...and I can never repress my curiosity about 'kits'....
 
If you only HAD $20/25/35 to get a nail, a banger, a bucket, WHICH banger/bucket/nail, and WHY THAT ONE?
www.dhgate.com/product/4mm-thick-quartz-banger-nail-domeless-90/235654200.html#s1-6-1|2047368270

I'm certainly no dab expert, but as a novice/intermediate user I find bangers easiest to use and this ones very thick. I use a big marble as a carb, but they sell some as well. I think the thickness helps me out with the heat, for some reason I seem to get my ti adjustable too hot.

Like I said though, I'm pretty new to it myself. Concentrates are scarce here.
 

cptchronic

Well-Known Member
I would say if you have the money just get a SiC because of all the reasons herbivore has listed above.

But if you want to get a feel for dabbing, have no experience and don't want to invest a lot of money, I would recommend getting a quartz banger and carb cap combo. They are relatively cheap compared to most Ti's.
The flavor is smoother and cleaner (at least that's the best I can describe it without trying either). And the only benefits I really see to the Ti is it won't break but your banger will last a long time if you get a quality one (and use it correctly).

But ultimately, if you have the funds just get a SiC or go straight to an enail set up because that's where everyone ends up anyway. :2c:
 
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