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Divine Tribe atty's

Haywood

Onward Thru the Fog
I'm using an iStick TC 40W. I tried it for a while in temp control mode, but the flavor wasn't as good as what I get when I just switch it to wattage mode. I don't get burnt taste at all with mine set to 12.5W. My girlfriend just got a different TC mod (she's on the road now, and I don't recall which one she got), so I'll try that when she gets back home, in case it's the fixed 40W that the iStick puts out in TC mode until the temp is reached.

My point of the question (in orange in my message) was that if the donut atty doesn't change its resistance as its temp changes, then a temp controlled mod won't be of much use with it. Still, everyone else, including its inventor Matt, seems to think that TC is the way to go with the DevineTribe donut atty.

It's still my favorite atty for non-liquid concentrates, by a long shot. And it works great for me @ 12.5W non-temp control mode.
 

Steven

Well-Known Member
I'm using an iStick TC 40W. I tried it for a while in temp control mode, but the flavor wasn't as good as what I get when I just switch it to wattage mode. I don't get burnt taste at all with mine set to 12.5W. My girlfriend just got a different TC mod (she's on the road now, and I don't recall which one she got), so I'll try that when she gets back home, in case it's the fixed 40W that the iStick puts out in TC mode until the temp is reached.

My point of the question (in orange in my message) was that if the donut atty doesn't change its resistance as its temp changes, then a temp controlled mod won't be of much use with it. Still, everyone else, including its inventor Matt, seems to think that TC is the way to go with the DevineTribe donut atty.

It's still my favorite atty for non-liquid concentrates, by a long shot. And it works great for me @ 12.5W non-temp control mode.

How are you arriving to the conclusion that the donut doesn't increase in resistance as its heated. The fact that it works on a TC mod is fact that it does. Or even if you put the donut on any box mod that displays ohms. It will show ohms increases with every button press. At least this is my experience with the donut and any ceramic element on many many different mods. But if regular Wattage mode is treating you very well n ur happy then all is well. It's not a battle between regular Wattage vs TC. I take long hits so the last portion of my hits were always burned on regular Wattage. I can see it not be a problem if you take shorter hits
 

Haywood

Onward Thru the Fog
I came to the conclusion that my donut doesn't change resistance by measuring it at different temperatures. I can assure you that mine doesn't change from room temp to whatever it's at after a dozen 5-10 second hits. I measured it both with two different mods (both in watt/volt mode, NOT TC mode), and when I was wondering why the resistance didn't change, I took it off the mods and measured it with a stand alone ohm meter. My DevineTribe V2.5 is 0.71Ω all the time.

So let me ask you: what are YOU using to determine that your donut does change resistance with temperature? And why do you feel that TC is working just because your TC mod cycles? What resistance change do you see in your donut as it warms up? (i.e., what is its room temp resistance and what is its resistance after you take a number of long hits?)

Oh, and I presume you're using one of the standard DevineTribe atty's, not the high resistance version. If not, that could be a factor.
 

Steven

Well-Known Member
I came to the conclusion that my donut doesn't change resistance by measuring it at different temperatures. I can assure you that mine doesn't change from room temp to whatever it's at after a dozen 5-10 second hits. I measured it both with two different mods (both in watt/volt mode, NOT TC mode), and when I was wondering why the resistance didn't change, I took it off the mods and measured it with a stand alone ohm meter. My DevineTribe V2.5 is 0.71Ω all the time.

So let me ask you: what are YOU using to determine that your donut does change resistance with temperature? And why do you feel that TC is working just because your TC mod cycles? What resistance change do you see in your donut as it warms up? (i.e., what is its room temp resistance and what is its resistance after you take a number of long hits?)

Oh, and I presume you're using one of the standard DevineTribe atty's, not the high resistance version. If not, that could be a factor.
I don't remember the exact resistance change but as mentioned before, resistance rises with every button press when the standard donut was used on my old ipv mini 2. I would press the button like 4-8 times in the span of around a minute. And with every button press, ohms readings increase as well as voltage

Also just to clarify, if the stock atty is 0.7. Then resistance will increase when heated but will return to its original 0.7 ohms eventually

And as mentioned, what's the big deal. If you really like regular Wattage then I'm glad you found your sweet spot. My sweet spot just so happens to be different. Whatever floats your boat. I may be wrong with my info but that's how I understand it with my experience with it. I'm not sure where my mod is so can't give you exact numbers...
 

Haywood

Onward Thru the Fog
I'm feeling that my intentions are being misunderstood. I don't mean to be at all argumentative about this, I'm just curious. I am delighted with my DevineTribe atty. I don't want for it to "work" better, it works fine and makes me happy. I'm gonna order two more for friends of mine, and will no doubt order a version 3.0 when Matt makes one. So I think that much of them to give them as gifts.

I'm just curious why my TC experience with it seems to be the opposite of everyone elses. I know that the current crop of TC mods work by sensing the resistance change, and my donut doesn't seem to change resistance at all. I also thought that maybe it was the particular mod I was using (the iStick TC40W), since it's the only TC mod I currently own. That's why I asked what kind of resistances everyone was seeing cold and hot.

So it's no big deal, indeed it's not really even a little deal. And if everyone elses does change resistance, and somehow mine is different, I still don't care, as it's still the best atty for concentrates I have, and I am very happy with it.
 

sweetherb

Well-Known Member
I'm feeling that my intentions are being misunderstood. I don't mean to be at all argumentative about this, I'm just curious. I am delighted with my DevineTribe atty. I don't want for it to "work" better, it works fine and makes me happy. I'm gonna order two more for friends of mine, and will no doubt order a version 3.0 when Matt makes one. So I think that much of them to give them as gifts.

I'm just curious why my TC experience with it seems to be the opposite of everyone elses. I know that the current crop of TC mods work by sensing the resistance change, and my donut doesn't seem to change resistance at all. I also thought that maybe it was the particular mod I was using (the iStick TC40W), since it's the only TC mod I currently own. That's why I asked what kind of resistances everyone was seeing cold and hot.

So it's no big deal, indeed it's not really even a little deal. And if everyone elses does change resistance, and somehow mine is different, I still don't care, as it's still the best atty for concentrates I have, and I am very happy with it.

If your donut produces good vapor in VW mode, but not in TC mode, I would suggest you need a better TC mod or to try different temps until you hit the sweetspot. I see no scenario in which VW is better than TC. But YMMV.
 
If your donut produces good vapor in VW mode, but not in TC mode, I would suggest you need a better TC mod or to try different temps until you hit the sweetspot. I see no scenario in which VW is better than TC. But YMMV.
He's using a fixed 40W device that is likely overshooting the mark when heating. 40W is a lot of wattage for that little atomizer, even if you are pulsing or have a program in place to pulse for you (tc). You're basically asking it to stay at a lower temp, while running "cleaning" wattage (over double regular use wattage). I would be surprised if it's not scorching the oil every time it tries to reach temp. I didn't upgrade my iStick 50W yet, specifically because of the fixed wattage. Many other mods allow temp control with adjustable wattage. I'm merely waiting for those to reach the price of an iStick, or for iSmoka to release a better iStick temp control unit.
 

ChrisCT

Well-Known Member
He's using a fixed 40W device that is likely overshooting the mark when heating. 40W is a lot of wattage for that little atomizer, even if you are pulsing or have a program in place to pulse for you (tc). You're basically asking it to stay at a lower temp, while running "cleaning" wattage (over double regular use wattage). I would be surprised if it's not scorching the oil every time it tries to reach temp. I didn't upgrade my iStick 50W yet, specifically because of the fixed wattage. Many other mods allow temp control with adjustable wattage. I'm merely waiting for those to reach the price of an iStick, or for iSmoka to release a better iStick temp control unit.

Matt, can you weigh in on your experience with the three temperature control box mods you have posted about (eVic-VT, mini invader, iStick tc40w)? Do you find it makes for a better vape to have the option to dial down the watts in temperature control mode? I'm currently using an iStick tc40w and want to know how the other options compare. Thanks!
 

kernal6500

Well-Known Member
I really hope the version three has a little less air flow and fc2000 ceramic. Using that type of ceramic will reduce the splash because the oil gets more absorbed.
 
kernal6500,
I really hope the version three has a little less air flow and fc2000 ceramic. Using that type of ceramic will reduce the splash because the oil gets more absorbed.
Have you tried this with an FC-2000 donut wick? I can't decide if I like it better w/ wick. Certainly different, but the taste of a bare ceramic hit of wax is phenomenal. Easier to burn wax getting the wick to temp, as its being heated on only one side (unlike a typical fc-2000 rod wrapped w/ a resistance coil). My experience is w/o TC, of course... I bet after the wick is brought to temp (higher temp than bare) you could have a great experience that way!
 

Steven

Well-Known Member
Have you tried this with an FC-2000 donut wick? I can't decide if I like it better w/ wick. Certainly different, but the taste of a bare ceramic hit of wax is phenomenal. Easier to burn wax getting the wick to temp, as its being heated on only one side (unlike a typical fc-2000 rod wrapped w/ a resistance coil). My experience is w/o TC, of course... I bet after the wick is brought to temp (higher temp than bare) you could have a great experience that way!
I haven't put hrs into the ceramic wick method but from what I tried I enjoyed it without the wick. It was less hassle and cleaner, thicker hits.

As for airflow, I love it as it is and would like to have an adjustable airflow system on the v3 if possible. Kinda hard with ceramic but sounds like everybody has their own airflow preference. It would bum Me out a lot to see a decreased airflow
 

mephisto

Well-Known Member
Using the V2.5 ceramic on a t/c mod set for 300f. Ends up in the 8.5 watt range, takes less than 10 seconds before big vapor production. Really happy to have gone this direction for extract consumption vs. other gear.
Too many ifs these days about ti, about nickle, I like ceramic just fine. Airflow is right on, flavor is true.
Thanks again, Matt!
 
I haven't put hrs into the ceramic wick method but from what I tried I enjoyed it without the wick. It was less hassle and cleaner, thicker hits.

As for airflow, I love it as it is and would like to have an adjustable airflow system on the v3 if possible. Kinda hard with ceramic but sounds like everybody has their own airflow preference. It would bum Me out a lot to see a decreased airflow
I think the idea of the wick is to make it load able for more than one hit, but I don't mind hitting the entire load at once, I've found; the wick only really gives me 2 hits, which is not significant enough to warrant the hassle. IMO. Maybe if i stacked a few donut wicks, I could load more, but then it would heat even slower/ less even...
 

divinetribe

We are trying our hardest to become Medical Grade
Manufacturer
Matt, can you weigh in on your experience with the three temperature control box mods you have posted about (eVic-VT, mini invader, iStick tc40w)? Do you find it makes for a better vape to have the option to dial down the watts in temperature control mode? I'm currently using an iStick tc40w and want to know how the other options compare. Thanks!
simplicity, price,reliability and size are my things, this new TC 40w eleaf wins so far .
very reliable

these donuts are still something even i am figuring out, and a couple of pointers, the concnetrates are all different, one batch of OG clear shatter might vape well at 290 and another batch won't, there are many variables, i like 290 to 310° on my eleaf
200 to 220° on the mini invader
evic software was upgraded but i never reinvested in those units after the first batch kept jumping out of temp mode,
it seem there are a ton of youtube videos of people with atty's blown because of that..
 

Czechyourhead

Well-Known Member
I've been using 2.5 on both the invader & TC 40w eleaf (both shallow and deep bowl) for a few weeks now. I'm enjoying both but prefer the invader @220 with the deep bowl. I really wish it was possible to lower the max watts on TC mode on the eleaf. Seems it hits temp too fast @40 watts, thus smaller hits. Smaller size and weigh do make it easier to carry.

I've had the invader change out of TC mode to VW mode on occasion, I'm just careful upon start up. (Mine seems to start back on 450 and 10 watts, so it's more of an inconvenience than an atty-killer.)

I agree with the folks who say lose the lower air holes in the 510 threads if at all possible. More splash up with the shallow bowl, but easier to load. Looking forward to the splash guard and improvements with 3.

Flavor is great on these. My current favorite cart for live resin/wax/shatter.

And the customer service is top notch!
 

Steven

Well-Known Member
I'm wondering what the splash guard will be like. I hope it's not like the v1 donut because that will cut down on airflow so much. The splash problem isn't even much of a problem for me anyway. I only have to clean the top cap like once a month and I use the hell outta this thing.

I never get leaks from the bottom holes but if you remove those, then please compensate the airflow somehow. More side vent holes maybe. If people don't like it they can just plug the holes. Thanx Matt. Just my 2 cents
 
Steven,

MPZ

Well-Known Member
Hi everyone,

I have a V2.5 in the mail, but instead of picking up a temperature control mod from ineedhemp, I went for an SXK Nebula. Why? Well after reading this thread:
https://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/f...herm-nife30-coefficient-of-resistance.676506/
over on one of the biggest e-cigarette forums, I figured that having some control over the way the temperature control will function on my mod would be helpful.

The TLDR of the thread I linked is that (According to the thread author) mods calculate their temperature control via a property of the resistive element called Temperature Coefficient of Resistance (TCR for short) which is the amount said element (the ceramic donut in our case) raises in resistance " for a given temperature increase relative to its starting resistance."

While this is changing as time goes on, many if not most temperature control mods currently on the market have a TCR hard coded to suit Ni200 wire (though some support titanium, the upcoming DNA200 will support anything etc. etc.- the e-cig market moves fast). Matt posted earlier in the thread (if i understood it correctly) that he believes that the wire in these atties is nichrome. Given that we actually want to control the temperature of the cramic, and that said ceramic is of course heavily insulating the nichrome (heating element), and that nichrome is usually about 80% nickel (vs over 99% for ni200) I presume said hardcoded value is significantly higher than ideal. What i find curious is that nichrome's TCR is .0004, which is super low- i guess the insulation of the ceramic brings it up.

Thankfully, there are a few mods on the market that allow one to adjust the TCR. The best option (if one can get a hold of one at present) would be a DNA 200 mod, as this allows one to connect the mod to a computer and upload an actual TCR map/curve- I'm going to leave it at that as I haven't researched the chip much. However, these are hard to come by at present and tend to cost $160+.

Which brings us to the mod I have chosen- it has a chip made by a Chinese company known as Infinite or SXK, that has what they call a "Nickel Purity setting," which allows one to change the TCR (the setting ranges from 10 to 100- Ni200 has a TCR of .006, which corresponds to 60 on the chip.) The forum post i linked specifies which mods carry the chip in question, and has some purchasing options. Personally I opted for 3fvape, as those posting in the thread i linked reported that they have mods with the very latest version of the chip (earlier ones were reading the initial resistance of atomizers a bit low- but they still work great according to those in the thread and various e-cig youtube reviewers)

I've noticed people mentioning issues with their mod kicking out of temperature control mode. With this chip you turn temperature control on and off yourself- so i don't believe that's even possible for it.

I also noticed people mentioning that their atomizer's resistance doesen't rise when they heat it. It has been my personal experience with a ceramic donut atomizer from another source... i mean company ;), that they can "break in" if you will (start heating faster over time). There are a number of possible explanations for this, one being manufacturing differences (varying amounts of contact/pressure between the nichrome and ceramic across different atties causing better or worse heat transfer), but the other possible explanation here is oxidization of the outside of the nichrome (which i imagine would theoretically improve your contact between it and the ceramic). I'm not studying physics in college like my best friend, and high school physics was like 6 or 7 years ago, but i suspect the TLDR here is if your atty's resistance isnt climbing mid-hit, it might just do so in time. Or if you give it more heat.

Now, I purchased a black one of these:
sxk-nebula-60w-tc.jpg

The SXK Nebula. I might have made a mistake though- there are 2 things- one i didn't notice until too late, one I forgot about. I forgot to find out if the chip has a cutoff time (a common safety feature for e-cig oriented mods) or how long said cutoff time is. At worst, this will mean quickly cycling the fire button every 10 seconds- not ideal, but i figure i can live with it, and worth it to me for an adjustable TCR. The second thing is specific to this mod (the cutoff time, if there is one, would be on all mods as it would be coded into the chip).
11376142_604874032948947_232399592_n.jpg

If you look at the above image, you might notice that the 510 connection is recessed into a circular cutout in the mod. This cutout is sized for the standard atomizer size for e-cig stuff- a review of the mod on youtube quoted it at 23.2mm in diameter (standard for atties in the e-cig world is 20mm).

I haven't been able to track down the dimensions of the ineedhemp 2.5 atty- if someone could let me know that would be extremely helpful.

But if the cutout is too small, that could of course be an issue. I ordered a 510 extension/adapter, but this is far from ideal given that temperature control relies on precise resistance measurements in real time- the manual of the device even says that if one's atty isn't screwed all the way in, temperature control won't work. So i suspect using a 510 adapter might degrade performance a bit (at minimum it will add resistance, which i will have to compensate for.

Thankfully, there are other mods with this chip that don't have their 510 connections sitting in a cutout.

In the future, I will probably buy a DNA200 mod, once they can be purchased in a size (and hopefully at a price) more suited to my purposes. At present, the mods coming out are packing enough LiPo batteries to push 200 watts- I certainly don't need that! So i'm waiting for a smaller device with less batteries to hit the market.

In the meantime, I will be experimenting with adjustable TCR temperature control via infinite's "Nickel Purity" chip on the 2.5 and 1, maybe 2 other ceramic donut atomizers on the market. Well, once my atomizer, mod, and batteries all arrive.

More to follow when everything shows and I test the setup. :tup:

I'm really hoping i don't have fitment issues- hopefully either the 2.5 is 23mm or less in diameter, or its 510 pin is long enough that i can get a good connection and airflow without the atty needing to get into the cutout. Otherwise, hopefully i can still get good performance with an adapter. We shall see::shrug:

Happy vaping! :D

Edit: BTW the Silver and Black versions of this mod are aluminum, while the gold is solid brass (and thus substantially heavier). I went black to keep things lightweight and less eye-catching (not often a legality issue where i live, but i like to keep a low profile), and because it was on sale ($5 off) for $48 shipped.

Another edit: for anyone whose mod has a Titanium setting, give it a try. If the heating wire is nichrome as Matt said, it should theoretically give more accurate results (IIRC Titanium's TCR is .0035- and if i understand all this correctly, the TCR of the 2.5 atty is definitely lower than .006)
 
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CharlieBelmont

Well-Known Member
nice post thanks for the info. measured the dia of the v2.5 to just about 20mm so you should probably be good unless my math is bad. Just over 3/4" and under 13/16th"
 

kernal6500

Well-Known Member
Im noticing that the bottom where the atomizer screws into gets a lot of oil stuck and start to bleed out. I also noticed that when I took apart the atomizer a lot of my wax was stuck on the inside of the unit..... I usually do not overload still get great hits but im not to fond of the leakage.
 

MPZ

Well-Known Member
nice post thanks for the info. measured the dia of the v2.5 to just about 20mm so you should probably be good unless my math is bad. Just over 3/4" and under 13/16th"

Thanks! LoL maybe i should have waited to buy those adapters- ah well, only about $5 wasted. I'm definitely glad to hear that the 2.5 atty will fit.

Since I can't seem to edit my earlier post, I will just have to hope people keep reading I guess. Now that cutout is only a concern with regards to future atties/revisions being over 23mm. Also it sounds like others are dealing with their 10 second cutoffs just fine. It seems like it only becomes a possible issue in wattage mode as the mod will bump up the voltage if it is seeing a higher resistance.
 

DJ Colonel Corn

The Vapor Ninja
Hey guys.
So, looks like a few people are cropping up with Matt's invention.
Some for close to the same price, but ah, the shipping !!!! He he he. Matt will always have the best deal.
However, looking about the internet I found these fc-2000 ceramic wicks that allegedly fit the v2.5.
You can get em by clicking here. They're normally sold with the "deep bowl" version of the DT v2.5, which they call the Unimizer.
Not sure they'd fit in the shallow bowls that I have.
Just a thought. If someone would like to try them, by all means report and let us know!
Also, looking forward to some bubbler-to-v2.5 glass connections to appear soon !
Right on Divine Tribe you have a fan in me. Vape on, everyone.

Oh and P.S. I use an IPV 4S and will measure resistance during use and let y'all know what this one says...
 

Steven

Well-Known Member
Hey guys.
So, looks like a few people are cropping up with Matt's invention.
Some for close to the same price, but ah, the shipping !!!! He he he. Matt will always have the best deal.
However, looking about the internet I found these fc-2000 ceramic wicks that allegedly fit the v2.5.
You can get em by clicking here. They're normally sold with the "deep bowl" version of the DT v2.5, which they call the Unimizer.
Not sure they'd fit in the shallow bowls that I have.
Just a thought. If someone would like to try them, by all means report and let us know!
Also, looking forward to some bubbler-to-v2.5 glass connections to appear soon !
Right on Divine Tribe you have a fan in me. Vape on, everyone.

Oh and P.S. I use an IPV 4S and will measure resistance during use and let y'all know what this one says...

Yea it seems like Matt scored a deal with Atmos, which is great. Matt deserves it for the R&D he put into the donut atty.

I'm wondering if that site reimburses Matt in any way. Shame if it doesnt
 

MPZ

Well-Known Member
Hey guys.
So, looks like a few people are cropping up with Matt's invention.
Some for close to the same price, but ah, the shipping !!!! He he he. Matt will always have the best deal.
However, looking about the internet I found these fc-2000 ceramic wicks that allegedly fit the v2.5.
You can get em by clicking here. They're normally sold with the "deep bowl" version of the DT v2.5, which they call the Unimizer.
Not sure they'd fit in the shallow bowls that I have.
Just a thought. If someone would like to try them, by all means report and let us know!
Also, looking forward to some bubbler-to-v2.5 glass connections to appear soon !
Right on Divine Tribe you have a fan in me. Vape on, everyone.

Oh and P.S. I use an IPV 4S and will measure resistance during use and let y'all know what this one says...

Lol i don't think that website sells anything they did R&D on. I'm pretty sure those ceramic wicks are from
W9tech:
http://www.w9tech.com/black-ceramic-wick-5-pack/
I'm glad you posted that link- I meant to but totally forgot about it.
Yea it seems like Matt scored a deal with Atmos, which is great. Matt deserves it for the R&D he put into the donut atty.

I'm wondering if that site reimburses Matt in any way. Shame if it doesnt

As long as they are buying wholesale from Matt, and not the factory in china that makes the atties, i'm pretty sure he's fine with it. (at least according to what he said about the Atmos account)
 
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