VaporGenie

MoeOnTheMoon said:

Funny, I thought mine was BIGGER than I had thought it would be!

Wish I had got a hand carved Walnut one, myself... I didn't investigate closely enough so did not know they made them.

But now I am torn between getting a Walnut one or a Glass one. They definitely work very well. My only problem is I get so medicated off of just one or two tokes, I can't experiment further with the process of it. Maybe I need to get some really low grade shake to experiment with! Actually that's a very good idea I think!

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I'd go with glass. Everyone raves about it.

I have the basic design and I love it. The ability to toke almost anywhere without a great chance of getting caught is awesome.

Okay, I've only gotten through the first 10 pages of this thread and that took me a L O N G time so I have to just ask this even though it may be addressed in those other 23 pages somewhere:

What about using the top of the Genie on a bong or water pipe? Seems like that should work just fine, no?

My one issue with using the Vapor Genie at home (it's my only vape so far) is that the vapor is somewhat hot and I've always been one to use a water pipe or bong to cool the smoke, or in this case, vapor.

Looking at it, I don't see why I could not attach the VG top to any water pipe with the proper threaded attachment, and use it that way at home instead of using the VG pipe itself.

As to the glass VG, seems awfully expensive for glass. If it were only slightly more than the regular VG I could go for it, but it seems like an awful lot of money for something that could break fairly easily, and for $50 more one could get a MyrtleZap, a DaBuddha or etc. other vapes that are probably "better" in some ways. But to each his own. Actually I MAY still get a glass one anyway. But it just seems like a lot of $. And couldn't I accomplish virtually the same thing - being able to see the vapor - PLUS get water filtration - by attaching the heating element to a water pipe with tube?

Also someone mentioned getting silicon tubing instead of food grade vinyl tubing. Do head shops usually carry silicon tubing? I've never asked at one.

I'm pretty sure someone in this thread did that and documented it. I just can't remember what page. Try around 12 or so in the thread.

SmogTown said:

I'm pretty sure someone in this thread did that and documented it. I just can't remember what page. Try around 12 or so in the thread.

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Thanks a lot, SmogTown.
I read those threads - I think it started on p.13 actually - and they were discussing using the VG top attached to a bong bowl. That was exactly the encouragement I needed to try my DIY modification.

I had been using a tiny water pipe for smoking. Don't ask why, it's a long story. But anyway I like bongs but also like the old style water pipe - though usually a bigger one - and don't know why more people don't use them, but that's another thread.

So I had this tiny water pipe and lo and behold it has the exact same inner thread as my vapor genie top! Is that a coincidence, or what? Great synchronicity at work...

So I attached the VG top to the water pipe and loaded it with some nicely dried mj, got my 99 cent store barbecue lighter and tried it out. At first I wasn't drawing hard enough and it wasn't working. Then I drew harder and I wasn't sure if I was tasting it or not. I can taste it with the VG attached to its regular pipe bottom, but with this I wasn't really tasting it. But I blew out to see if I had gotten any vapor and yeah, I did. So I took another hit and this time I really got a good hit and yet I could not even feel it in my throat, at all.

I'm all for tasting the mj ...but for the most part I"d rather protect my lungs. And if I am doing that by cooling the smoke with water then that's how it has to be. Maybe with bigger hits, though, you can taste the mj. Actually you can still taste it, it's just a more subtle taste.

Now, this particular concept is not ideal, because I do have the rubber and the plastic tubing in the path. BUT someone was saying you could get silicon tubing (?) - or at least medical grade tube; and I will have to work on a way to minimize or eliminate the rubber. But actually, is rubber harmful if it's not heated? There is no heat in contact with it. Maybe it depends on the type and quality of the rubber? If anyone knows or has info on this please post it.

So anyway, here's a picture of it. Of course this was just a first try. Now that I know it works, I will get a nice sized glass jar,and all new everything except for the Genie heater attachment.

Another thing: It would be great if Vapor Genie would make an all glass one like the one they have, BUT with a chamber you could fill with water in the middle. Man, I'd buy that in 2 seconds! Although I guess my home made job like above will be just as good once I get a bigger water jar and so on... Even if they'd make the glass one with a standard stem so that you could attach some tubing to it so you could run it through a water filter or just use tubing to cool the smoke... would be nice.

moon...post #313 in this thread. I did a setup with the VG top attached to a brass bowl and a plastic water pipe. Super ghetto, but to this day still some of the smoothest, potent hits I have ever had.

Yeah, stickstones, I saw that, and that's what inspired me to try it with my water pipe. Thanks for documenting it.

Tomorrow I'm going to a local head shop to see if I can get a larger water container and etc. to make this a more permanent solution. I still want to get a PD or MZ but I do prefer using water. I take it you do not use your "ghetto" VP regularly. Have you found another method to use with water filtration, or do you not require water filtration on a regular basis?

I actually never hit that thing anymore, but I think I will drag it out after I get my next score. I tend to almost exclusively PD, unless travelling, so I don't do much water filtration. Next on my list is the VHW, and I think I am getting close. When I get that thing it will be my preferred method of filtration.

On a side note, currently I only have regs in my box, and they do me much better when smoked as opposed to vaped, so I've been smoking more than vaping this last week.

Question: In designing my own Vapor Genie water pipe - since I can't find one exactly like I want - I saw one that uses a rubbery/ plastic top to the "jar". I am thinking there is not much of a health issue with that because the water vapor will be cooled by the time it comes in contact with it, and the water also will not come in contact with it. What do you think? And if not plastic, what would or should I use?

I'm going to another store tomorrow to see what they have but this one today only had rubber and plastic parts to hold the stem that goes down through the top, and for the top of the jar itself.

There's no point in having a bong style vaporizer. There are no unwanted particulates for the water to filter out. You'll lose a small amount of cannabinoids, that's it. If you want something to cool the vapor, you'd be better off with an ice catcher of sorts or a longer intake length so the vapor has more time to cool down. The water won't have much of any impact on the vapor though.

I've found that through a small bubbler I am able to cool vapor down and possibly moisturize it successfully enough to make vapor even more palatable. This is with cold water, not room temperature. I imagine with a percolator, water filtration would have much more of an impact than otherwise. Ice would be the best case scenario, which I hope to be able to do soon, but vaping through cold (possibly half frozen) water does help. I do this through a softwood AZ, with a ghetto rubber band superglued around the tip of the stem for a decent seal.

I went to try to find the needed materials to make my vaporGenie modification bigger and better today but "old school" supplies like metal down-stems are no longer available around here, it seems. Also no rubber or plastic top pieces with holes in them for the stem and tubing. I did find some FDA grade vinyl tubing. That will work until I can get some medical grade tubing. So tomorrow or Saturday I will look at another place. If I set it up the way I want, I can put ice OR water and ice in the water pipe with the Genie attached.

spaceman462, thanks for your input. Do you have any links to verify this information? I think you're right but I'd like to see evidence if it exists.

The main reason I am using water instead of ice is that ice won't fit in my tiny water pipe genie, above! But The way I see it there MIGHT be something in the vapor that water could filter out, and if I don't get substantially less high using a water filter, then I may as well use it "just in case".

Karazi, I'm not up on the paraphernalia lingo, what's a bubbler exactly? I think I know what you mean but not sure. I too would want to run my PD or MZ through water - and/or ice - if I could.

spaceman462 said:

There's no point in having a bong style vaporizer. There are no unwanted particulates for the water to filter out. You'll lose a small amount of cannabinoids, that's it. If you want something to cool the vapor, you'd be better off with an ice catcher of sorts or a longer intake length so the vapor has more time to cool down. The water won't have much of any impact on the vapor though.

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My experience disagrees. While I agree that ice is much better than water, water does help. And in the end the ice turns to water quickly anyhow. If one is concerned about lost chemicals, I drink the water afterwards. Come to think of it, this ghetto setup I have was always used with ice instead of water. But I had another bubbler that worked great with water.

stickstones said:

spaceman462 said:

There's no point in having a bong style vaporizer. There are no unwanted particulates for the water to filter out. You'll lose a small amount of cannabinoids, that's it. If you want something to cool the vapor, you'd be better off with an ice catcher of sorts or a longer intake length so the vapor has more time to cool down. The water won't have much of any impact on the vapor though.

Click to expand...

My experience disagrees. While I agree that ice is much better than water, water does help. And in the end the ice turns to water quickly anyhow. If one is concerned about lost chemicals, I drink the water afterwards. Come to think of it, this ghetto setup I have was always used with ice instead of water. But I had another bubbler that worked great with water.

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Drinking the water does nothing. Even if it contains cannabinoids, without a lipid of some sort to bind to, they aren't absorbed by the body. That's why eating raw weed won't do much. You need a suitable oil or fat to absorb the cannabinoids before you ingest them orally.

Thanks for the explanation, spaceman462. That makes sense to me.

I'm surprised there aren't more vaporizers that use water filtration. Maybe because it's "too messy"? Not sure why... a replaceable bowl that water goes through, an ice chamber... I can probably build it for $1000...

I'll take orders now with 50% down.

spaceman462 said:

stickstones said:

spaceman462 said:

There's no point in having a bong style vaporizer. There are no unwanted particulates for the water to filter out. You'll lose a small amount of cannabinoids, that's it. If you want something to cool the vapor, you'd be better off with an ice catcher of sorts or a longer intake length so the vapor has more time to cool down. The water won't have much of any impact on the vapor though.

Click to expand...

My experience disagrees. While I agree that ice is much better than water, water does help. And in the end the ice turns to water quickly anyhow. If one is concerned about lost chemicals, I drink the water afterwards. Come to think of it, this ghetto setup I have was always used with ice instead of water. But I had another bubbler that worked great with water.

Click to expand...

Drinking the water does nothing. Even if it contains cannabinoids, without a lipid of some sort to bind to, they aren't absorbed by the body. That's why eating raw weed won't do much. You need a suitable oil or fat to absorb the cannabinoids before you ingest them orally.

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I did not know that...thanks for the info!

spaceman462 said:

Drinking the water does nothing. Even if it contains cannabinoids, without a lipid of some sort to bind to, they aren't absorbed by the body. That's why eating raw weed won't do much. You need a suitable oil or fat to absorb the cannabinoids before you ingest them orally.

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Well, Spaceman, you seem to know what you're talking about. I'd heard something along those lines before, but then wondered if the process of decarboylation was sufficient.

So are you saying that eating straight vapour hash or iso hash or bho or whatever wouldn't be as effective as cooking it in oil? Do you even have to cook it? Is any preparation necessary at all or can you just neck your lipid right before your decarboxylated hash product?

And what about alcohol? Where does green dragon come into it? Is that a less effective method of consumption?

Can a Vapor Genie be pre-heated somehow without having to suck tons of butane or ???

This is the ONE problem I have with the Genie - I find it very hard and at times frustrating to get it up to the proper temperature.

I thought about heating it with a hair dryer but wasn't there some kind of scare about hair dryers blowing out some kind of particulate that is bad for you, awhile back?

Anyone come up with an efficient way to pre-heat the Genie without sucking on butane? I did try just heating it with a lighter but ended up burning the ceramic (a little).

At first I found it easier to hit on the Genie, now I'm finding it harder. But according to the web site, if it's just got a small burn in the ceramic, that is not a problem, it will fix itself over time, so I don't think that's the problem. I think somehow I "lost" the technique I was using... maybe I need a refresher course... (I've actually only used it a half dozen times or so, so far. Out of those times, the first couple of times I got good hits, after that I've been having problems. (???) But it seems to me what we need is a good way to pre-heat it to just the right temp! I wonder if you could put it in the oven for 3 min. or something like that?

I'm still stuck on this stuff below!! Would love to know more about lipids, etc. as we're all discussing GD's in other threads... I would love to know more about the science behind this as well... if you don't mind cluing us in Spaceman!! Curious minds here

Qbit said:

spaceman462 said:

Drinking the water does nothing. Even if it contains cannabinoids, without a lipid of some sort to bind to, they aren't absorbed by the body. That's why eating raw weed won't do much. You need a suitable oil or fat to absorb the cannabinoids before you ingest them orally.

Click to expand...

Well, Spaceman, you seem to know what you're talking about. I'd heard something along those lines before, but then wondered if the process of decarboylation was sufficient.

So are you saying that eating straight vapour hash or iso hash or bho or whatever wouldn't be as effective as cooking it in oil? Do you even have to cook it? Is any preparation necessary at all or can you just neck your lipid right before your decarboxylated hash product?

And what about alcohol? Where does green dragon come into it? Is that a less effective method of consumption?

Click to expand...

I've always been lead to believe the same as spaceman. It's just that thc is not water soluable, and because of this our bodies struggle to absorb it effectively when eaten in it's 'unbound' (and especially if it's had no heat as well) state. So therefore eating an amount of raw weed should have little effect on someone.

This is one of the reasons i believe people get sometimes caught out with space cakes. If they have had a version not bound to fat before, then they have a properly made cake....they may eat too much by mistake.

MoeOnTheMoon said:

This is the ONE problem I have with the Genie - I find it very hard and at times frustrating to get it up to the proper temperature.

I thought about heating it with a hair dryer but wasn't there some kind of scare about hair dryers blowing out some kind of particulate that is bad for you, awhile back?

?

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Older hair dryers had absestos - I don't think there is a problem now, but I'm not sure.

I gave a wooden Vapor Genie as a gift, and I found (somewhere) the following excellent post on how to hit a Genie: pay attention to tongue position.

> January 8, 2009 [redacted] wrote: The VaporGenie needs some getting used to, you can't just light and hit it, 'cause if you overheat the herb it burns, equalling nasty coughs. Once you get it down, though, you can get ripped on a fraction of the dope you'd normally only smoke to take the edge off things.
>
> Here's my personal technique:
>
> 1. Use a small flame and ever so lightly drag on the Genie, just enough to get the flame drooping into the hole.
> 2. Place the tip of your tongue on your palate while doing this, as this allows you to *gauge the temperature with the bottom of your tongue*, rather than the back of your throat.
> 3. When you feel warm vapor trickling through wait a second or so, then cut the flame and hit that pipe hard as if you're letting rip on a bong. Hold that vopor in.
> 4. Exhale big fluffy clouds of vapor.

Works for me.

Qbit said:

spaceman462 said:

Drinking the water does nothing. Even if it contains cannabinoids, without a lipid of some sort to bind to, they aren't absorbed by the body. That's why eating raw weed won't do much. You need a suitable oil or fat to absorb the cannabinoids before you ingest them orally.

Click to expand...

Well, Spaceman, you seem to know what you're talking about. I'd heard something along those lines before, but then wondered if the process of decarboylation was sufficient.

So are you saying that eating straight vapour hash or iso hash or bho or whatever wouldn't be as effective as cooking it in oil? Do you even have to cook it? Is any preparation necessary at all or can you just neck your lipid right before your decarboxylated hash product?

And what about alcohol? Where does green dragon come into it? Is that a less effective method of consumption?

Click to expand...

I was curious about this as well. I've heard both that it does and doesn't work.. proof please? I'd really like to get to the bottom of this.

I'd love a definitive on the lipids... Have always heard contradicting stories... What about the presents of fats already in the stomach?? Any help?

Years ago my dr told me that he was fine with me using the herb... just not keen on the smoking aspect of things (he's cool, real dr but into holistic stuff and we can talk without everthing going into my record ). So, I asked about eating, etc. saying I'd get fat eating brownies duh! He told me bruce lee used to eat his herb to keep healthy and had a bunch in his stomach on autopsy. Okay... I always assumed he had heated and eated LOL... What about lipids?? Hell I never even watched bruce lee movies and no internet then so I didn't look it up but... Wondering! Curiosity killed the cat and all!!


**I KNOW this probably shouldn't be in the Genie thread but this is where it happened - so sorry for off Genie topic**

moon...the butant thing has been covered in this thread. It burns up before you get a chnace to inhale it.

stickstones said:

moon...the butant thing has been covered in this thread. It burns up before you get a chnace to inhale it.

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Yeah, no worries on the butane thing unless you're concerned about H20