pyronym
Harry Mooseknuckle
I hooked up my zap yesterday to my bong and it fits perfectly in the 14mm gong slide/diffuser. Holy shit, I can get massive massive hits off of this as big or bigger than the hit's from my ssv just have to refill the stem after 5 or 6 hits. Oh and the new stems with the larger inside diameter are awesome it makes for a much smoother draw. I think I may put my ssv away for a while and just pull it out when I'm with friends.
Rick, I got that Myrtle ripped up and got top and bottoms screwed on a dozen or so pieces. You were right, that wood does get hot easy. I was worried about that, got minimal burns but no sweat they look great. Even got one that matches the BZ you sent me. I am really excited to show you some pics of the matching set in the next few weeks. Yeah I wanted to discuss those tubes with you as well. I knew you would steer me in the right direction. I am eying some intense Cali Redwood Burl blocks now. They have many eyes and swirls and the redwood is a fairly soft wood, I would say maybe even softer that pine. Do you think that would work before I go spending a bunch of dough? Figured if I got me one, I would get you one as well. You got to have your own BurleeZap!!!! Hey I hope you still got my #, if so give me a holla when you wanna rap about all this and that.
Thank you my friend!!!!
Thank you my friend!!!!
pyronym
Harry Mooseknuckle
I love my SSV. With my last zap it never seemed to get hot enough in the house so I just used it as a car vap, with hindsight I now know that I just needed to let it break in first. I think I'm going to buy a second one now to keep in my car. I'm thinking one of the ones without the light.
IAmKrazy2
Darth Vapor
Rick, thanks for the stems. The smooth hole that runs through the stem is for sure a difference maker. I like nylon too. Regarding MZ stems anyone have both the standard and the wide holed stems like me? I noticed a much higher vapor to air ratio in the wider stems. Something that can be nice sometimes, giving me some more variety with my MZ and PD use. Honestly, nice to have both. Thanks.
Rick, do you have a Zap you use most often? Would love to see a pic of your personal device of most use. Softwood? Myrtle? LED Light? No light? Or do you just use all of ours for a puff and a goodbye on their way out the door? Thanks.
Rick, do you have a Zap you use most often? Would love to see a pic of your personal device of most use. Softwood? Myrtle? LED Light? No light? Or do you just use all of ours for a puff and a goodbye on their way out the door? Thanks.
Hey Krazy, could you elaborate a bit about the smooth hole/standard/wide-holed stems you're referring to please? Sorry if this has been discussed before and I missed it! Do your zap stems fit nicely in the PD? Sorry for the trouble!IAmKrazy2 said:
mnmlh: i've really tried to justify another (non-portable) vape purchase but these zap/pd types suit me so well, it is hard to. i definitely have NO issues with vapor as well, gotta love it
indigal
Amongst the corn
Just received my MZ from a member here- Thanks sam urai! 
It is very striking, so now I have two pretty figured wood vapes to enjoy, and no more moving from room to room! That will improve movie nights around here.
It's currently sitting here warming up, can't wait to try it!
Edit:
The MZ is great eye candy. It's also a fantastic vape!
I like the tubes, but I think I may need to get slightly bigger whip tubing if boiling the tubing doesn't work. I like adding an extender with a mouthpiece just to cool it down. Though naked stock tubes are not too hot. Great vapor output. Love it!
Thanks from a second-hand MZ owner- keeping it in the FC family.
It is very striking, so now I have two pretty figured wood vapes to enjoy, and no more moving from room to room! That will improve movie nights around here.
It's currently sitting here warming up, can't wait to try it!
Edit:
The MZ is great eye candy. It's also a fantastic vape!
I like the tubes, but I think I may need to get slightly bigger whip tubing if boiling the tubing doesn't work. I like adding an extender with a mouthpiece just to cool it down. Though naked stock tubes are not too hot. Great vapor output. Love it!
Thanks from a second-hand MZ owner- keeping it in the FC family.
IAmKrazy2
Darth Vapor
No trouble, i didn't explain well. I think recently on the PD thread it was mentioned Tom actually drills his stems himself, which is fine but this means the hole is not perfectly smooth, because a metal bit won't make the inside completely perfect. This means more honey will collect on the inside. This is something Tom is actually looking into as a possible stem improvement in the future. Not a huge deal, but it is noticeable. Because of this and/or the nylon material that Rick uses, his stems clean a little easier. I believe Rick buys his stems pre-drilled. If you look at my MZ vs. PD thread, you will notice i have always favored the MZ stems nylon over the safe plastic Tom uses. I feel there is a little better and more noticeable taste factor with nylon. I do prefer the SS bowl of the PD stems, but this is not a deal breaker. Both companies maker good product, and ordering from Rick or Tom each carries diffrent upsides and downsides. Some of these, like the stems, can vary from person to person. That being said, most users i have know to try both stem types, have preferred the MZ stems slightly. My
The original and most common MZ stems have a smaller hold drilled through them then "wide hole" stems that Rick offers once in a great while. In my humble opinion the original ones are better. But, the wider bored stems produce a higher air to vapor ratio in my opinion giving lighter hits to your lungs, with a smoother vapor. Once again, judge for yourself.
Thanks a lot for taking the time to respond, that was very informative! I wonder how the MZ stems compare to the PD/WDZ (the latter being what I own) stems ID wise (which is what I gather you mean when you mention the difference in hole width in old and new MZ stems). I do like the sound of less air in my vapor stream, similar to your preference of the older MZ stems.IAmKrazy2 said:No trouble, i didn't explain well. I think recently on the PD thread it was mentioned Tom actually drills his stems himself, which is fine but this means the hole is not perfectly smooth, because a metal bit won't make the inside completely perfect. This means more honey will collect on the inside. This is something Tom is actually looking into as a possible stem improvement in the future. Not a huge deal, but it is noticeable. Because of this and/or the nylon material that Rick uses, his stems clean a little easier. I believe Rick buys his stems pre-drilled. If you look at my MZ vs. PD thread, you will notice i have always favored the MZ stems nylon over the safe plastic Tom uses. I feel there is a little better and more noticeable taste factor with nylon. I do prefer the SS bowl of the PD stems, but this is not a deal breaker. Both companies maker good product, and ordering from Rick or Tom each carries diffrent upsides and downsides. Some of these, like the stems, can vary from person to person. That being said, most users i have know to try both stem types, have preferred the MZ stems slightly. My
The original and most common MZ stems have a smaller hold drilled through them then "wide hole" stems that Rick offers once in a great while. In my humble opinion the original ones are better. But, the wider bored stems produce a higher air to vapor ratio in my opinion giving lighter hits to your lungs, with a smoother vapor. Once again, judge for yourself.
Now that I have your attention though ( how's that for taking advantage of the spirit of generosity
) : in a comparison you did of the PD/MZ a while back, you mentioned the MZ giving lighter vapor than the PD generally (i.e. at similar voltage transformers, the PD seemed hotter). I was wondering if you noticed this to be true even later, after the MZ was broken in considerably too? Thanks again for your response!
(btw, if you or anyone else feels my question is going to spark another round of controversy, please feel free to ask me to edit it out. It would be nice if you could e-mail me your comment re vapor difference after MZ break-in in that case though if that's not asking for too much!! )
IAmKrazy2
Darth Vapor
I have noticed improvement in my MZ vapor clouds since i originally wrote the review. I used to use a 13v plug most of the time with my MZ, to get the clouds i had really grown accustomed to with my PD. Now, i would never use more then a 12v.
Back to back comparison today, the PD does produce slightly bigger clouds, i don't know for certain that this a a temperature thing, and it might have more to do with the HE retaining heat. I can notice the difference the easiest when hooking them up both back to back with my glass tubes. The PD clouds that glass up more, and hits straight from the stem and water filtered don't feel hotter out of the PD. Just a bit thicker.
once again i would recommend either vape to a friend or confidant, you have to decide which is right for you. or be Krazy like me, end up with 3 PD's and a MZ.
Back to back comparison today, the PD does produce slightly bigger clouds, i don't know for certain that this a a temperature thing, and it might have more to do with the HE retaining heat. I can notice the difference the easiest when hooking them up both back to back with my glass tubes. The PD clouds that glass up more, and hits straight from the stem and water filtered don't feel hotter out of the PD. Just a bit thicker.
once again i would recommend either vape to a friend or confidant, you have to decide which is right for you. or be Krazy like me, end up with 3 PD's and a MZ.
momofthegoons
vapor accessory addict
This was the deciding factor for me. Add on the beauty of the wood and availability/delivery time I was sold. Rick and Pat are really nice and Rick has been working with me on picking out a "Classic" that I can't wait to see.
I really appreciate your honesty Krazy. And I agree; variety is the spice of life. I'm on my way to building a vaporizer arsenal.
I rec'd my MZ today. It is not new and I did not purchase it from Rick. I bought it from a previous owner.
It is on the 12v adapter now even though I like my wdz only on the 13.5v transformer. i hope to switch adapters a bit and note differences.
first impressions:
a) the person who sent me these did not clean the damn tubes. the screens are all clogged and it looks like the vape wasn't used for a while even though i was told it is only 2-3 months old. no worries, i will be doing a boil soon. if that does not work, my wdz stem can be wrenched into the mz-- correction about this part, all my wdz stems do not fit into the mz. only one does, with negligible wrestling. all others do not fit in at all.
b) the MZ is a LOT thinner than my wdz. I know Rick said that diameters differ from unit to unit but this is a very noticeable difference. whether the thinner profile affects how the unit holds heat, i dunno. but if it does, i sure hope thinner means hotter
c) the wood is beautiful. I do not have a primo but a regular one. it has color variations that are subtle but beautiful. also, i cannot get over how smooth the wood is (haha). there is a marked difference between the wdz i got and the MZ. the mz just looks better quality aesthetically. (I am NOT saying the wdz is built shabbily, it is a solid unit, i have actually used my wdz as a hammer once, no joke, it has two dents in the wood but no issues, hehe) the wdz i got had a lot of overflowing glue or whatever at the bottom. i scraped some of it off but some of it is still there. the mz definitely is more impressive on first glance.
d) the screen in the heat port (where you put the stem) has a clip that seems out of place. the screen seems to be placed very solidly though
e) the bottom of the MZ, where there some kind of a leather, seems flimsy. what i mean is, there is a hole in the bottom of the unit, where all the internals go. this hole is covered by leather. in the wdz, this hole is not noticeable even though it is obviously there. i think todd put slapped some wood back on the hole before he covered it up with cloth or leather or whatever. the MZ seems flimsy in this regard because I could poke a hole into it if i got too stoned and did something stupid. the wdz bottom is very solid and i like that. i know that i have slapped my wdz's bottom many times and hard (cuz she likes it that way), i think i will have to be more careful with the mz. though, i am hoping that screen means no need to overturn and slap shit out of the MZ like i have to do with the wdz (which is not a problem at all btw)
it is still heating so more important observations -- such as how it tokes
-- will follow. needless to say i am very excited.
I wish i had a camera, damn!
EDIT:
Still trying to clean those blasted stems. I just noticed one thing: in the mz, when the stem is in the heat port, the crimp on the brass part of the tube does not go entirely into the heat port. I would say that the stem tip goes in only 3/4th of its length in. is this normal? if so, does the herb right next to the screen in the stem-- which is technically not inside the heat port but is being heated i guess-- get heated properly?
well, i guess i'll find out soon enough myself, but any pointers regarding that would be great!
It is on the 12v adapter now even though I like my wdz only on the 13.5v transformer. i hope to switch adapters a bit and note differences.
first impressions:
a) the person who sent me these did not clean the damn tubes. the screens are all clogged and it looks like the vape wasn't used for a while even though i was told it is only 2-3 months old. no worries, i will be doing a boil soon. if that does not work, my wdz stem can be wrenched into the mz-- correction about this part, all my wdz stems do not fit into the mz. only one does, with negligible wrestling. all others do not fit in at all.
b) the MZ is a LOT thinner than my wdz. I know Rick said that diameters differ from unit to unit but this is a very noticeable difference. whether the thinner profile affects how the unit holds heat, i dunno. but if it does, i sure hope thinner means hotter
c) the wood is beautiful. I do not have a primo but a regular one. it has color variations that are subtle but beautiful. also, i cannot get over how smooth the wood is (haha). there is a marked difference between the wdz i got and the MZ. the mz just looks better quality aesthetically. (I am NOT saying the wdz is built shabbily, it is a solid unit, i have actually used my wdz as a hammer once, no joke, it has two dents in the wood but no issues, hehe) the wdz i got had a lot of overflowing glue or whatever at the bottom. i scraped some of it off but some of it is still there. the mz definitely is more impressive on first glance.
d) the screen in the heat port (where you put the stem) has a clip that seems out of place. the screen seems to be placed very solidly though
e) the bottom of the MZ, where there some kind of a leather, seems flimsy. what i mean is, there is a hole in the bottom of the unit, where all the internals go. this hole is covered by leather. in the wdz, this hole is not noticeable even though it is obviously there. i think todd put slapped some wood back on the hole before he covered it up with cloth or leather or whatever. the MZ seems flimsy in this regard because I could poke a hole into it if i got too stoned and did something stupid. the wdz bottom is very solid and i like that. i know that i have slapped my wdz's bottom many times and hard (cuz she likes it that way
), i think i will have to be more careful with the mz. though, i am hoping that screen means no need to overturn and slap shit out of the MZ like i have to do with the wdz (which is not a problem at all btw)it is still heating so more important observations -- such as how it tokes
-- will follow. needless to say i am very excited. I wish i had a camera, damn!
EDIT:
Still trying to clean those blasted stems. I just noticed one thing: in the mz, when the stem is in the heat port, the crimp on the brass part of the tube does not go entirely into the heat port. I would say that the stem tip goes in only 3/4th of its length in. is this normal? if so, does the herb right next to the screen in the stem-- which is technically not inside the heat port but is being heated i guess-- get heated properly?
well, i guess i'll find out soon enough myself, but any pointers regarding that would be great!
indigal
Amongst the corn
Soak your stems with iso alcohol or everclear- that should get them to almost squeaky clean.. as far as the stem to port depth- mine go as far as the screen clip lets them, the fit is tighter than the PD stems, no wiggle room.obelisk said:
I also got mine used, clean & I love it.
Rick
Zapman
obelisk
If you put the Zap on a flat surface you can put a stem in the heatport and push down firmly to re-seat the top clip that holds the heatport screen in place. You can push hard as there is another clip under the screen that rests against a hidden crimp in the heatport tube so it will not go anywhere except back home.
Myrtles bottom, under the recycled St Vinnies leather, is heavy cardboard, yes. It has always worked fine because the girl is supposed to sit on her bottom, not have people play with her bottom. She is an old school girl. Seriously though, her bottom is softer than wood as it should be but it does a good job. Easy access to lower end wiring if needed too.
As long as the stem fits in the heatport tube even 1/8 inch, it will get the proper vaping air. I would not be concerned if it does not go down to a crimp or whatever. That top clip holding it back can be re-seated though.
Oh, yes. Thinner will mean she runs more on the hot side.
On finishing, etc. I still have some intense stationary sanders from the old square AZ days so I can get the end grain pretty good. The rest is just time. I hand sand on the lathe because the piece is held so firmly in the lathe. Then a very very fine sand on the lathe. Then another 15 minutes or so of hand sanding after I bore all the holes.
If you put the Zap on a flat surface you can put a stem in the heatport and push down firmly to re-seat the top clip that holds the heatport screen in place. You can push hard as there is another clip under the screen that rests against a hidden crimp in the heatport tube so it will not go anywhere except back home.
Myrtles bottom, under the recycled St Vinnies leather, is heavy cardboard, yes. It has always worked fine because the girl is supposed to sit on her bottom, not have people play with her bottom. She is an old school girl. Seriously though, her bottom is softer than wood as it should be but it does a good job. Easy access to lower end wiring if needed too.
As long as the stem fits in the heatport tube even 1/8 inch, it will get the proper vaping air. I would not be concerned if it does not go down to a crimp or whatever. That top clip holding it back can be re-seated though.
Oh, yes. Thinner will mean she runs more on the hot side.
On finishing, etc. I still have some intense stationary sanders from the old square AZ days so I can get the end grain pretty good. The rest is just time. I hand sand on the lathe because the piece is held so firmly in the lathe. Then a very very fine sand on the lathe. Then another 15 minutes or so of hand sanding after I bore all the holes.
Jive Turkey
Well-Known Member
Lately, I've noticed my MyrtleZap has been giving significantly smaller hits than usual. Also, I've noticed the metal piece at the top of the unit is loose - I'm sure the two problems coincide. By the metal piece being loose, I mean I can stick my stem in the socket and spin it around, and the metallic plate on top of the unit will spin completely along with it.
Is there a way to tighten this thing back up?
Is there a way to tighten this thing back up?
Rick
Zapman
I prefer to use a 3/4 copper pipe bushing or a socket that will fit in the top hole and rest over the internal retaining ring that holds the heatport in place. Put the Zap on a firm surface, bushing or socket over the ring and give the bushing a good rap with a hammer a time or two. I have also seen someone else recommend a flat bladed screwdriver and tap all around the circumference a bit at a time. I like the bushing because it does it all at once, nice and square to the hole. If you really want to hold it tight for a lot longer, put another 1" retaining ring over the existing one and rap it down.
There is no heat affect from the loose heatport, at least there should not be. If you have a transformer cord that is starting to go right next to the plug that goes into the Zap, you could be down to a few strands of the wire left. You will get enough amperage to light the led but not enough to properly power the heater. A possibility anyway.
There is no heat affect from the loose heatport, at least there should not be. If you have a transformer cord that is starting to go right next to the plug that goes into the Zap, you could be down to a few strands of the wire left. You will get enough amperage to light the led but not enough to properly power the heater. A possibility anyway.
Jive Turkey
Well-Known Member
What an easy fix.
I just took another empty stem and used the brass end of it to push the ring back down. You really don't even have to push hard at all; if the unit is warm the ring slides right back in place.
EDIT - At any rate, I think the problem may be the ganja itself. It's purple dro, but it doesn't vape well at all. It's good for about one and a half hits, and then the stem is drained. It's the strangest thing; I've tried tons of different strains in the vape and this has never happened before.
Perhaps the weed is a bit too moist? It doesn't feel very moist, but it wasn't dry and crumbly like many strains I've used before.
I just took another empty stem and used the brass end of it to push the ring back down. You really don't even have to push hard at all; if the unit is warm the ring slides right back in place.
EDIT - At any rate, I think the problem may be the ganja itself. It's purple dro, but it doesn't vape well at all. It's good for about one and a half hits, and then the stem is drained. It's the strangest thing; I've tried tons of different strains in the vape and this has never happened before.
Perhaps the weed is a bit too moist? It doesn't feel very moist, but it wasn't dry and crumbly like many strains I've used before.
reece
Well-Known Member
It's probably the strain, or that particular specimen. The first time it happened to me I had the same reaction. I thought something was wrong with my vaporizer (Supreme Vaporizer). I've had different buds from the same strain give different amounts of vapor. One would be as you describe but the other would be better, though usually still not as much vapor as other strains. I have a friend who smokes. We usually get our stuff from the same source. Whenever I get something that doesn't produce much vapor, his experience is that it burns up very quickly in a pipe.Jive Turkey said:What an easy fix.
I just took another empty stem and used the brass end of it to push the ring back down. You really don't even have to push hard at all; if the unit is warm the ring slides right back in place.
EDIT - At any rate, I think the problem may be the ganja itself. It's purple dro, but it doesn't vape well at all. It's good for about one and a half hits, and then the stem is drained. It's the strangest thing; I've tried tons of different strains in the vape and this has never happened before.
How bout it all, Good morning out there. I have got to say that I am enjoying the BurleeZap, it is breaking in just nicely. I have done as you instructed Rick, just plug it up and let it get hot for a couple of days. Between planting the garden, wood work, and getting the new shop ready I take a couple minutes out to get to know my BZ as much as I can, I am really digging it. I do like the taste of the hit and the feeling it leaves me with as well. I however have been reading about the 13.5v adapter that the others have used and dont wanna be left out, so i am wondering where I can get my hands on one. I dont know if it is gonna be to much for me or what, but dont wanna feel like I havent tried my piece a different way if possible. Someone pls let me fill me in.
Hey Ed, you can get an adapter from Rick for 15 bucks. I ordered one myself the other day. 13.5v will definitely add a body hit to the high, but not as much as smoking. I'd definitely recommend at least trying it. Glad you're digging the vapor side of things too!Ed's TnT said:
Rick
Zapman
First, thank you for doing the lead test that you reported on the "is brass safe thread" obelisk. Just saw it.
now my answer to the folks over there.
Next, an apology for the lateness of this reply that I promised yesterday. We had a fun day yesterday with a Chinese dinner included and got home late enough that I did not even want to turn on the computer. This morning was busy til we made the mail as are all Saturday mornings. Then a "relax a bit" in the shop time.
I want to address two issues, both related that have been brought up in a re-opened formerly archived thread. I am addressing it here because it is directed at me, which is AZ/MZ and always has been since the thread started. The posts from the last few days on that thread make that very clear.
The first issue is brass in the AZ/MZ and the safety of using brass in our construction. This has been hammered and hammered into the FC community and the world by my favorite competitor, Tom, the PD guy, since his entry into the market for these type vapes. Ours is unsafe, his is safe therefore better. It is the main component in the concept of "new product, new market" as it relates to the PD. I will start with a quote from lwein. A question he asked that he says no one has answered the last time I checked the thread.
" Ok, let's forget all the riff raff, including mine, for a second here and let me address the elephant in the room by asking this question.
Being that there is such a hoopla regarding the safety or danger of brass being used in a vaporizer, why use it? Is there any advantage of using brass in the construction of the bowls and heat exchanger?"
First, some history which may be repetition. When we started Aromazap in 2001 I was aware there was lead in brass. I knew lead was bad so I asked two people that I had known and trusted for several years the same question. I told them what we were doing in the construction and use of the Zap. I asked if there was any danger of lead exposure. One was a life long Metallurgist and had retired to North Idaho. The other was a Blacksmith. Self taught but VERY thorough in everything he does, like Tom is. They both asked me the same question right away. How hot does it get? I told them the air coming out and into the stem tip contents was under 400F. They both reacted the same. They laughed. They said the heat was so low that the lead, whatever content it is in the alloy, will stay in the brass. It will not be released from the alloy. It would have to get much much hotter to even get close to being a problem of any lead being released from the brass. So on I went. Two people who know agree and in the same way. Whenever I had a rare question on the subject, I always answered the same. Temps too low for any concern.
Fast forward ahead to our entry to FC, many years later. The brass issue comes up right away and is discussed thoroughly with the end conclusion the same as I had understood in the beginning. There may be lead in it, there is lead in it but it stays there, in the alloy. So then it comes back again more than once I believe with the same conclusion and Mods archiving the thread. I felt good because my understanding of the safety issue was validated by facts like melting temperature and vaporizing temperature of lead. BTW, I do not do the super thorough this link that link stuff with so much info like Tom. Never will. He is right when he says I wing it. I do and I fly like a bird right below the radar. There are many ways to get through life. I am very different than Tom in that respect.
Now we come to the re-opening the thread this last week by VTAC which of course only a Mod can do. I was surprised a bit that it came up but not really. VTAC is strongly in Toms camp and that is fine with me. People should be able to express their opinion however they want, even if they are Mods. But part of his opening post caught my eye. That was this:
"Concerns have been raised regarding the tight fit between the bowl and heat exchanger; surface abrasion occurs during insertion/removal and thus, any lead on the surface could be scraped free and end up in the air stream as particulate."
Aha! That was something new that I had never heard before. I wondered where those concerns originated because it was sure a new twist on the FACT that my stems fit our heatport tube just right while the PD stems fit loosely. Must not be a good thing, as the stainless screen we put in the heatport to keep crap out of the heater area. I have read Toms explanation about how cool it is that he does not have the screen in the PD. I digress.
So a new line on brass being unsafe. My stem fits so tight that people will get fragments of lead in the airstream. That is a real stretch to say the least. Anyway, no mention of the heat equation by the repeat no AZ/MZ folks. That topic got ignored, coincidently. And also VTACs take on 'our' side
"On the 'Not a problem' side, the opinion is that no lead should be released". I would say "no lead WILL be released", not "should". So VTAC asks me for info and I try to oblige. I contact the people I buy my tubing from and get back "it is lead free" and I about shit my pants. What, this is lead free? I have quite a party day and then get on to answer lwein late in the day which I should not have done. I apologize for that post but I will not edit it. I said it. I described the airflow incompletely and I repeated "no lead" several times. Devo was the first to catch my incomplete description of the airflow and I appreciate that from him. That is when I first realized I blew it. The infamous post #94. A mistake but I do make them plenty.
Devo and airpath. He is right. The air enters though airholes in the brass washer, goes down around what I call the heatsink and then up through the tubing. I would guess(winging it) 80 to 90% of the heat produced happens as the air comes up through the heatport tube and around the heater. It is then in the stem tip contents to make vapor. So air entering the washer at the top is ambient temperature, maybe 60-70F. Then down around the heatsink for some more heat but not much as it moves fast once one draws on the stem. Then into the tubing WITH LEAD(as all the brass), yes Tom. Only thing is I did find out more on the tubing. It has trace amounts but I WAS TOLD "it is below the traceable standard, it is ROHs compliant". So all the tubing I use is ROHs compliant.As far as I know the heatsink material and the washer are not ROHs but they fall even more under the "not hot enough concept" that I have always believed. BTW, I am not making any claims that AZ/MZ is Rohs compliant, just the tubing I use.
I have to cut this down but will say that is my answer to you lwein as to "why use brass?". Because it is safe to use. The "hoopla" you refer to was started and is perpetuated by my competitor. Some want to be so safe they buy the hoopla. That is great. I am glad they have what they think is a "safer" choice. But I will not change my definition of what I think is safe because some folks who look at life differently than me think I should. I think Toms "safer than thou" premise is just marketing.
So I am a risk taker. My bad. Actually I appreciate Toms reminding us all of my words about that subject. That is who I am. But I do not do it with the product I make as has been implied time and time again by Tom. I am very conscientious about what I do for a living. I am serious about it as all my customers know.
So to the second subject quickly. Tom and me. OMG!
Yes, we met via the internet a few months before the release of the PD. He called himself Clyde at the time to me anyway. He introduced me to Myrtlewood. I now know why. The big square blocks(which I was doing at the time) of dense Myrtlewood would contribute to the Zap running cooler. Yes, I "offered" AZ/MZ to Tom as I have several people I thought I trusted that I have met over the internet. We are tired. It has been almost ten years. We have another business and are on SS as we are in our mid 60s. I did not refer to it as an empire though. Tom also offered several suggestions like raising my prices, doing a kit and jazzing up my website with some cool stuff. I did not go for much of it because it just was not me. Our website, as you all know is not good at all to say the least. Part of the winging it me. Those suggestions all make sense to me now in that I understand what he was doing. The relationship ended rather abruptly at his desire. He of course never let me know that he was about ready to roll out the PD. Pat also communicated often with Pam. I discovered PD over a year later when I discovered FC. I began turning Zaps about a month before I discovered FC. I say that because some have said I copied Tom with the turning. Not true. Never even knew the PD existed.
Tom has opened this door BTW. I would love to go through my life and never hear his name or mention his name or his product but it keeps on getting reborn again. Kind of appropriate for Easter I guess.
Lastly, I have said I have my suspicions about why this subject came up again. I will now present a fact that I do know about. We get orders, make and ship enough Zaps to clear out Toms FC wait list every two weeks. It is none of my business why he does what he does with customers who have paid months ago. It is also none of his business about what I do or don't do or how I get through life.
If my brass/safe/AZ/MZ explanation is not good enough for some of you, ask away. I have probably missed a thing or two. I do ask Tom to not post here as I have (not) done on his thread.
now my answer to the folks over there.
Next, an apology for the lateness of this reply that I promised yesterday. We had a fun day yesterday with a Chinese dinner included and got home late enough that I did not even want to turn on the computer. This morning was busy til we made the mail as are all Saturday mornings. Then a "relax a bit" in the shop time.
I want to address two issues, both related that have been brought up in a re-opened formerly archived thread. I am addressing it here because it is directed at me, which is AZ/MZ and always has been since the thread started. The posts from the last few days on that thread make that very clear.
The first issue is brass in the AZ/MZ and the safety of using brass in our construction. This has been hammered and hammered into the FC community and the world by my favorite competitor, Tom, the PD guy, since his entry into the market for these type vapes. Ours is unsafe, his is safe therefore better. It is the main component in the concept of "new product, new market" as it relates to the PD. I will start with a quote from lwein. A question he asked that he says no one has answered the last time I checked the thread.
" Ok, let's forget all the riff raff, including mine, for a second here and let me address the elephant in the room by asking this question.
Being that there is such a hoopla regarding the safety or danger of brass being used in a vaporizer, why use it? Is there any advantage of using brass in the construction of the bowls and heat exchanger?"
First, some history which may be repetition. When we started Aromazap in 2001 I was aware there was lead in brass. I knew lead was bad so I asked two people that I had known and trusted for several years the same question. I told them what we were doing in the construction and use of the Zap. I asked if there was any danger of lead exposure. One was a life long Metallurgist and had retired to North Idaho. The other was a Blacksmith. Self taught but VERY thorough in everything he does, like Tom is. They both asked me the same question right away. How hot does it get? I told them the air coming out and into the stem tip contents was under 400F. They both reacted the same. They laughed. They said the heat was so low that the lead, whatever content it is in the alloy, will stay in the brass. It will not be released from the alloy. It would have to get much much hotter to even get close to being a problem of any lead being released from the brass. So on I went. Two people who know agree and in the same way. Whenever I had a rare question on the subject, I always answered the same. Temps too low for any concern.
Fast forward ahead to our entry to FC, many years later. The brass issue comes up right away and is discussed thoroughly with the end conclusion the same as I had understood in the beginning. There may be lead in it, there is lead in it but it stays there, in the alloy. So then it comes back again more than once I believe with the same conclusion and Mods archiving the thread. I felt good because my understanding of the safety issue was validated by facts like melting temperature and vaporizing temperature of lead. BTW, I do not do the super thorough this link that link stuff with so much info like Tom. Never will. He is right when he says I wing it. I do and I fly like a bird right below the radar. There are many ways to get through life. I am very different than Tom in that respect.
Now we come to the re-opening the thread this last week by VTAC which of course only a Mod can do. I was surprised a bit that it came up but not really. VTAC is strongly in Toms camp and that is fine with me. People should be able to express their opinion however they want, even if they are Mods. But part of his opening post caught my eye. That was this:
"Concerns have been raised regarding the tight fit between the bowl and heat exchanger; surface abrasion occurs during insertion/removal and thus, any lead on the surface could be scraped free and end up in the air stream as particulate."
Aha! That was something new that I had never heard before. I wondered where those concerns originated because it was sure a new twist on the FACT that my stems fit our heatport tube just right while the PD stems fit loosely. Must not be a good thing, as the stainless screen we put in the heatport to keep crap out of the heater area. I have read Toms explanation about how cool it is that he does not have the screen in the PD. I digress.
So a new line on brass being unsafe. My stem fits so tight that people will get fragments of lead in the airstream. That is a real stretch to say the least. Anyway, no mention of the heat equation by the repeat no AZ/MZ folks. That topic got ignored, coincidently. And also VTACs take on 'our' side
"On the 'Not a problem' side, the opinion is that no lead should be released". I would say "no lead WILL be released", not "should". So VTAC asks me for info and I try to oblige. I contact the people I buy my tubing from and get back "it is lead free" and I about shit my pants. What, this is lead free? I have quite a party day and then get on to answer lwein late in the day which I should not have done. I apologize for that post but I will not edit it. I said it. I described the airflow incompletely and I repeated "no lead" several times. Devo was the first to catch my incomplete description of the airflow and I appreciate that from him. That is when I first realized I blew it. The infamous post #94. A mistake but I do make them plenty.
Devo and airpath. He is right. The air enters though airholes in the brass washer, goes down around what I call the heatsink and then up through the tubing. I would guess(winging it) 80 to 90% of the heat produced happens as the air comes up through the heatport tube and around the heater. It is then in the stem tip contents to make vapor. So air entering the washer at the top is ambient temperature, maybe 60-70F. Then down around the heatsink for some more heat but not much as it moves fast once one draws on the stem. Then into the tubing WITH LEAD(as all the brass), yes Tom. Only thing is I did find out more on the tubing. It has trace amounts but I WAS TOLD "it is below the traceable standard, it is ROHs compliant". So all the tubing I use is ROHs compliant.As far as I know the heatsink material and the washer are not ROHs but they fall even more under the "not hot enough concept" that I have always believed. BTW, I am not making any claims that AZ/MZ is Rohs compliant, just the tubing I use.
I have to cut this down but will say that is my answer to you lwein as to "why use brass?". Because it is safe to use. The "hoopla" you refer to was started and is perpetuated by my competitor. Some want to be so safe they buy the hoopla. That is great. I am glad they have what they think is a "safer" choice. But I will not change my definition of what I think is safe because some folks who look at life differently than me think I should. I think Toms "safer than thou" premise is just marketing.
So I am a risk taker. My bad. Actually I appreciate Toms reminding us all of my words about that subject. That is who I am. But I do not do it with the product I make as has been implied time and time again by Tom. I am very conscientious about what I do for a living. I am serious about it as all my customers know.
So to the second subject quickly. Tom and me. OMG!
Yes, we met via the internet a few months before the release of the PD. He called himself Clyde at the time to me anyway. He introduced me to Myrtlewood. I now know why. The big square blocks(which I was doing at the time) of dense Myrtlewood would contribute to the Zap running cooler. Yes, I "offered" AZ/MZ to Tom as I have several people I thought I trusted that I have met over the internet. We are tired. It has been almost ten years. We have another business and are on SS as we are in our mid 60s. I did not refer to it as an empire though. Tom also offered several suggestions like raising my prices, doing a kit and jazzing up my website with some cool stuff. I did not go for much of it because it just was not me. Our website, as you all know is not good at all to say the least. Part of the winging it me. Those suggestions all make sense to me now in that I understand what he was doing. The relationship ended rather abruptly at his desire. He of course never let me know that he was about ready to roll out the PD. Pat also communicated often with Pam. I discovered PD over a year later when I discovered FC. I began turning Zaps about a month before I discovered FC. I say that because some have said I copied Tom with the turning. Not true. Never even knew the PD existed.
Tom has opened this door BTW. I would love to go through my life and never hear his name or mention his name or his product but it keeps on getting reborn again. Kind of appropriate for Easter I guess.
Lastly, I have said I have my suspicions about why this subject came up again. I will now present a fact that I do know about. We get orders, make and ship enough Zaps to clear out Toms FC wait list every two weeks. It is none of my business why he does what he does with customers who have paid months ago. It is also none of his business about what I do or don't do or how I get through life.
If my brass/safe/AZ/MZ explanation is not good enough for some of you, ask away. I have probably missed a thing or two. I do ask Tom to not post here as I have (not) done on his thread.
momofthegoons
vapor accessory addict
Thanks for sharing all of that Rick. It's quite a lot to digest. When I came on to do my post, I wasn't expecting it and it caught me by surprise. My first impulse is not to respond to it further and get to my original intent here, and I think I'll stick to that.
My beautiful new "little gal" arrived Friday afternoon. Rick picked a beautiful piece of Myrtle for her. We decided on no LED and I'm glad that I went that route. The front wraps around, and with the grain patterns, almost has two "fronts." One side has waves of grain with small areas of burl. The other has three whorls of grain going from the bottom almost to the top. This particular area is pretty cool. Now, the news this morning was full of people who were seeing Jesus in their bathroom tile, etc. and sure it was an Easter sign. Now, I'm not one to see Jesus in things I look at, certainly not in the bathroom tile or a grilled cheese. But I'm telling you, I took one look at this and I swear I see a mother and child. What do you think?
Now, it's entirely possible that my husband is right that I've been practicing too much with my beautiful new vape, but.....
In any case, thank you Rick for the extra attention. I love my new Myrtlezap.
My beautiful new "little gal" arrived Friday afternoon. Rick picked a beautiful piece of Myrtle for her. We decided on no LED and I'm glad that I went that route. The front wraps around, and with the grain patterns, almost has two "fronts." One side has waves of grain with small areas of burl. The other has three whorls of grain going from the bottom almost to the top. This particular area is pretty cool. Now, the news this morning was full of people who were seeing Jesus in their bathroom tile, etc. and sure it was an Easter sign. Now, I'm not one to see Jesus in things I look at, certainly not in the bathroom tile or a grilled cheese. But I'm telling you, I took one look at this and I swear I see a mother and child. What do you think?
Now, it's entirely possible that my husband is right that I've been practicing too much with my beautiful new vape, but.....
In any case, thank you Rick for the extra attention. I love my new Myrtlezap.