Cheap High Quality Bubbler

hoptimum

hoptimum

Well-Known Member
cybrguy said:
There is something that has been bothering me ever since I began reading the cheap glass thread that I have avoided bringing up because I really don't want to create a stir about it. I used to be in the clothing industry at the retail level and there was the tendency for one manufacturer to knockoff or copy another as an accepted way of doing business. An expensive dress with the designer name would be given to a local or, usually, a Chinese manufacturer to duplicate. That dress might be sold for 10% to 30% of the retail price of the designer dress. It might be as well made but would usually be at least a little less well-made, but would be within the reach of regular middle-class people rather than just the very rich. It was an accepted way of doing business and the only people that were truly annoyed by it where the designers themselves.

This was duplicating or copying, but not counterfeiting. Counterfeiting is when you duplicate a product and try and sell it as if it were actually the original product and not a copy. That is what these vendors are doing when they put a company's logo on their glass copies rather than leaving them unmarked. As someone said before, duplicating may be considered "the sincerest form of flattery", but when duplicating the label, it is just plain counterfeiting. The idea is for vendors down the retail path to sell the items as if they were created by their designers.

Personally I will not buy a piece that has a designer name on it that I know is not made by the designer. Nor will I order a piece that might come with a designer label on it. That of course is the only way to prevent manufacturers from counterfeiting when their only concern is how best to sell the product they have made and they have no laws or standards that prevent it.
Far be it from me to tell other people how to wear their morality hat, but I thought it important enough to at least mention it in this thread for people to consider. Many countries in the world do not care about original art, patents, and the laws that protect artists and designers. I personally don't think that is a better way, and if you ask one of those content creators you will likely find how discouraging and demoralizing it may be for them, especially if they are not a large company that can more easily absorb the competition, legitimate or not.

So to be clear, I am not in any way discouraging the copying of product whether it be glass pieces or designer dresses. I do think it is important, however, that during the course of our purchasing decisions that we keep things like this in mind. And I think it may also be useful to remind our (in this case) Chinese manufacturers that part of the reason we don't want them putting original designer labels on their product is not just how it looks.
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Can you be a little more specific about what youre talking about? The 2 bubblers I got didnt have a brand logo on them

Mister G said:
For example, many of the pieces on Yingmin5's store have a fake RooR logo branded onto them (e.g. GB186 through GB189 all say "RooR", (except that some customers were able to receive non-branded pieces on request to the vendor). Most of the pieces on Sunshine Store do not (e.g. none of the D020 series, they are all blank)
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My GB187 came without the RooR logo, without me asking.
 
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hoptimum,
Mister G

Mister G

Deceptively Old Fart
hoptimum said:
My GB187 came without the RooR logo, without me asking.
Click to expand...

Then you got lucky (assuming you prefer that). They were possibly filling orders for others that requested no logo and yours happened to be in the middle of that batch? Just a guess. I'm sure you missed the part of this thread where Yingmin5 was instructing people who don't want a logo to express that in their order form comment box. It is near impossible to only "casually" follow this thread and know what's going on, a few of us Loonies live here and it's even hard for us! :mental:
 
Lezi

Lezi

Well-Known Member
Hello....today the team of Sunshinestore sent me more info about the tornado bubbler...thank you guys and welcome :tup:

http://es.tinypic.com/player.php?v=jghz43&s=8#.U44z7HJ_uSo

avfosy.jpg

14d21iu.jpg

2mn2hk5.jpg

2eouts1.jpg
 
hoptimum

hoptimum

Well-Known Member
Mister G said:
Then you got lucky (assuming you prefer that). They were possibly filling orders for others that requested no logo and yours happened to be in the middle of that batch? Just a guess. I'm sure you missed the part of this thread where Yingmin5 was instructing people who don't want a logo to express that in their order form comment box. It is near impossible to only "casually" follow this thread and know what's going on, a few of us Loonies live here and it's even hard for us! :mental:
Click to expand...

Yes, I followed that discussion, but I have a question, not being an avid collector of glass. Does RooR even make a bubbler that looks like the gb187. It looks more like a Mobius.
 
Mister G

Mister G

Deceptively Old Fart
hoptimum said:
Yes, I followed that discussion, but I have a question, not being an avid collector of glass. Does RooR even make a bubbler that looks like the gb187. It looks more like a Mobius.
Click to expand...

I've never seen any Roor's like these other than the straight tubes, but who knows? Plus, you can't really apply logic to Chinese manufacturing and knockoffs, standard thinking does not apply, they'll put an Android logo on a knockoff iPhone.
 
hoptimum

hoptimum

Well-Known Member
Mister G said:
I've never seen any Roor's like these other than the straight tubes, but who knows? Plus, you can't really apply logic to Chinese manufacturing and knockoffs, standard thinking does not apply, they'll put an Android logo on a knockoff iPhone.
Click to expand...


I agree, which seems to me to undercut the counterfeit argument, since I don't think theyre trying to put anything over on anyone. For instance, if someone in China made a kate spade bag lookalike and branded it as coach, is that really counterfeit?
 
Lezi

Lezi

Well-Known Member
Mister G said:
Nice, is this listed on DHgate? I like the bent neck version better, but this one looks 3mm thick glass (I could be wrong though)?
Click to expand...

At the moment is only available trough Aliexpress

I don't know understand their move to Alie and why it isn't listed in Dhgate :shrug: ....maybe now they can answer us here :brow:
 
Lezi,
DieHard

DieHard

Accessory supplier
Accessory Maker
cybrguy said:
There is something that has been bothering me ever since I began reading the cheap glass thread that I have avoided bringing up because I really don't want to create a stir about it. I used to be in the clothing industry at the retail level and there was the tendency for one manufacturer to knockoff or copy another as an accepted way of doing business. An expensive dress with the designer name would be given to a local or, usually, a Chinese manufacturer to duplicate. That dress might be sold for 10% to 30% of the retail price of the designer dress. It might be as well made but would usually be at least a little less well-made, but would be within the reach of regular middle-class people rather than just the very rich. It was an accepted way of doing business and the only people that were truly annoyed by it where the designers themselves.

This was duplicating or copying, but not counterfeiting. Counterfeiting is when you duplicate a product and try and sell it as if it were actually the original product and not a copy. That is what these vendors are doing when they put a company's logo on their glass copies rather than leaving them unmarked. As someone said before, duplicating may be considered "the sincerest form of flattery", but when duplicating the label, it is just plain counterfeiting. The idea is for vendors down the retail path to sell the items as if they were created by their designers.

Personally I will not buy a piece that has a designer name on it that I know is not made by the designer. Nor will I order a piece that might come with a designer label on it. That of course is the only way to prevent manufacturers from counterfeiting when their only concern is how best to sell the product they have made and they have no laws or standards that prevent it.
Far be it from me to tell other people how to wear their morality hat, but I thought it important enough to at least mention it in this thread for people to consider. Many countries in the world do not care about original art, patents, and the laws that protect artists and designers. I personally don't think that is a better way, and if you ask one of those content creators you will likely find how discouraging and demoralizing it may be for them, especially if they are not a large company that can more easily absorb the competition, legitimate or not.

So to be clear, I am not in any way discouraging the copying of product whether it be glass pieces or designer dresses. I do think it is important, however, that during the course of our purchasing decisions that we keep things like this in mind. And I think it may also be useful to remind our (in this case) Chinese manufacturers that part of the reason we don't want them putting original designer labels on their product is not just how it looks.
Click to expand...
Counterfeiting is making a copy and branding meant to deceive the consumer into thinking they are purchasing a name brand item. Go to any Thrift Store and you will invariably find a bunch of fake Rolex watches and Coach purses of all types and styles. Now given that, if some of those ROOR Branded pieces were in a LHS or Flea Market Type Store the deception is definitely there. I'm sure there are plenty of less than scrupulous LHS proprietors making a nice living selling counterfeits. Have you noticed that many of the sellers on Dhgate and Alliex carry ROOR branded pieces. Why is this the only brand we see knocked off. Strange coincidence? I think most who are ordering from these places, FC members or otherwise know they are not buying a ROOR. I'm not sure that these manufacturers are aware that this branding is not necessary and even an extra expense. I would have preferred to have no logo on my 186. In fact it has 2 ROOR logos! I ordered before that was an option. Going forward, these vendors need to know that it is not good to be using some other company name. Put your own name on them, make one up. Or put a lotus flower on there. Whatever, make it your own.. Then we will be advertising for you @sunshinestore & @yingmin5 instead of giving the credit of your work (even if it is a copy of another design) to ROOR.
 
pigfoot

pigfoot

Dabs are vapor too!
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Mr. Gweilo 420

Mr. Gweilo 420

Dude
Thanks Dangus. This is not Sunshine Store though. It is listed Longyou Shanjin craft and gift factory. Am I missing something?
 
Mr. Gweilo 420,
Dangus

Dangus

Yeah, well, that's just, like, your opinion, man.
Mr. Gweilo 420 said:
Thanks Dangus. This is not Sunshine Store though. It is listed Longyou Shanjin craft and gift factory. Am I missing something?
Click to expand...

We both must be...I was under the impression that it was the ali sunshine store, but admittedly I didn't follow the conversion too closely, just remembered seeing the link...

Maybe @Lezi or others could fill us in?
 
Dangus,
cybrguy

cybrguy

Putin is a War Criminal
Lezi said:
Hello....today the team of Sunshinestore sent me more info about the tornado bubbler...thank you guys and welcome :tup:

http://es.tinypic.com/player.php?v=jghz43&s=8#.U44z7HJ_uSo

avfosy.jpg

14d21iu.jpg

2mn2hk5.jpg

2eouts1.jpg
Click to expand...
Oh Lezi don't hurt me like that... ;) Did they give you any clue how thick it was? If it is 5mm I may have to own that.

hoptimum said:
I agree, which seems to me to undercut the counterfeit argument, since I don't think theyre trying to put anything over on anyone. For instance, if someone in China made a kate spade bag lookalike and branded it as coach, is that really counterfeit?
Click to expand...

If you use a designers logo and you are not that designer or his/her manufacturer, you are trying to deceive someone. Is it somehow better if you are only trying to deceive inexperienced or ignorant customers?
 
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cybrguy,
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budha707

budha707

Well-Known Member
i actually already got this one and i love it. it had a tiny hole in the downstem where it and the hammerhead perc meet. but it just makes more bubbles for the top barrel. other than that it works amazing!!!!

tennstrong said:
Just got my Double Barrel knockoff in the mail today- wrapped up VERY well. First piece of china glass I've ordered online, and my second china piece ever (first was the dab cup). The mouthpiece might not look cool from the photos but fits so nice. My piece has a very slight lean on the base, but this doesn't affect function and is maybe off by 2-3mm (IDK extremely little). Both sides fire equally, and I have pulled hitmans in store and the full size ones have pretty well the same pull. The 10mms are obviously different however, but I prefer the pull on the 14mm anyway. Piece is 7 3/4" tall, which surprised me as it seems very close to the original and I had feared it would be much taller. Overall: right now its getting a hesistant 7.5, maybe higher with more usage, but between this and the dab cup I couldn't really think of any better china rigs I've seen. (OKOK D020 IS SAVIOR)
EDIT: also just realized as hard as I can pull with the water level in the vid I can't get any water in my mouth. Even doing the lawnmower pull start chug.
Click to expand...
bro u need more water. i have it and trust me , u need more
 
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hoptimum

hoptimum

Well-Known Member
cybrguy said:
Oh Lezi don't hurt me like that... ;) Did they give you any clue how thick it was? If it is 5mm I may have to own that.



If you use a designers logo and you are not that designer or his/her manufacturer, you are trying to deceive someone. Is it somehow better if you are only trying to deceive inexperienced or ignorant customers?
Click to expand...

If the "deception" is so blatantly obvious that it stretches credibility, who is really being deceived? When does "counterfeit" become spoof? Was Andy Warhol counterfeiting Campbell's with his soup can paintings?
 
budha707

budha707

Well-Known Member
hoptimum said:
Yes, I followed that discussion, but I have a question, not being an avid collector of glass. Does RooR even make a bubbler that looks like the gb187. It looks more like a Mobius.
Click to expand...
yea its the mobius 60b.

BoogerMan said:
Welcome Sunshinestore! Glad you made it to FC!

@oli I agree! If sunshinestore sold some of the btoc_jewelry items I would be very happy!

If @sunshinestore could make the JH017 and Jh018 that btoc_jewelry sales I think you would have many buyers :) I would definitely order multiple if you had these product!

http://www.dhgate.com/product/1pcs-...glass-glass/193212453.html#s1-13-1|4108674309

http://www.dhgate.com/product/1lots...glass-glass/193213096.html#s1-12-1|3899985871
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@sunshinestore yes this man makes one of the best points of all!! i would buy so much more if you started offering recyclers at decent prices!
 
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Delta3DStudios

Delta3DStudios

Well-Known Member
Accessory Maker
I'm sure that's the first and last time we hear from the @sunshinestore on this site. Oh well - thanks for saying hi! Keep up the good work and affordable prices, and I will send more customers (friends) to your store

Drs1685 said:
Does anyone know if the d020 is a knockoff of anything?
Click to expand...

Yes, The Mobius Ion bubbler with a "Reti" perc. The difference is the number of slits (the Mobius has twice as many), and they are flame polished, the D020 is not flame polished (one side of my D020 perc fires 3x more often - but for this price, I like the piece) - that bubbler is $295 over on Aqua Lab
 
cybrguy

cybrguy

Putin is a War Criminal
hoptimum said:
If the "deception" is so blatantly obvious that it stretches credibility, who is really being deceived? When does "counterfeit" become spoof? Was Andy Warhol counterfeiting Campbell's with his soup can paintings?
Click to expand...

The vast majority of people who buy or wish to buy a product with a designer name have no idea what is in their current catalog. If I wanted to buy my Lady a pair of Prada shoes or a Coach purse, do you really think I would have any idea looking at the product whether it was authentic and from their current line? If you do then I think you don't know much about peoples buying behaviors. If you don't...

The basis of trademark law is centered around the possibility that a consumer may confuse a copy with an original. Do you really think that someone might be confused enough by an Andy Warhol painting to think it is actually a can of soup?

On the other hand, I think it is easy to imagine that a teenager with his birthday money burning a hole in his pocket could be "sold" a chinese dupe of a Mobius as an original and pay too much. If I were to go to my LHS looking for a Roor or a Mobius (or Cory, or Grav Labs, or Toro, it matters not) I might be able to tell if it is well made, if the welds are solid, if the colors are nice, if the lines are straight, but I certainly couldn't tell you who made it. Should I be ripped off by an unscrupulous retailer for my lack of expertise?

I think not. YMMV
 
Mr. Gweilo 420

Mr. Gweilo 420

Dude
Well fuck me. Where does this GAS end?! I thought I was done. I thought I was out. But no I have been dragged back in :shrug::evil::evil::evil: I wanted to clear up exactly what the story was with the D20-Q (The mysterious tornado bubbler!). I have been after a tornado bubbler for a little while. I have the GB-189 from Yingmin but I don't think there is any tornado action unless clearing the can. So I contacted Sunshine Store and it is in fact their shop on Aliexpress. There they are called Longyou Shanjin Craft & Gift Factory. It is Mike Lee the owner of Sunshine Store. So anyway, I could not help myself and I placed an order. With luck I will have it tomorrow :) I will provide a brief report after trying it.
 
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