Discontinued Thermovape Cera

PhotoRider said:

OF, I am continually impressed with your offers to help the membership and your ability to find cost effective material - wow a $17 supply...

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Yeah, but you never hear about he liens I put on their vapes afterwards......

Also guilty of being cheap. I like to think as frugal with the other guys bucks as my own....it doesn't come easy. Besides, everything we don't spend on hardware we can waste on false drugs, right?

Thanks for the kind words.

OF

nopartofme said:

Am I correct in my understanding that the LL carts come with a top cap and mouthpiece? Or is this only when buying a whole Cera kit?

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Was this ever discussed? If so, what's the verdict?

VapoRoor said:

Was this ever discussed? If so, what's the verdict?

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I looked on the thermovape website, and it appears from the text that they have gone back to selling the EO and EL with the ceramic mouthpiece and are no longer including it with the LL cart for $100. Some of the photos haven't been changed though, so it still appears a little ambiguous. I would certainly check with them before ordering the cart with the expectation that you would be recieving a top cap and mouthpiece with it. If I was one of those who got a Cera EO vape during the time they were not including the ceramic top, I would hit them up to include it with the LL core for $100. TET is pretty good with this sort of thing, and the worst that could happen is they say no.

TF

Tom Funk said:

I looked on the thermovape website, and it appears from the text that they have gone back to selling the EO and EL with the ceramic mouthpiece and are no longer including it with the LL cart for $100. Some of the photos haven't been changed though, so it still appears a little ambiguous. I would certainly check with them before ordering the cart with the expectation that you would be recieving a top cap and mouthpiece with it. If I was one of those who got a Cera EO vape during the time they were not including the ceramic top, I would hit them up to include it with the LL core for $100. TET is pretty good with this sort of thing, and the worst that could happen is they say no.

TF

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The wording is a little goofy. The EO cart says it comes with "1 standard mouthpiece", which could mean anything. The LL cart on the other hand doesn't list a mouthpiece in the contents but does mention it in the Tech Specs ("Srcreen free, clog free, high flow, stir free deflective air pathway mouthpiece").

I'd contact TET to get clarification but either way I'll need to pay $90/$100 and I'm not ready to put down the money yet, so I didn't want to bother them.

nopartofme said:

The wording is a little goofy. The EO cart says it comes with "1 standard mouthpiece", which could mean anything. The LL cart on the other hand doesn't list a mouthpiece in the contents but does mention it in the Tech Specs ("Srcreen free, clog free, high flow, stir free deflective air pathway mouthpiece").

I'd contact TET to get clarification but either way I'll need to pay $90/$100 and I'm not ready to put down the money yet, so I didn't want to bother them.

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Hey Nopart,

I tried to view your Cera video but YouTube is saying that it is not available on this platform (my iPhone). Any idea what's going on?

Also, I saw much earlier in this thread that you were using a plastic lid from the containers that TET send batteries and carts in as a make shift latching switch (jdee was using it this way too). Do you still use this? Does the lid screw on, or do you have to press it on? Can you back it off to break contact while still staying secure and keeping the battery inside? I assume you just have a bit of foil inside it. Is this correct?

Cheers
TF

Tom Funk said:

Hey Nopart,

I tried to view your Cera video but YouTube is saying that it is not available on this platform (my iPhone). Any idea what's going on?

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Augh. Because the music I used in the video was recognized by YouTube as being copyrighted, they automatically placed limitations on it. This stops people outside the US from watching it and maybe people on iPhones too. I'd upload a version without music, but it was filmed and edited with music in mind so it would look pretty bare.

Anyways, I'm flattered that you not only wanted to watch but took the time to ask about it! Thanks very much for the interest, it warms the ceramic core of my heart. The video's performance on YouTube has far exceeded my expectations with almost 700 views now, and my video is the top hit for "Thermovape Cera" on YouTube! Because of that, I think I'm going to film a new one at some point for people outside the US.

Tom Funk said:

Also, I saw much earlier in this thread that you were using a plastic lid from the containers that TET send batteries and carts in as a make shift latching switch (jdee was using it this way too). Do you still use this? Does the lid screw on, or do you have to press it on? Can you back it off to break contact while still staying secure and keeping the battery inside? I assume you just have a bit of foil inside it. Is this correct?

Cheers
TF

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I actually haven't modded or replaced my switch, but I have used that cap as an aid to stand the Cera on its end. I have a card table that has a soft leather top which the Cera doesn't like to stand up on. That black cap fits just enough around the switch itself that I can stand it up real quick for loading purposes or a picture or whatever, without taking the switch off.

I think it should work to hold a ball of foil in the tube though, which is what I think @jdee was doing here. The cap won't screw on, but it snaps on and off thanks to the flexibility of the plastic.

nopartofme said:

The wording is a little goofy. The EO cart says it comes with "1 standard mouthpiece", which could mean anything. The LL cart on the other hand doesn't list a mouthpiece in the contents but does mention it in the Tech Specs ("Srcreen free, clog free, high flow, stir free deflective air pathway mouthpiece").

I'd contact TET to get clarification but either way I'll need to pay $90/$100 and I'm not ready to put down the money yet, so I didn't want to bother them.

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I think they fixed it or you read it wrong? Either way i think tom funk is right.

The cera EO now comes with a cera topcap+tip and 1 complimentary 510 mouthpiece while the Cera LL.

Also when you go to cartridges the LL still has a picture with the ceramic mouthpiece. But when u click to buy it the pictures are just of the cartridge

Mynameismud said:

I think they fixed it or you read it wrong? Either way i think tom funk is right.

The cera EO now comes with a cera topcap+tip and 1 complimentary 510 mouthpiece while the Cera LL.

Also when you go to cartridges the LL still has a picture with the ceramic mouthpiece. But when u click to buy it the pictures are just of the cartridge

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It still looks the same as I found it before…

EO core, "Standard Mouthpiece" included:


LL core, nothing "included" but look at the fourth Tech Spec:


In any case, I'm having a hard time wrapping my head around the concept of bundling the top cap and mouthpiece with the EO core but not the LL? I'd think that bundling with the Cera body, if not bundling with both carts, would make the most sense!

nopartofme said:

In any case, I'm having a hard time wrapping my head around the concept of bundling the top cap and mouthpiece with the EO core but not the LL? I'd think that bundling with the Cera body, if not bundling with both carts, would make the most sense!

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I agree as well. You replace the core, not the cap. Why not include a free endcap and switch too? Did anyone ever buy a Cera body and core and not a cap and MP at the same time? It's nice to leave the cap with the cart when you switch, but that's a convenience issue IMO.

That, however, doesn't change the view of the guys who want a (free) cap I guess. I'm still stuck on the idea that it's not really a free cap, someone has to pay for it (that means you and me eventually as 'the savings are passed on to the customers at the pumps'). Personally I favor lower prices for all.

OF

OF said:

I agree at well. You replace the core, not the cap.

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Although, in this case I am in fact replacing the cap and not the core!

I'll repeat my PSA in case it was lost behind the giant spider: flailing an arm that is tightly holding a hot Cera may result in the top cap and mouthpiece flying off. In my case I was alone and outdoors, so no people or breakables (besides the Cera) were put at risk, but I was in a densely vegetated area and lost the top cap and mouthpiece. Expensive bits!

OF said:

That, however, doesn't change the view of the guys who want a (free) cap I guess. I'm still stuck on the idea that it's not really a free cap, someone has to pay for it (that means you and me eventually as 'the savings are passed on to the customers at the pumps'). Personally I favor lower prices for all.

OF

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Thanks for once again bringing clarity to the situation here. I'll be putting in my order soon for my replacement parts (and no core).

OF said:

Think what you want, that looks like a spot weld to me. Actually a series of pairs of them IIRC. What do you suppose is keeping the broken part attached to the ring?

Simply touching will not pass the current we need without overheating locally. Them's the rules.

If you look back there's a pile of discussion on those welds. They're done 'out of house' by laser (necessary for the Ti version as I understand).

I also have an unfair advantage here, I've seen the rings with the strips welded on and the screw plate welded to the other end before assembly. I also watched as the preweld versions were soldered in place after assembly.

That ring (which is what I think you mean by "press in cap") is not a press fit. The ceramic would shatter when the SS expanded under heat if it was. It counts on the glue to retain it. I've watched that part happen too. How do you think the glue got there? And why?

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actually since I pushed the cap back in it is working better than it ever has. there is NO local overheating either.
im of the opinion that when the cap was glued in, the strip became pinched/kinked between the titanium cap and the cera body, shearing the connection.
but since both sides of the connections were still touching there was still continuity.
this could easily happen reguardless if it is welded "before assembly".
I will take an ohm reading from the bottom cap to the top threaded assembly in the body to determine resistance and compare to a buddies ti cera that is still factory configured.
my cera is working a lot better now, it use to take 15-20 sec of warm up to get good vapor, now it happens in 5.
also this is a Ti cera not SS, so I'm not following the heat expansion logic as far as causing the body to crack.
why not just use set screws like the top threaded piece?
I'm not trying to start an argument, just looking at how it came apart gave me insight into how it was assembled.

Soflo said:

also this is a Ti cera not SS, so I'm not following the heat expansion logic as far as causing the body to crack.
why not just use set screws like the top threaded piece?
I'm not trying to start an argument, just looking at how it came apart gave me insight into how it was assembled.

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it makes no difference if it's Ti or SS, metals expand faster than the ceramic by a fair bit. That's the whole reason the screw plate has the screws in the first place, the plate is undersize and far from 'a press fit'. Such screws could have been used below I'd think but they're not necessary since the glue does the same/better job without the extra parts and holes (which for several reasons are not desirable as I understand it from both a cost and cosmetic POV). They would also leave the ring 'loose' and I bet get sheared off quickly from the removal and refitting of the end cap.

You still haven't answered why yours failed when the only other such failure is knonwn to be a result of accident. I've asked if you may have dropped it causing this 3 or 4 times, I won't bother again. I think I can guess.

No argument intended. Just saying again what I know. I know how it's made, you won't change my mind unless you too have seen it happen, say how it's different and name the guy there I can confirm it with. Like I said, I was there for the investigations, decision to try soldering, evaluation of the laser welded test parts, delay of Ti bodies (soldering won't work there.....maybe you recall that wait?) and have seen boxes of them welded up and have watched them installed (including in my Beta unit). I know they're welded, not pressed in.

Again, there's been lots of posting and discussions on the welding issues and progress.

And you can't even accept the spot welds shown in your own photograph? Not really compelling IMO. What else do you think is holding on the broken tab on the ring.....I asked that too a time or two as well didn't I? It's welded, not captured in some press fitting. You can see the welds in your photo.

Think whatever you wish. If you're happy with your understanding and repair, fine by me as well. But don't expect that to change my mind about what I've seen with my own lying eyes.

OF

Any updates on the mini Cera?

Forgive me If i skimmed over any posts about it, my eyes are heavy from a long weekend of working.

Soflo said:

actually since I pushed the cap back in it is working better than it ever has. there is NO local overheating either.
im of the opinion that when the cap was glued in, the strip became pinched/kinked between the titanium cap and the cera body, shearing the connection.
but since both sides of the connections were still touching there was still continuity.
this could easily happen reguardless if it is welded "before assembly".
I will take an ohm reading from the bottom cap to the top threaded assembly in the body to determine resistance and compare to a buddies ti cera that is still factory configured.
my cera is working a lot better now, it use to take 15-20 sec of warm up to get good vapor, now it happens in 5.
also this is a Ti cera not SS, so I'm not following the heat expansion logic as far as causing the body to crack.
why not just use set screws like the top threaded piece?
I'm not trying to start an argument, just looking at how it came apart gave me insight into how it was assembled.

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Hey Soflo, I have had many issues with the cera. My opinion is we are beta testers that are paying for the product. With so many changes while the Cera is in circulation it is pretty clear. I have taken apart my eo core because of flow issues after repair(3 times!) and after taking apart the core and gently putting it back together the flow worked perfect and still does(2 weeks or so). After posting this to OF he was of the opinion that my fix didn't do anything, just like your strap issue. It is kinda weird having someone so close to TET swaying opinions and dismissing anything people say in regards to quality of the product. Hold strong the Cera is great but it sucks the quality control is so so. Peace be the journey

nopartofme said:

It still looks the same as I found it before…

EO core, "Standard Mouthpiece" included:

LL core, nothing "included" but look at the fourth Tech Spec:

In any case, I'm having a hard time wrapping my head around the concept of bundling the top cap and mouthpiece with the EO core but not the LL? I'd think that bundling with the Cera body, if not bundling with both carts, would make the most sense!

Click to expand...

Oh I was talking about when you click on the cera bodies all of them come with the ceramic mouthpiece ...im thinking the EO cartride still comes with the "standard" 510 mouthpiece and the LL comes with nothing.

On a side note, ive switched sides since getting the glass adapter. While i still think the ceramic mouthpiece is great for Both cartridges, i dont really use it that more with the EO. I put the thicker o rings on the eo core for the glass adapter and its so much easier to take the smooth flow mouthpiece off and out the glass adapter on as opposed to trying to get the orings on and off each time

OF said:

it makes no difference if it's Ti or SS, metals expand faster than the ceramic by a fair bit. That's the whole reason the screw plate has the screws in the first place, the plate is undersize and far from 'a press fit'. Such screws could have been used below I'd think but they're not necessary since the glue does the same/better job without the extra parts and holes (which for several reasons are not desirable as I understand it from both a cost and cosmetic POV). They would also leave the ring 'loose' and I bet get sheared off quickly from the removal and refitting of the end cap.

You still haven't answered why yours failed when the only other such failure is knonwn to be a result of accident. I've asked if you may have dropped it causing this 3 or 4 times, I won't bother again. I think I can guess.

No argument intended. Just saying again what I know. I know how it's made, you won't change my mind unless you too have seen it happen, say how it's different and name the guy there I can confirm it with. Like I said, I was there for the investigations, decision to try soldering, evaluation of the laser welded test parts, delay of Ti bodies (soldering won't work there.....maybe you recall that wait?) and have seen boxes of them welded up and have watched them installed (including in my Beta unit). I know they're welded, not pressed in.

Again, there's been lots of posting and discussions on the welding issues and progress.

And you can't even accept the spot welds shown in your own photograph? Not really compelling IMO. What else do you think is holding on the broken tab on the ring.....I asked that too a time or two as well didn't I? It's welded, not captured in some press fitting. You can see the welds in your photo.

Think whatever you wish. If you're happy with your understanding and repair, fine by me as well. But don't expect that to change my mind about what I've seen with my own lying eyes.

OF

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im not sure why you think I dont agree there are welds on the cap, thats blatantly obvious there are.
once again I'll say it was damaged when it was assembled. "after the strap was welded onto the cap"
when you said "thems the rules" you are wrong, because the contacts definatly work just being pushed together (in my case better than stock)
and yes the unit had fell over from standing up on the button.
not sure how that could cause this problem as the cart/mouthpiece took the impact, not the switch or end cap. (they were sitting on the table and never left the ground)
the strap is what failed on my unit, not the weld.
imo the reason the strap failed is because it got pinched between the cap and body during asembly.
I'm not sure why you can't comprehend this.

Soflo said:

im not sure why you think I dont agree there are welds on the cap, thats blatantly obvious there are.

and yes the unit had fell over from standing up on the button.

the strap is what failed on my unit, not the weld.
imo the reason the strap failed is because it got pinched between the cap and body during asembly.
I'm not sure why you can't comprehend this.

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OK, thanks for clearing the 'it's welded all right' part up. Up until now you've fooled me by not mentioning that you understand that the design really does use a weld not some sort of "press fit" scheme.

Even though I pointed to it more than once.

I agree such a minor fall probably didn't break the glue bond, but as I said that's the only other time that glue has failed that I'm aware of. Having that ring knocked around by falls is another reasons setscrews aren't used there, the screw holes would take the shock of the battery hammering into the switch in an end drop since the load would be concentrated to a single point.

I get that you think the strap would works better in two pieces (the main part and the welded on end) pressed together rather than one continuous strip, I just don't agree. IMO that's not the way conduction works. My experience with such things is that the oxides and other problems will center on the weakest part, raise the temperature and get worse over time. Welding is intended to stop that kind of action. If you wanted to depend on contact there you'd use the stuff normally used for contacts, not raw copper which is basically never used.

BTW, have any luck reading the strap resistance in any meaningful way? Since you're looking for mili Ohm resolution, common DMMs are basically useless. You need a purpose built low range Ohm meter. One where the current path doesn't include leads, switch contacts and the like. So called "four point" systems, sometimes called 'Kelvin clip' for reasons I don't understand. The best we can do with common gear is to measure the voltage drop up the strap, from ring to screwplate retainer screws, under known currents. Look for something pretty trivial, around .1 Ohms, about what the switch contributes, 1/4 or 1/5 the total?

I think the strap got torn in half when the ring came loose, I've seen them disassembled still intact (remember, there were many strap failures at the top?). Those came out still welded, so it IMO would be a freak at best that the torn ends still made good contact. It did work at first, right? Freaks happen, of course.

I comprehend the idea, I just don't think it holds as much water as you do. Which is fine?

OF

OF said:

... So called "four point" systems, sometimes called 'Kelvin clip' for reasons I don't understand. ...
OF

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The "Kelvin Clips" are used to form a Kelvin bridge - a circuit where a voltage differential exists across a wire which doesn't carry (very much - they can't be perfect) current. Named for Lord Kelvin of absolute zero fame. Should be just a note or not covered at all in most intro electrical or electronic engineering texts - but you'll see it often when looking at "power electrical" texts.

-NDA

OF said:

OK, thanks for clearing the 'it's welded all right' part up. Up until now you've fooled me by not mentioning that you understand that the design really does use a weld not some sort of "press fit" scheme.

Even though I pointed to it more than once.

I agree such a minor fall probably didn't break the glue bond, but as I said that's the only other time that glue has failed that I'm aware of. Having that ring knocked around by falls is another reasons setscrews aren't used there, the screw holes would take the shock of the battery hammering into the switch in an end drop since the load would be concentrated to a single point.

I get that you think the strap would works better in two pieces (the main part and the welded on end) pressed together rather than one continuous strip, I just don't agree. IMO that's not the way conduction works. My experience with such things is that the oxides and other problems will center on the weakest part, raise the temperature and get worse over time. Welding is intended to stop that kind of action. If you wanted to depend on contact there you'd use the stuff normally used for contacts, not raw copper which is basically never used.

BTW, have any luck reading the strap resistance in any meaningful way? Since you're looking for mili Ohm resolution, common DMMs are basically useless. You need a purpose built low range Ohm meter. One where the current path doesn't include leads, switch contacts and the like. So called "four point" systems, sometimes called 'Kelvin clip' for reasons I don't understand. The best we can do with common gear is to measure the voltage drop up the strap, from ring to screwplate retainer screws, under known currents. Look for something pretty trivial, around .1 Ohms, about what the switch contributes, 1/4 or 1/5 the total?

I think the strap got torn in half when the ring came loose, I've seen them disassembled still intact (remember, there were many strap failures at the top?). Those came out still welded, so it IMO would be a freak at best that the torn ends still made good contact. It did work at first, right? Freaks happen, of course.

I comprehend the idea, I just don't think it holds as much water as you do. Which is fine?

OF

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I agree on the set screw part on the bottom cap, didn't consider the drop and crack factor.
also I am very aware that a single conductor will have less resistance than 2. not the point I was making.
I'm saying mine had better conduction now than it did when I got it.
I am implying the original conductor was broken from the factory and never worked properly, once the contacts were re connected, it began working better than how I received it. (kind of like a bad connection inside if a wire nut, once re connected its fine) I have access to high end electrical diagnosis equip at my job, I'll try and test the resistance with the kelvin clips and post my findings.

Having some issues that I'm hoping I can troubleshoot first before having to send it back... again. Seriously thinking I need two of these to get by!

Basically, the LL cart/body keeps degrading over time. By this I mean warm up times get extended. When received from Thermovape, I can see a glow within 3 seconds and full brilliance at 20 seconds. Two weeks after receiving my repaired Cera, glow was seen in 6 seconds and full brilliance at 30-35 seconds. Now a month later, glow is seen at 9 seconds and full brilliance at 45 seconds to 1 minute. And these are all done with a fully charged battery. And yes, I also compared it to a brand new battery. So now, she only works with a fresh battery, and I let it warm up for over a minute to get good production. But I can't even come close to getting it to work for a second bowl, even with a warm up time of 2 minutes... just not enough power I think. And when I test a used battery (5 minutes used), I see the glow at 15 seconds and there never is anywhere close to the full brilliance when this thing was new.

So now I've come to terms with using the device with a fresh battery only, where I used to get 3-4 sessions out of a full charge. Anybody experiencing the same thing? I've ruled out battery since I've tested with one that is brand new. Could it be cart or strap? What's the reason for it degrading so quickly? I am noticing a bit of warmth at the switch that I don't really remember before... but that's really only after about 5 minutes of run time.

I've sent it back too many times to want to do it again and be without a vaporizer. Can anybody think of what's going on here and help me troubleshoot? I'm really hoping there's something I can do, otherwise I'm just going to use it with a fresh battery until it dies. And unfortunately this means I have to carry quite a few batteries on the go.

Nick Again said:

The "Kelvin Clips" are used to form a Kelvin bridge - a circuit where a voltage differential exists across a wire which doesn't carry (very much - they can't be perfect) current. Named for Lord Kelvin of absolute zero fame. Should be just a note or not covered at all in most intro electrical or electronic engineering texts - but you'll see it often when looking at "power electrical" texts.

Click to expand...

Yup, that one I know. Typically Gold plated, sometimes shielded, aimed at reducing thermal effects (hence the Kelvin part.....). What I don't understand is why (at two different 'outfits' I've worked for) the similar (but not technically the same) thing on low range Ohm meters (where large currents are forced down two legs and the other two used for precise voltage drop readings 'at the source' should have the same name and a much different function and construction?

For all I know they may be the same physical clips used in both cases? The leads are different in my experience, but the clips themselves could interchange???

As you point out, it's a pretty obscure part if the technology, perhaps it's just a wide spread misconception? For whatever reasons "four point systems" are really needed to accurately measure the small resistances we're dealing with here.

Thanks, at least one guy knows what I'm trying to say......

OF

OF said:

... aimed at reducing thermal effects (hence the Kelvin part.....). ...
Thanks, at least one guy knows what I'm trying to say......

OF

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Actually thermal noise is important, but the "Kelvin" connection is why the Brits call the circuit a Thomson Bridge: Lord Kelvin invented the circuit (specifically to measure low resistance values) BEFORE he was made a "Lord". And yes, I do understand what you seem to be saying (and you are correct - but good _cheap_meters are much better today than they were 20 years ago). Still, the "Kelvin" part is because he invented the method and circuit, not any relationship to thermal noise (which you properly point out _IS_ important on low valued resistance measurements).

BTW. Anyone with a (relatively) good meter can assemble an external bridge and using a pair of "Kelvin Clips" with the proper connectors for their meter, can measure low Ohm values (the algebra and arithmetic involved is quite simple). "Kelvin" clips are usually just alligator clips with separate wires (one high current, the other low current for measurement) for each jaw - i.e. two conductors from each attachment point (i.e. the reason for the "four wire" label), so with the correct connectors any set can feed any Kelvin/Thomson bridge circuit + a meter - with the bridge circuit either internal to the meter or externally (i.e. assembled from measured and matched inexpensive components).

-NDA

OK, my proto is in full service now. Figured give it a test run for a while before I did the final one. Wanted to see how it was in use and reliability in case it needed some mods... Already figured out immediately those mini banana's are crap, crap, crap. Going to the real deal there. I'll deal with the size. Maybe a panel mount molex or something. Those ruber bands are holding in the loose banana plugs, not the unit together

The toggle switch works very well. You just hold the block in your hand and push the switch with da thumb. Easy peasy. Much better than that Cera button. I normally throw a tube on and put it through a water pipe. This baby does get hot, in fact I can feel the brass get warm.

The nice thing with the lab supply is I characterized the EO cart at 5 amp continual draw if given a 3.61V constant voltage on its direct inputs (see 2nd image with 3.61 at the cart with 5A on the supply). So to ignore the leads since they are not in the voltage stabilization loop, I just set the voltage of the supply higher - like 5V, then I set the current limit to 5 amps. Now the lab supply will limit the voltage down to only allow 5A to flow. The voltage of the supply is higher than 3.61V, it bumps up to to whatever is required to give 3.61V at the EO cart inputs so 5A will flow. The leads are dropping about 220mV each (pos red and neg black). That is ~0.5V round trip. So the supply goes to about 4.1V... This is par for the distance of the leads. I tried 12 ga wire for fun, and it only changed about 15%. 5A through 5' of useable wire here will drop some with 5A through it. It doesn't get warm so no big deal.

I must say with a AC supply powering a Cera EO cart you can blast away oil quickly. Its a constant dab - as long as you hit the switch and then some. I normally feather it once it produces vape and pulse the power 50-50 . Milk vape that is only matched by the SR-71. So thick you can't see through it and runs until the wax you put in is gone, but not forgotten. Well maybe if you did it in one sitting

Speaking of that... need to load, burned a full cart in less that a day. Going to go broke supplying these puppies


Here is an old shot before the switch with supply. So far I'm into it $160...
Notice with short leads only about 100mV drop verses the 440mV of longer wires and switch

Looks like my thermovape has to go back to them AGAIN. At least the LL cart does, I'm going to have to keep the EO and body since that is my only portable vape right now. Jumped the gun selling my backup I think.

I still think the cera LL is the best herb vape on the market, but honestly the reliability is nowhere near what it was with the T1. Nothing can compete with vapor quality, but I don't really trust this thing since this is the third issue with the LL.

Sending off an email now. The stupid screw in the LL cart itself fell out. I knew it was getting loose

Hi Skored,
By the sounds of it I was having the exact same issues as you. It was taking longer and longer for my LL cart to fire up and the vapour production was negligible. My switch was also getting warm and sometimes hot, whereas it didn't used to do that, that I can recall. I still had my defective domed switch that I modded with a paperclip to get a handsfree connection. Once I connected that modded switch at that time the LL cart came back to life and started to glow at the usual 3 seconds and came to full brilliance in no time. I am able to easily get 3 bowls on one battery again. So, my guess was that my switch was degrading for some reason unbeknownst to me. I contacted Zeki and explained to him what was happening and asked for another switch but unfortunately did not get one so I am using my defective switch with the paperclip mod to get me through.

Skored said:

Having some issues that I'm hoping I can troubleshoot first before having to send it back... again. Seriously thinking I need two of these to get by!

Basically, the LL cart/body keeps degrading over time. By this I mean warm up times get extended. When received from Thermovape, I can see a glow within 3 seconds and full brilliance at 20 seconds. Two weeks after receiving my repaired Cera, glow was seen in 6 seconds and full brilliance at 30-35 seconds. Now a month later, glow is seen at 9 seconds and full brilliance at 45 seconds to 1 minute. And these are all done with a fully charged battery. And yes, I also compared it to a brand new battery. So now, she only works with a fresh battery, and I let it warm up for over a minute to get good production. But I can't even come close to getting it to work for a second bowl, even with a warm up time of 2 minutes... just not enough power I think. And when I test a used battery (5 minutes used), I see the glow at 15 seconds and there never is anywhere close to the full brilliance when this thing was new.

So now I've come to terms with using the device with a fresh battery only, where I used to get 3-4 sessions out of a full charge. Anybody experiencing the same thing? I've ruled out battery since I've tested with one that is brand new. Could it be cart or strap? What's the reason for it degrading so quickly? I am noticing a bit of warmth at the switch that I don't really remember before... but that's really only after about 5 minutes of run time.

I've sent it back too many times to want to do it again and be without a vaporizer. Can anybody think of what's going on here and help me troubleshoot? I'm really hoping there's something I can do, otherwise I'm just going to use it with a fresh battery until it dies. And unfortunately this means I have to carry quite a few batteries on the go.

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