I think I'm done with oils/waxes/shatter etc.

Roger D said:

For the dabber glass on Ti is ok ? or Ti on Ti ? Not sure that is for me..

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It's preference, a lot of people like Ti but I'm partial to glass because it doesn't get as hot or stay hot as long.

My bed bath and beyond torch works wonders for me. I'd use the iso only to purify bho. I've never enjoyed iso hash as much as a nice bho wax or shatter.

Roger D said:

Just got an included Ti nail packed with a piece I bought. I have domes, and almost all my pieces are DI. I don't know.. That would be for the experience, I don't have access to anything so I'll have to make my concentrate myself that is the point of the hesitation. I got ISO99 and a freezer tough. Not so sure about using ISO for safety.. Still would need a torch and dabber.
The torch by itself can be a nasty piece of equipment. Looking for a good one I stumbled upon strange stories about leaky models burning users hands and stuff like that..
For the dabber glass on Ti is ok ? or Ti on Ti ? Not sure that is for me..

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If I make qwiso I do the shaking and what not inside then let it evaporate somewhere(not inside) with good ventilation. If I make bho, I spray that outside and then let it evaporate the same way.

I see a lot of people like the Vector Nitro but it's a little pricey for a torch. I'll probably end up buying one of those. At the moment, I'm using a propane torch. It's super cheap and lasts forever. Also, I use them for a lot things and I've never had one leak.

I use a Ti nail with a glass dabber. I got it for free from the LHS. I was going to buy a nice titanium dabber but haven't got around to it.

YeeeBuddy said:

I kind of feel the same way, I just feel like their is something missing with the oil high that i get from flowers. It gets me medicated don't get me wrong, I usually vape OIL at work because its alot faster/smells less. Its a hell of alot better than nothing but the effect is just different I don't know how to explain it. When i get home and on my days off Its all flowers.

shredhead said:

That's exactly what I mean!!!! Oil is not a FULL high. As soon as I have a good vape sesh I feel FULL. When I have an oil sesh I feel HIGH and only for like 30min. Vaping keeps me FULL for hours

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I have said this before and I will say it again, I do not like oil because the effects it produces do not feel natural to me. Is high fructose corn syrup the same thing as natural sugar or sugar in the fruit? No, its not, and it doesn't "feel" the same either. I'll do kif and dry sift or bubble hash but that is as far as I go, I don't like reclaim either, its just not something I want to ingest.

I don't think I would enjoy only using oils every day.

I vaporize herb every day, and use oils only 0-3 times a month.

LMAO @ "Is high fructose corn syrup the same thing as natural sugar...?" - I don't care what the chemistry says, my mouth says they are not the same! Oil, no matter how well made, always has that "chemical" unnatural taste to me. And the high does seem a bit incomplete, like the synthetic cannabis analogs of legal rc times past. But I like oil.

And lemme tell you kids, we've come a long way from the gunky crap made in a glorified coffee maker with double-proof vodka, like we had 30 years ago. The good cold-brewed stuff tastes pretty good and as far as being natural, hell, then we gotta define "Nature" to go further with this discussion:

Is C02 natural? Is it natural for humans to experiment with a plant? I say yeah, sure, wtf, why not, whether boiled or smoked or brewed, just don't start mixing it in your bathtub with a bunch of other toxic crap and you'll most likely be okay.

I've decided I don't like dabs anymore, just for the feeling in my lungs after hitting them off any nail, Ti, glass or quartz. I don't know if it's the heat off the nail but my lungs burn after dabs and that's why I quit smoking.

I went thru the concentrate phase, have the same feelings, seems un-natural compaired to flowers. I always figured it was do to the solvent extractions because everything I would try off the shelf that said glass,wax,oil,etc, it messed up my chest and gave a funeral high, while anything labeled bubble hash, ice hash, palm, charas, etc was always the smoothest most enjoyable combustion I've ever experienced.

Hate to say it but I'm starting to feel the same way. One dispensary here in The Bay Area is selling concentrate for $100 a gram. Fucking Al Qaeda prices, and most of what costs a little less smells and tastes and burns like gasoline. Bubbles like water on Venus. No hit for the first part of the evaporation and then ... uh, was that a hit? Is this stuff any good? It must be, it's a "concentrate."

Fuck that. No doubt about it with a good bud, it smells and tastes good and gets me good and high.

Look, where I live, pot is big business, millions to be had if you run a McDonald's dispensary, verging on billions when Big Tobacco and Big Booze finally get involved and maybe make it suck but maybe make it safer and legal with some legitimate standards, but right now, all I see on the local news is punk ass bitch after punk ass bitch blowing himself up with lighter-fluid/coffee-maker hash oil contraptions and it is just too bad they sometimes burn others up with them. There are a million products on the market, waxes, oils, whips, full melts, super melts, bacon-cheddar melts, ices, smoothies -- stop the insanity -- it isn't meant to be some kind of candy bathtub crap like crack. The black market, remember that on a Federal level the stuff is still illegal here, so there really is no quality control and everyone is out to make a buck and I swear, everyone is full of shit or retarded.

Having said that, I may always rely on a little clean C02 oil in a vape pen for an on-the-go discrete buzz when needed. But here in Oakland, I can smoke anywhere, so what need have I of stealth anyway?

EDIT: Also feel I must point out: I believe at least a few dispensaries are taking their old inventory and "recycling" it as various concentrates like bubble hashes, oils and waxes.

Yeah, I shop for pot a lot, I visit Sticky Guide and Weed Maps several times a week and check half a dozen or a dozen or more dispensaries and delivery services for selection and prices (hint: they all suck, some suck less than others - grow your own if you possibly can). I see what they do with batches that "disappear" for a week or two and miraculously appear as "oil" or "wax" or "Gunter's Grungy Gunk" or whatever flavor of the week appears on the big screen TVs in these monstrosities of commercialism. Anyway, back to Business 101: If crap ain't selling, repackage it and sell it as other crap.

Now, pot loses potency with time and exposure to light and air and handling ... so they take this crappy old not-so-potent pot and what? Magically transform it into new oil? Degraded THC and CBD are just that.

And these THC levels and CBD levels I don't believe any of these tests anymore, I think 90% of them are just made up bullshit or have no bearing on how high you get or how you feel medicinally. And so, some dispensaries do not seem to test their batches, but just list the THC and CBD levels from the seed retailer's data - the same friggin numbers? How is that possible unless growing conditions and even trim styles are EXACTLY the same? It's all bullshit.

THC and CBD testing, even when done right and scientifically correct, means little when strains get over 15% THC, and have a good hunk of CBD in there, and from then on it is all about terpine profiles and taste and synergy of psychoactive chemicals and subjectivity. Each batch must be tested due to varying growing conditions, friggin Science 101, unheard of to these greedy bastards. I swear, I just wish I knew a righteous small-time individual, I would trade all of these dispensaries for one good joe I could score some decent oz's from (just ranting, not soliciting) once in a while. Yeah, the selection here is great, but that also means there are a million ways to get ripped off, and I have purchased my share of bogus buds.

Olympus Mons said:

Hate to say it but I'm starting to feel the same way. One dispensary here in The Bay Area is selling concentrate for $100 a gram.
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EDIT: Also feel I must point out: I believe at least a few dispensaries are taking their old inventory and "recycling" it as various concentrates like bubble hashes, oils and waxes.
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..............I have purchased my share of bogus buds.

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Sup guys, n00b to FC here. But yes, what OM posted is kinda how it goes. The dispensary I use typically has "name brand' buds, but they never have the kick that the name brand supposedly has. OG Kush and Girl Scout Cookies in particular may as well be "hamburger". It could be a frozen, white castle nugget of bleh, or it might be a 8oz kobe beef burger hand ground... but it's usually the white castle.

I also noticed my 'favorite' delivery service this week has like 4 'new' strains of some crappy sounding hash that are also the same strains of the over-priced junk buds they couldn't sell the past month.

There is also the kief that magically matches the strains no longer being put on special etc...

Haven't tried any wax, but at least some of the bubble hashes were ok. Flowers so far have been hit or miss, mostly miss even when getting the "top shelf" strains.

Tolerance is also an issue of course, as is portable vaporizing and CBDs etc..

As much as I like the ability to go into a dispensary and check out different products in the Bay Area, I feel like we could benefit from more accurate and honest information about what we're buying.

hoptimum said:

As much as I like the ability to go into a dispensary and check out different products in the Bay Area, I feel like we could benefit from more accurate and honest information about what we're buying.

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There is also a criminal element, skels hang outside the downtown shops, then mug people. Not like the PoPo is going to care or actually walk a beat.

My dispensary is generally honest... most of the bros just go by their own opinion for the strains they have tried. The more expensive downtown place has the 'budtenders' but they don't deliver, which is kind of a deal breaker since it's just a lot more time consuming to hit the BART then go stand in a line.

shredhead said:

I feel like I waste my herb when I make oil now adays

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I hear you on this front. If i had a supply that was cheap enough I would be more inclined to make it. but I am so glad my sub makes me a beautiful red oil that is of course solvent free! it's a great alternative. but I would say that grade a bho is still nicer. but this stuff satisfies me just fine!

do you find your lungs feel any different after doing a dab after 3 years of doing it?

weedemon said:

I hear you on this front. If i had a supply that was cheap enough I would be more inclined to make it. but I am so glad my sub makes me a beautiful red oil that is of course solvent free! it's a great alternative. but I would say that grade a bho is still nicer. but this stuff satisfies me just fine!

do you find your lungs feel any different after doing a dab after 3 years of doing it?

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what's the red stuff made with?

I should clarify that my sub is a vape that i am mostly using atm. the sublimator by it's full name. sorry , I should have been more clear.

it's just collected vapor that i scrape out of the atomizer (at the bottom where it would drip from otherwise)

so very similar to reclaim. but I dont really see much particulate at all in there and it is pretty awesome stuff! i'll go for it over bho that I have to make... hell the hit of herb in the process is intense enough! haha 3 or for hits and I am doing just dandy!

weedemon said:

I should clarify that my sub is a vape that i am mostly using atm. the sublimator by it's full name. sorry , I should have been more clear.

it's just collected vapor that i scrape out of the atomizer (at the bottom where it would drip from otherwise)

so very similar to reclaim. but I dont really see much particulate at all in there and it is pretty awesome stuff! i'll go for it over bho that I have to make... hell the hit of herb in the process is intense enough! haha 3 or for hits and I am doing just dandy!

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gotcha that makes sense. that's cool you have the sub, enjoy!

You know, when i first found out about wax/oil, I stopped smoking flower for probably a month or two. The clean & instant mega-high of a dab on a nail was too good!

But I'm starting to have the same experience as many of you have stated.... very questionable quality control, crazy prices.

I love keeping some concentrate around but I do view it as something for a portable solution, in a pen or whatever. It's become more of a tool to keep my THC/CBD levels in check as opposed to getting there or enjoying getting there really.

I recently realized again how much more I love just vaping flowers. Out of the Arizer Solo on a stock stem or repacking bowls on my VAPOLUTION 2.0 for hours on end... there's something about flowers concentrates just can't do!

I'm trying to learn to make my own CO2 concentrates because I can taste the butane/alcohol in some of the waxes I've been getting lately and I'm not a huge fan of that.

edit: What i will say though, is that smearing some bud in some wax and loading that in the VAPO 2.0 will knock you out unbelievably fast. The wax starts sizzling as soon as you put it in! Too cool.

We consumers deserve better. For the amount of money we pay for concentrates I'd like to see their chemical content independently analyzed the way it might be if the concentrate business was better regulated.

the other thing to keep in mind here is that certain dispensaries will call their concentrates c02 extractions to skirt the legal aspects of using butane...

vaporonly said:

the other thing to keep in mind here is that certain dispensaries will call their concentrates c02 extractions to skirt the legal aspects of using butane...

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That is some of the most underhanded shit I've ever heard. But what exactly is the "legal issue" with using butane? I know most try to avoid it because of the health issue and danger of it exploding, but legally, is there a difference?

it's a gray area for sure in cali, but there are laws on the books for chemical extractions. this is the case in most states too.

I dig clean wax. Mostly in a portable (like a pen) or a ThermoREVDART thingy. I usually have it around for everyday on the go situations, (good for travel too ) Everything I made so far has been just okay except one batch which was spectacular! (but tiny) This was after after washing about four grams of fresh bud in ISO91 and doing a slow heat cure at about 140F (in and out of the oven for alternating 30 minute periods) The heat cure was performed after I blew a fan over the ISO until it was totally visually evapped btw...
So far I feel like I wanna leave it to the professionals but I do have some plans to do a few BHO runs (outdoors only!!!!!) and try to learn to properly purge (there are many safe ways to do it) and the slower the cure (and also pocket curing after the first couple of days is a big help) the better is my understanding, so do not be impatient!!

I do think that oils/ waxes are much better type (more controllable dosage too) of meds for me. In the evening when I can relax I can medicate and recreate with flowers in my VXC Cloud, and while I love the taste of flowers by themselves I do think a dab or two can be a nice quick intense buzz like an energy rush if you stay active!)

The way you use concentrates really affects your experience too, dabbing is unpredictable because you can overheat and cause combustion/chemical reactions. If you use a temp controlled oil vape (I love the cera eo, and recently the VB dabbler) then you don't get that lung burn like from a nail hit...

Honestly I like concentrates because you get a greater range of effects and your lungs never get dried out like they can in a long flower sesh.

Hey Joe!
You are touching on something here that I left out. Nice catch! Being able to control the temp of the concentrate when it hits the nail, Ti Pad, et al, is muy importante! If you are able to monitor the nail's temp with say a temp gun, you can lurn the average time it takes to heat it to the correct glow keep it within the correct range (1080F i heard was ideal to release a full spectrum of actives) This is something I would like to experiment with sometime soon... Need to add more toys to the lab it seems...
BC

Olympus Mons said:

That is some of the most underhanded shit I've ever heard. But what exactly is the "legal issue" with using butane? I know most try to avoid it because of the health issue and danger of it exploding, but legally, is there a difference?

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AFAIK It's illegal to use butane to make cannabis extracts in California. I may be wrong. Of course, people do as they please.

hoptimum said:

We consumers deserve better. For the amount of money we pay for concentrates I'd like to see their chemical content independently analyzed the way it might be if the concentrate business was better regulated.

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you deserve million likes!