Firewood Vaporizer

paytonpenn said:

Sorry if it still doesn't make sense.

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No, no...that makes perfect sense PP, I just needed a little elaboration, that's all.

Without one in hand it's difficult, if not impossible, to make any kind of informed diagnosis, but I wonder if there is still an issue with the glass stem properly sealing, or maybe having enough ID (volume) to pull sufficient hot air? Both? Could it be? Whadaya think PP?

chicago_animal said:

No, I get what you are saying. I'm totally new to these so I have no idea what to expect in terms of all these comments. Was it the same with the FW5 as well?

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Yes. I mean, we are a forum, over-extrapolating from limited data is something we do, and on-demand convection is a niche w/in vaping so there is a learning curve.

There was a minor fit issue w one of the ceramic pieces on FW5 that compromised airflow, Marc was on it and fixed it before most of us noticed, proactively offering free parts to early adopters.

Generally, across the history of the Firewood thread, Marc addresses all issues w more detail and candor than most developers, but he does it at the pace of an engineer/designer, FC is not customer service. We’ll get there.

Well, please allow me to suggest that we let Marc know we are fine with him taking the next two months or so and
re-engineering the FW6 to the any extent it may be necessary. Sure, most of us would rather not incur an extended delay but I for one have no problem with backing off of Marc's original delivery estimates and instead give him sufficient time to "get it done right"!

What say you my FC colleagues?

Marc? @firewood




.

What say you my FC colleagues?

I say relax, vape some herb.

It seems at this point some of the problems are education related.

The mechanical stuff might need tweeking, but Marc seems to be on it and delaying new orders, to get it right. I have faith it will turn out fine.

I’ve got to concur with the other assessments that the 6 seems to provide less, vs. more power than the 5; at least with mine. It’s not been a quick or extremely thorough extractor. I can get even ABV now but it’s not super dark. With my FW5 I could basically blacken a bowl with 2 or 3 hard rips, even at level 3. With the 6 I don’t think I could extract a bowl in less than maybe 6-7 hard rips, and the ABV would likely just be leather brown vs. darker. Mine also has a minor firmware hiccup, where it won’t register 9 clicks for temp levels 290 or 390 (so those aren’t options). I trust FW will sort everything out, and it’s an enjoyable vape nonetheless. I was hoping it’d basically be a more powerful FW5 with a bigger bowl and onboard storage but it’s been it’s own unique device so far with its own pros/cons.

Mine shipped today if says anything.

Curious to compare to FW5.

Well, it's been many, many months since I've dropped in on FC. Nice to see some familiar faces here. I'm not surprised that it was Marc and the Firewood that brought me back.

Before I ramble too much, thank you to all the early adopters of the FW6 for your excellent reviews and primers. They went a long ways to convince me to ask Marc today to put me on the waiting list for a 6.

Please pardon a brief digression for some history, but it does relate, I promise. For quite a while my portable arsenal consisted of my FW4 and 2 Grasshoppers. After my SS Hopper spent 18 months at the lab for warranty repair and came back with the news that in order for it to work I would need to buy new batteries (which weren't available), I decided I'd had enough. Originally, I was totally happy to work through the Hopper's idiosyncrasies because vaping was very much a hobby and a source of fun and I enjoyed the experimenting and the process of vaping itself. Now, though, my health situation is quite different and my relationship with the herb has changed. It is now very much medicine and vaping is a tool for bringing relief with the herb. I need a device that just does the job reliably and without adding any stress or uncertainty to my day.

Through all of this, my FW4 was a trusted friend. It just plain worked, day in and day out. Once I got the fairly shallow learning curve under my belt, I could use the FW4 without thinking. Adding to the attractiveness, is Marc's fantastic customer service. His responsiveness, participation in this forum, and his willingness to listen to feedback is such a gigantic plus.

For those who are concerned after reading about the FW6's growing pains, I have absolutely NO doubt that Marc will make good for each and every customer. Some of you may remember that soon after FW4 released, Marc discovered a small flaw that could MAYBE compromise the safety of the vape. Without hesitation, Marc issued a recall for all of them. He paid shipping both ways and also ate the cost of making the required modification to every one. And he's a one-man shop!!! That kind of integrity and commitment deserves to be supported. I have ordered a 6 with complete faith that any bugs, flaws, etc. will be addressed and fixed as quickly as Marc is able to get to them.

I do have one question. I know a couple of folks have mentioned this, but the more data points I can get the better. One of the issues I'm dealing with is pain and stiffness in both my hands. I realize these sorts of things are pretty subjective, but I'd love to hear peoples' impressions of how much finger/hand strength it takes to activate the 6 and keep it squoze (yeah, that's a technical term I just invented. Feel free to use it ) for the length of a typical FW draw of 15-20 seconds.

Thanks for your help,

~moondog

moondog said:

I do have one question. I know a couple of folks have mentioned this, but the more data points I can get the better. One of the issues I'm dealing with is pain and stiffness in both my hands. I realize these sorts of things are pretty subjective, but I'd love to hear peoples' impressions of how much finger/hand strength it takes to activate the 6 and keep it squoze (yeah, that's a technical term I just invented. Feel free to use it ) for the length of a typical FW draw of 15-20 se

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I think @paytonpenn may have considerable input for you on that issue as he squeezed his too hard and actually damaged the unit...had to send it back for replacement. LOL!

Sorry...I know it's not funny! Well, mostly not funny.

.

Hey sorry for not being around here more.... I promise to return tonight with an update on all known fw6 issues and resolutions...

RE microdosing, being convection, can’t you just puff once or twice off a full bowl, put it down and come back?

firewood said:

Hey sorry for not being around here more.... I promise to return tonight with an update on all known fw6 issues and resolutions...

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I’m sure you’re working your butt off lately Marc! I appreciate it, as well as all the innovation you bring to this space!

Magistra said:

RE microdosing, being convection, can’t you just puff once or twice off a full bowl, put it down and come back?

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That's how I do it and it works just fine.

My 6 arrived in the UK on Monday! Haven’t had much time to play with it since then but I have a whole evening of testing ahead of me. It’s a ridiculously brilliant blend of art and engineering much like its siblings.

I’m fully aware of the mix of issues some folk are having so keeping all that (plus what Marc will mention later on) in my mind for when I sit down with her. Still very very happy though!

Mrjamminsalmon said:

My 6 arrived in the UK on Monday! Haven’t had much time to play with it since then but I have a whole evening of testing ahead of me. It’s a ridiculously brilliant blend of art and engineering much like its siblings.

I’m fully aware of the mix of issues some folk are having so keeping all that (plus what Marc will mention later on) in my mind for when I sit down with her. Still very very happy though!

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Congrats. I'm UK as well . Can't wait for mine too . Just got my tracking info . How long did it take , and what were the annoying customs charge ? Can you pay in advance or do you pay on the doorstep ?

firewood said:

Hey sorry for not being around here more.... I promise to return tonight with an update on all known fw6 issues and resolutions...

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Sooooooo...what time tonight? It's 10 pm here in EST, as you know, I'm sure.


.

Ok here is the update I promised. This is a copy paste from an email I sent to the existing fw6 customer so it may look familiar. These are the known defects on the initial batches, all of which have fixes in place.

Leaky mouthpiece tube:
Some units have air leaking in where the glass tube enters the bowl. This can be caused by a few factors which may require reworking or replacing of part(s). To test if you have this issue you should open your vape then completely cover the bowl with your finger so that no air can get it. Then draw on the glass tube. You should be able to create suction that holds for at least a few seconds if you seal the glass tube with the tip of your tongue. The main symptom of this issue can range from unacceptably weak vapor to a very subtle reduction in vapor and . Whether or not your unit seems to be working, I encourage you to send it in to get fixed if it fails the suction test.

Sticking button:
Some units have had the heater/button stick closed. It is pretty obvious when this happens but seems to be rare. If you have ever encountered this issue I strongly encourage you to send in your unit to be fixed.

Under sensitive draw sensor:
Some units have an under-sensitive draw sensor caused by a firmware bug. If you find that your unit is unexpectedly shutting down mid draw it is probably caused by this bug and I can fix it if you send it in.

Missing 9 clicks/buzzes:
All units shipped before today have this firmware bug that prevents setting the temp to 290 or 390 degrees F. You will need to send in your unit to get the fix for this bug.

Marc, what's the likelihood that once these issues are fixed that the problem recurs, requiring it be sent back to you once again?

I mean, there are defective parts and then there are design flaws, the latter certainly being much more challenging and certainly time consuming to fix!

TIA!

Fat Freddy said:

Marc, what's the likelihood that once these issues are fixed that the problem recurs, requiring it be sent back to you once again?

I mean, there are defective parts and then there are design flaws, the latter certainly being much more challenging and certainly time consuming to fix!

TIA!

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Sounds like faulty parts, with exception possibly being the leaky mouth piece. That may just be one or more manufacturing variances working together to cause a leak.

All he said are repairable.

Also, since the units are not for sale to just anyone, it sounds like us early users are the beta testers, discovering and having problems repaired, which is okay by me.

I mean ever since my MV1 preorder headache/disaster, I told my self I would never buy another preorder vape again.... but here I am, again, doing it all over again. Lol.

Fingers crossed that i have no problem. But if I do, it's not like I dont have other vaporizers....

Reading the firewood thread, it seems these units (all model #'s) all have some variance. My two surely did, and marc said mine were fine when I returned one that acted differently than the other.

So I would not expect carbon copy similarity from one units performance to another's...

Yes but returning units for us across the pond is much more costly and risky, since even when tagged as "service return / repair" we face the risk of having to repay VAT and customs fees when it gets back, on top of the shipping fees which would be close to half the device price in the first place... and also risking that it gets confiscated altogether since most of us live under strong prohibition.

Fat Freddy said:

Marc, what's the likelihood that once these issues are fixed that the problem recurs, requiring it be sent back to you once again?

I mean, there are defective parts and then there are design flaws, the latter certainly being much more challenging and certainly time consuming to fix!

TIA!

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I wouldn't have sent the email out if I wasn't confident that I have found the root cause for, and fixed each issue. That said I have worked for decades now in various industries where I have had to debug or diagnose bugs or other problems and there have definitely been times when I have felt pretty sure about something that turned out wrong. All engineers who have worked for any amount of time have experienced that. So I keep an open mind, but I am confident in these fixes.

The leaky tube issue was caused by a couple of things - one was variation in tool deflection when machining the wooden base caused the mouthpiece tunnel to slightly misalign with the bowl. That fix was easy to implement and confirm. The second was normal variation in the diameter of the glass tube. I had done my testing with glass that was on the high end of the variation. Glass that is on the narrower end of normal still forms a good seal against the oring but was not pushing the oring tightly enough against the bowl. That fix is simple and also easy to test (slight reduction in diameter of the oring seat in the bowl). Also, it had never ocurred to me that there would be a leak in the airpath so I hadn't been testing all untis for that. Now that I know about the issue, every unit gets tested. So far the fixes eliminate the issue.

The sticky button issue has 3 fixes that I don't have time to go into too much detail on, but are basically extra manufacturing steps to eliminate the points that were causing the sticking. Based on my testing the issue has been eliminated.

The last 2 are pretty basic firmware bugs and hard to imagine how they could be related to design flaws since very similar firmware has been running since fw3 without this issue.

Not sure if you have a fw6 or not, but if you do and aren't happy with it please pm or email me. If you don't have one yet and are on the fence about getting one due to the issues mentioned and you want zero chance of having to send it back, then I would definitely wait a few weeks. That said, I don't think there is a single vape company (or any company?) that can say their product has a zero percent chance of having a defect.

KeroZen said:

Yes but returning units for us across the pond is much more costly and risky, since even when tagged as "service return / repair" we face the risk of having to repay VAT and customs fees when it gets back, on top of the shipping fees which would be close to half the device price in the first place... and also risking that it gets confiscated altogether since most of us live under strong prohibition.

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I did offer international customers a $10 refund on the original order to cover the shipping back here, and I'll cover the shipping back there. I also label it as a repair and haven't heard of anybody getting hit with VAT in that case, but I guess it might be possible.

firewood said:

Not sure if you have a fw6 or not,

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LOL! Naw...I was supposed to receive an invoice by Monday/Tuesday of this past week but instead the email you sent me this past Tuesday said it could be another two weeks before I might receive an invoice. And like any other consumer attempting to make an informed purchase decision, I'm posing questions regarding your units that frankly, should have been forthcoming from the you, the vendor, in the very beginning. As is, I sense a bit of defensiveness on your part Marc in responding to your CUSTOMERS questions. I don't understand that. We're not fan boys and girls, we are in large part, informed vaporists and have a justifiable need to be reassured as to the quality and capability of your products.

What I would hope is that you remember that I've purchased a couple of your units over the years and have a great deal of respect and admiration for you design and woodworking capabilities. If I didn't, I would not be asking these questions and stating my admiration for your skills in public!

Let's keep moving forward!

FF

Fat Freddy said:

LOL! Naw...I was supposed to receive an invoice by Monday/Tuesday of this past week but instead the email you sent me this past Tuesday said it could be another two weeks before I might receive an invoice. And like any other consumer attempting to make an informed purchase decision, I'm posing questions regarding your units that frankly, should have been forthcoming from the you, the vendor, in the very beginning. As is, I sense a bit of defensiveness on your part Marc in responding to your CUSTOMERS questions. I don't understand that. We're not fan boys and girls, we are in large part, informed vaporists and have a justifiable need to be reassured as to the quality and capability of your products.

What I would hope is that you remember that I've purchased a couple of your units over the years and have a great deal of respect and admiration for you design and woodworking capabilities. If I didn't, I would not be asking these questions and stating my admiration for your skills in public!

Let's keep moving forward!

FF

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I'm sorry if you misunderstood, I was asking a genuine question. I didn't know if you had one yet or not. Sorry if I sound defensive.

The issues that you are asking me to be forthcoming about... I just gave way more info than most vendors ever would and I gave the info as soon as I had enough confidence to post it and enough time to write it up. I'm not sure what else I can do.

It didn't sound defensive neither ironical (about already having the 6) to me, just concerned.

It didn't sound defensive to me either. Although it seems a fair amount of flack has been shot Marc's way and a bit of defensiveness would be warranted on his part. No one's been wronged here. Marc's been nothing but a straight shooter.

I've just removed several posts that were off-topic (VAT and taxation debate). Please keep this thread on the topic of the Firewood.

Thank you.