Cleaning!

So, the other day my vape combusted while paired with a double perc bub. This bub has a bell shaped perc on the top and now has black shit stuck up in there. There is no way to get a cleaning utensil up in there.

Now, I can't get it to come come clean and it's driving me nuts. I've soaked it for days in 91%, I've tried 420 solution (out of desperation), hot water, etc. I've added salt and shook the shit out of it. Nothing is touching it.

Anyone have a suggestion for an agent strong enough to dissolve this crud?

Also, does anyone have something that works to clean up vape pen carts? My coils get gunked up fast, I soak them in ISO, but they never get much better. I usually throw them out and buy new ones, but if there was a chemical...

Tstat said:

So, the other day my vape combusted while paired with a double perc bub. This bub has a bell shaped perc on the top and now has black shit stuck up in there. There is no way to get a cleaning utensil up in there.

Now, I can't get it to come come clean and it's driving me nuts. I've soaked it for days in 91%, I've tried 420 solution (out of desperation), hot water, etc. I've added salt and shook the shit out of it. Nothing is touching it.

Anyone have a suggestion for an agent strong enough to dissolve this crud?

Also, does anyone have something that works to clean up vape pen carts? My coils get gunked up fast, I soak them in ISO, but they never get much better. I usually throw them out and buy new ones, but if there was a chemical...

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Hey buddy ! I suggest you try adding some Salt + warm iso. Sea salt on large grains works better,but if your perc holes are really tiny like honeycomb it is better to use fine salt or even baking soda. After that u give that smelly bitch a vigorous shake,while rotating it and turning it upside down in all dimensions.

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I usually run a lot of hot water before i do that or use the hairdryer in order to make the glass hot.Cause the higher the temps the higher is the dissolution rate .

So, it's got slits- I don't think the salt ever got up in there. I just poured some near-boiling water in it, with salt. Fuck.

Tstat said:

So, it's got slits- I don't think the salt ever got up in there. I just poured some near-boiling water in it, with salt. Fuck.

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I cant really tell from that pic,but if you pour salt in the gong it and turn it upside down salt will get inside the showhead trough its center tube ?
The trick with the salt is not to dissolve it in the alcohol,just to get it wet,so it can scrub the shit off the glass.
I run water trough it just to make the glass hot.After that i empty it and fill with salt and little alcohol.
Alternatively,you can the try the dishwasher if you got one,but make sure you secure it well cause it might brake if left rattling around.

@OF always suggests PBW. It's a brewery wash for glass. You can get it off Amazon.

CarolKing said:

@OF always suggests PBW. It's a brewery wash for glass. You can get it off Amazon.

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Great stuff, made for just this kind of stuff (cleaning nasty burnt on junk out of Brewery plumbing you can't get to). Coors had it developed IIRC. You can also get it at Home Brewery Shops. You can read all about it here:
http://fuckcombustion.com/threads/pbw-the-chemistry-of-clean.7854/

Cheaper, safer, and more environmentally friendly (you can put it down the drain....) than ISO and IMO does a better job. Keep it hot, let is soak maybe 5 minutes at a time and expect good results......

OF

@CarolKing beat me to it. Check out PBW, just be careful not too let it sit too long or use too high of a concentration because it can cause white stains on your glass if you're not careful.

A five minute soak with a very thorough rinse seems like the best way to do it. Multiple washes may be required to fully clean your glass.

http://fuckcombustion.com/threads/pbw-the-chemistry-of-clean.7854/

I used to have a beer making shop near me and have used it in the past. I guess I should order some.

CarolKing said:

@OF always suggests PBW. It's a brewery wash for glass. You can get it off Amazon.

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OF said:

Great stuff, made for just this kind of stuff (cleaning nasty burnt on junk out of Brewery plumbing you can't get to). Coors had it developed IIRC. You can also get it at Home Brewery Shops. You can read all about it here:

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Thanks for the credit guys. IIRC I first brought PBW to this forum for what we are using it for now. How quickly people forget who helped them in the first place.

I haven't used it yet on this piece and I don't have a lot of hope. I used it a lot in the past and although it made my glass sparkle, I never witnessed it dissolving burnt on crud, like I have now.

Tstat said:

I haven't used it yet on this piece and I don't have a lot of hope. I used it a lot in the past and although it made my glass sparkle, I never witnessed it dissolving burnt on crud, like I have now.

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PBW was invented for the sole purpose of cleaning burnt wort off of brew kettles. This is a very difficult task. Increase your concentration of chemical, use hot water, utilize multiple washes keeping the dwell times short, and repeat until you produce the desired result. You can add energy to the cleaning cycle by adding mechanical action, shaking your glass, but be careful PBW is a little slippery.

Thank you @t-dub. I had no idea that you brought this tidbit of info to the community. Give credit where credit is due.

I had been hearing from @OF and some others on the Solo and Air thread. I had no idea who originated the idea.

I've learned so much from others on the forum like @t-dub and @OF

PBW is the most powerful approach for sure. If you want something that is not iso and not PBW...

I am a fan of simple green degreaser. You can get it at home depot. I find it is a better starting point than iso for caked on resin. You can let glass sit in it without worry. (it might remove labels though).

jojo monkey said:

(it might remove labels though)

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True dat . . . Simple green is an alcohol based cleaner with other mojo going on and it is great for cleaning our glass. It just doesn't go down the drain responsibly and is a heath hazard. You are correct in being cautious with labels. Anything silk screened on or painted in some way is at risk, worked glass with the color in the glass is safe of course. PBW did this to my Zob . . . took the top layer of the label right off. It was still there but when drying with a paper towel the green color came off on the towel.

@t-dub I did not know about that green was not good to go down the drain. Now I need to switch. Thanks!!

Shit:

Simple Green Concentrated All-Purpose Cleaner—This product is anything but green. It contains 2-butoxyethanol, a solvent that soaks through the skin and damages red blood cells; even more dangerous is that some people miss the fine print and don't dilute it.

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Fuck what I said.

Man, do I have to google everything in my life.

I have read some lab cleaning procedures that call for acetone. That can't go down drains either.

jojo monkey said:

@t-dub I did not know about that green was not good to go down the drain. Now I need to switch. Thanks!!

Shit: Fuck what I said.

"Simple Green Concentrated All-Purpose Cleaner—This product is anything but green. It contains 2-butoxyethanol, a solvent that soaks through the skin and damages red blood cells; even more dangerous is that some people miss the fine print and don't dilute it."

I have read some lab cleaning procedures that call for acetone. That can't go down drains either.

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I am glad you have done some reading, like I have, on this subject. When you get into the details alarming info comes into focus. What you have just pointed out is one of the reasons I rejected Simple Green for my needs.

I want to thank you for bringing that into the conversation again so people understand the risks associated with the chemicals that we use.

Safety is NOT an accident . . . .

Edit: PBW is actually good for the environment because it puts oxygen back into the water. Lots of die-offs occur due to lack of oxygen in the water due to pollution and "blooms" of microorganisms that are undesirable and rob the ecosystem of oxygen.

Yeah. It seems PBW is 30% Sodium Metasilicate.

https://pubchem.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/compound/Sodium_metasilicate#section=Safety-and-Hazards

You can go homebrew on the PBW and make your own:

http://www.homebrewtalk.com/showthread.php?t=467655

I'm gonna try it. Thanks again, t-dub! Here I thought I was just popping in and then my world flips.

jojo monkey said:

Yeah. It seems PBW is 30% Sodium Metasilicate.

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Yes it is. These are like millions of microscopic diamonds at work, doing the same thing that salt does in ISO, but on an entirely, more effective, scale. Sodium Meta-silicate is actually Tri-Sodum Phosphate substitute. When they outlawed TSP this was the replacement.

jojo monkey said:

You can go homebrew on the PBW and make your own:

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Yes you can, and I wish you the best. I have tried many batches and its never as good as the factory produced product. The reason is that in addition to Sodium Metasilicate and an oxygen based cleaner, the factory also adds water softeners to the mix and they are important. Plus on an industrial scale, they are able to produce a powder with amazing qualities that doesn't clump or absorb water from the environment, and stays relatively stable for long periods of time.. I tried to make my own PBW many times. I was able to produce a semi-stable powder, that didn't have the hard water components of PBW, that degraded quickly over time.

Tstat said:

So, the other day my vape combusted while paired with a double perc bub. This bub has a bell shaped perc on the top and now has black shit stuck up in there. There is no way to get a cleaning utensil up in there.

Now, I can't get it to come come clean and it's driving me nuts. I've soaked it for days in 91%, I've tried 420 solution (out of desperation), hot water, etc. I've added salt and shook the shit out of it. Nothing is touching it.

Anyone have a suggestion for an agent strong enough to dissolve this crud?

Also, does anyone have something that works to clean up vape pen carts? My coils get gunked up fast, I soak them in ISO, but they never get much better. I usually throw them out and buy new ones, but if there was a chemical...

Click to expand...

You need iso (preferably 100% or as close as possible) and large unground crystals of salt, a lot of them. Mix about 30% (by volume) large unground rock salt crystals with 70% (again by volume) iso. Shake vigorously for as long as it takes. I've never seen stubborn staining like you describe that this didn't succeed in cleaning eventually.

As many point out here, there are other options but some are not so safe or considerate. I have never used anything but iso, water, salt and steam to clean my rigs.

herbivore21 said:

I have never used anything but iso, water, salt and steam to clean my rigs.

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Hey good for you. Maybe one day you will realize that there might be a better way. Environmentally responsible PBW not only does it's job on an amazing array of plastics and metals, it also is good for the environment because it puts oxygen back into water. Its also very benign to the skin compared to other cleaners.

Think about it . . .

MSDS . . . www.fivestarchemicals.com/wp-content/uploads/PBWMSDS2.pdf

t-dub said:

Hey good for you. Maybe one day you will realize that there might be a better way. Environmentally responsible PBW not only does it's job on an amazing array of plastics and metals, it also is good for the environment because it puts oxygen back into water. Its also very benign to the skin compared to other cleaners.

Think about it . . .

MSDS . . . www.fivestarchemicals.com/wp-content/uploads/PBWMSDS2.pdf

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You've obviously made a number of assumptions about what I'm doing when I clean to claim that you know that there is a better way. I've used PBW, it does not suit my needs at all and I gave up on it a couple years ago.

Also man, you cannot possibly be telling me that steam is not as environmentally responsible as PBW, right?

If I may gently suggest next time that you look before you leap into criticism bro. You didn't have enough information about my scenario to know that your response (which came off a little snarky) above was relevant to my case.

I use all of my reclaim. Whilst I mentioned using salt, I have used salt to clean glass only once in the last 24 months and that was cleaning a friend's rig which had much like the OP's rig been combusted in. I clean my rigs with iso daily. PBW is utterly out of the question as it would mean a complete waste of my reclaim, which for me, is valuable medicine. My reclaim is much better than most and definitely worth saving. After all, I only generally dab 6 star full melt PBW simply does not my cleaning requirements.

PBW works well to clean glass of course I never suggested otherwise! You can decide what you clean with man, but don't presume to know better than me what I need for my situation I can assure you, I'm all over that shit.

herbivore21 said:

Also man, you cannot possibly be telling me that steam is not as environmentally responsible as PBW, right?

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Actually steam is environmentally neutral while PBW has a positive impact.

herbivore21 said:

You didn't have enough information about my scenario to know that your response (which came off a little snarky) above was relevant to my case.

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Granted the internet has no way of conveying tone. I was trying to help in a concise way. I make my posts with the minium of words required so I realize I can come off as dry or irritating.

herbivore21 said:

I use all of my reclaim.

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Well if you are doing this PBW is not for you.

herbivore21 said:

PBW works well to clean glass of course I never suggested otherwise! You can decide what you clean with man, but don't presume to know better than me what I need for my situation I can assure you, I'm all over that shit.

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I am sure you are and I never meant to "presume better than you know because you are all over that shit."

I was trying to help . . . period.

t-dub said:

Actually steam is environmentally neutral while PBW has a positive effect.

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By the same token, steam adds oxygen to the air too man, after all, that is part of what the water is releasing as it boils! Neither of these examples is anything especially noteworthy though.

What is noteworthy is that PBW is by no means salubrious man. Sodium metasilicate is a compound with well known associated health risks relating to inhalation, ingestion, eye and skin contact. OSHA regard it as a 'severe skin irritant' Every item of CDC/OSHA documentation I've ever read about this substance requires use of respiratory protective equipment, gloves, eye protection etc. In fact, the MSDS you shared above for PBW also recommends all of these protective measures.

It is a very effective cleaning agent for the nastiest, most unclean glass as we both agree. However, PBW requires caution with use just like other cleaning products and as you concede, is definitely not useful for those of us who reclaim and clean our rigs too frequently to ever have stubborn stains requiring aggressive cleaning.

t-dub said:

I am sure you are and I never meant to "presume better than you know because you are all over that shit."

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I take you at your word that you didn't meant to come across this way Please understand that when you suggest that 'one day you will realize that there might be a better way' after using the almost exclusively sarcastic turn of phrase; 'good for you', it comes across as you telling me that you know better than me about what I should do. This is also why your post came across as snarky to me.

Of course with your intentions cleared up, I got no hard feelings at all man

herbivore21 said:

What is noteworthy is that PBW is by no means salubrious man. Sodium metasilicate is a compound with well known associated health risks relating to inhalation, ingestion, eye and skin contact. OSHA regard it as a 'severe skin irritant' Every item of CDC/OSHA documentation I've ever read about this substance requires use of respiratory protective equipment, gloves, eye protection etc. In fact, the MSDS you shared above for PBW also recommends all of these protective measures.

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I never denied that.

herbivore21 said:

It is a very effective cleaning agent for the nastiest, most unclean glass as we both agree. However, PBW requires caution with use just like other cleaning products and as you concede, is definitely not useful for those of us who reclaim and clean our rigs too frequently to ever have stubborn stains requiring aggressive cleaning.

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Exactly. And I have instructed very firmly in my PBW thread that people must use safety related materials to mitigate thermal and chemical risks. However, compare putting simple Green, TSP, or even ISO on your hands, let alone into the environment, and you will recognize that PBW is more benign for your skin and much more environmentally friendly than other alternatives....

herbivore21 said:

I take you at your word that you didn't meant to come across this way

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Thanks. I am a thinker after all and a very poor communicator. Relating complex ideas in this medium can be very difficult. Posts must be briefly worded, to the point, and cogent for readers to benefit so I try my best.

Safety is NOT an accident . . .

t-dub said:

you will recognize that PBW is more benign for your skin and much more environmentally friendly than other alternatives....

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This claim is actually inaccurate when it comes to Iso. I do agree with your claim regarding simple green etc, I would not recommend that stuff at all.

Let me explain what I'm talking about with ISO here:

When we consider the MSDS you posted above regarding PBW in contact with skin, it reads: "Skin contact:
Irritant, prolonged contact will cause redness and blistering."

On the other hand, various Isopropanol MSDS and CDC/OSHA documentation highlight that iso is "Slightly hazardous in case of skin contact". Iso can cause drying of the skin and associated irritation which is why it earns this description.

Both of the respective MSDS and CDC/OSHA documentation highlight that if skin irritation persists in either case of exposure to seek medical attention. However, the symptoms that can be possibly caused to the skin as outlined in these documents are worse for PBW than iso (unlike iso, PBW causes chemical burning with prolonged skin contact).

Despite the slightly worse symptoms that may eventuate from prolonged contact with PBW vs iso, I would regard them as very similarly risky in the case of skin contact, since prolonged contact should be unlikely except in the case of poor safety practices. Nonetheless, the above makes it very difficult to successfully argue that iso is worse in the event of skin contact than PBW.

As you say, safety is not an accident! This discussion that you and I have had here is important as all of this information needs to be understood so that others, like us can avoid risks when cleaning their glass