Discontinued The Splinter by RBT

RastaBuddhaTao said:

The beta team will be testing two 18 mm, one 14 mm and several mouthpiece with shorter load chambers.

The core learning of the testing being height reduction trade-offs. As the unit gets smaller the vapor quality falls off and gets hotter and the load chamber gets shorter.

Would you trade vapor quality for stealth? What is the max height including the mouthpiece that you would want for a 510 vaporizer?

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Absolutely vapor quality, there's a reason I barely use my Grasshopper, and even then it's only at home through water really. The stealth is unfortunately useless if the experience is unpleasant, maybe a happy medium?

Height could depend on the mod right? I really couldn't say, just as short as possible without sacrificing the quality? Maybe there is a way to get some kind of vortex vaporpath to smooth hits out... Shorter load chamber seems fine to me, good for microdosing, but adjustable would appeal to the most users right?

Looking forward to hearing from beta testers, will it all be behind the scenes or will they be posting here like we did in the old days before all the backlashes? Ah I miss those times

I'm surprised to hear your marketing guy disliked the name and suggested changing after it's been floating around for quite a while on your site. Personally I thought Bodhi was spot on! Rasta Buddha Tao; naming it after something related to Buddhism seemed totally in line with the RBT brand to me.

I think I like it as much or better than Milaana; which is a great sounding name, but even after a google search I don't really understand how the word fits in with RBT.

Bodhi seems like it flows just fine to me.. Bodhi.. booodhi. bodhiiii. I dunno maybe I'm just really ripped but it's kind of fun to say! Has a roundness to it that fits with the barrell design of the mod too, imo!

But it also makes sense to me to call it the Milaana510/Zion510; keeps within the already established brand, references the heater design, and has instant Ecig recognition. What about the Bodhi510? I dunno I just really liked Bodhi

Prolusio said:

I'm surprised to hear your marketing guy disliked the name and suggested changing after it's been floating around for quite a while on your site. Personally I thought Bodhi was spot on! Rasta Buddha Tao; naming it after something related to Buddhism seemed totally in line with the RBT brand to me.

I think I like it as much or better than Milaana; which is a great sounding name, but even after a google search I don't really understand how the word fits in with RBT.

Bodhi seems like it flows just fine to me.. Bodhi.. booodhi. bodhiiii. I dunno maybe I'm just really ripped but it's kind of fun to say! Has a roundness to it that fits with the barrell design of the mod too, imo!

But it also makes sense to me to call it the Milaana510/Zion510; keeps within the already established brand, references the heater design, and has instant Ecig recognition. What about the Bodhi510? I dunno I just really liked Bodhi

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+1
Really digging the name. Think it fits very well and reflects the spirit. Also implies being the (core) "body", which is the heater module only... I like it, again and again and would not let one single marketing guy kill it. I know several of them and everyone has his own approach and likings.. There is not strict rule. And even if there was, I'd change the road to make it RBT style

RastaBuddhaTao said:

The beta team will be testing two 18 mm, one 14 mm and several mouthpiece with shorter load chambers.

The core learning of the testing being height reduction trade-offs. As the unit gets smaller the vapor quality falls off and gets hotter and the load chamber gets shorter.

Would you trade vapor quality for stealth? What is the max height including the mouthpiece that you would want for a 510 vaporizer?

Click to expand...

Always vapor quality for me, stealth isn't an issue but compactness is nice. My evic Mini is 84mm high, Yocan Cerum concentrates attachment adds another 50mm and feels good, I'd say it gets unwieldy after 180mm total height.

Edit: Also like "Bodhi", but if it has to go then Milaan510 and Zion510 makes sense. @RastaBuddhaTao, will us preorder folks have options (eg Milaana vs Zion heater) to choose before delivery? 14mm is still on the table?

Thanks to all for the support for the name. It's the funny pronunciation that is hard in that when said, it can be confusing as to what the name is aka Body instead of Bodhi. Thought about Buddhi as an alternative but it sounds like "Buddy"?

How about "Splinter" or "Timber Cannon" lol.

@hippogriff thanks for the marketing feedback. @pakalolo and the rest of the team will be testing two 19 mm units and one 14 mm unit over the next month or so. The pre-order unit will most likely be the 19 mm Zion heater with standard 19 mm glass. The production unit and glass configuration will be driven by the Beta teams testing feedback. A 16 mm custom glass could prove to be the happy medium or a reduced depth 19 mm might be the right option, like a 19/16. In order to shorten the unit height by 6 mm a custom design is required that would not allow for standard glass attachment. All things for the Beta team to figure out.

I am especially excited to have @DDave join the team to weigh in on the custom glass options. Cool right?

The beta team will be discussing their testing summary and recommendations here in the thread to maximize customer input. I myself am having a smashing time getting the Zion train rolling to clear the way for the ?510.

The Bodhi prototypes are currently undergoing the scrutiny of @pakalolo. Early results results are less than impressive for this over priced device. even with the FC discount it's still a waste of money imo

Are you scrapping the idea Ryan?

Vape Dr. said:

Are you scrapping the idea Ryan?

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Totally kidding. Just making light of the negative sentiment in this thread in reguards to the cost and performance.

On a serious note, @pakalolo is running head-to-head tests on two 19 mm units. The Zion and Milaana heaters have been redesigned to optimize them for size. The Zion unit is currently 2" tall (unit no mouthpiece) and the Milaana unit is 1.5". The testing will evaluate the vapor quality and external temperatures of each unit to determine if the size or vapor quality wins out.

The glass will use the first 16 mm of a standard 19/26 male fitting. This will in effect create a 17/16 custom fitting (removing 10 mm of load chamber length) and thereby reducing the outer diameter from 19 to about 17. This will reduce the height by 6 mm from today's 19/22 and allow for the use of 19/26 fittings without interfering with the heater screen. The walls of the male will be made thinner such that it will be more likely to break in the event of a fall.

@Vape Dr. and fellow Beta team members feel free to discuss any of what the team is working on here on the thread unless it is stated to be proprietary as direct customer input is the goal. @pakalolo please share a pic of the Beta units when you have time.

The trade-off of vapor quality to size is a somewhat subjective call with vapor quality hard to define and the impact of a 1/2" reduction in size impact on sales volume nearly impossible to gage. Simple physics, the smaller a device gets the hotter things get. It will be interesting to see the different perspectives folks have on this.

@pakalolo I would love to see some pictures

Small is good. The size thing was a huge turnoff, with these revisions I'm incredibly interested. Pics would be well appreciated! You might check out the Vapcap for inspiration regarding a tiny device with smooth vapor. It allows fresh air to mix in and really tames the thick dense vapor.

Not near as good as @pakalolo pics but here is a teaser...
https://instagram.com/p/BSgMbSyA9Js/

RastaBuddhaTao said:

Not near as good as @pakalolo pics but here is a teaser...
https://instagram.com/p/BSgMbSyA9Js/

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Isn't this the newer slimmer one? https://www.instagram.com/p/BS9sTdYAVZj/?taken-by=rastabuddhatao

Looks awesome, this refinement is exactly what this model needed. Very impressive.

invertedisdead said:

Isn't this the newer slimmer one? https://www.instagram.com/p/BS9sTdYAVZj/?taken-by=rastabuddhatao

Looks awesome, this refinement is exactly what this model needed. Very impressive.

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That is the Alpha unit. It was 1 1/8" OD where the Beta units are 1 1/4" OD but much shorter than the Alpha. (See IG below - walnut and Cherry unit on left). The added wall thickness is needed to sufficiently insulate the heater and to provide structural robustness. The team is testing to see if the shorter unit (Walnut Mini Milaana heater) sacrifices vapor quality over the unit that is 6 mm taller (Cherry mini Zion heater)

The kick-off video for the Beta team is below. One mistake to point out is calling the 2" tall unit 3" tall. As noted prior, the 14 mm is no longer in contention.


https://instagram.com/p/BTQtivFgd8s/

RastaBuddhaTao said:

That is the Alpha unit. It was 1 1/8" OD where the Beta units are 1 1/4" OD but much shorter than the Alpha. (See IG below - walnut and Cherry unit on left). The added wall thickness is needed to sufficiently insulate the heater and to provide structural robustness. The team is testing to see if the shorter unit (Walnut Mini Milaana heater) sacrifices vapor quality over the unit that is 6 mm taller (Cherry mini Zion heater)

The kick-off video for the Beta team is below. One mistake to point out is calling the 2" tall unit 3" tall. As noted prior, the 14 mm is no longer in contention.

https://instagram.com/p/BTQtivFgd8s/

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They look awesome. What setting do you use for the mod?

RastaBuddhaTao said:

That is the Alpha unit. It was 1 1/8" OD where the Beta units are 1 1/4" OD but much shorter than the Alpha. (See IG below - walnut and Cherry unit on left). The added wall thickness is needed to sufficiently insulate the heater and to provide structural robustness. The team is testing to see if the shorter unit (Walnut Mini Milaana heater) sacrifices vapor quality over the unit that is 6 mm taller (Cherry mini Zion heater)

The kick-off video for the Beta team is below. One mistake to point out is calling the 2" tall unit 3" tall. As noted prior, the 14 mm is no longer in contention.

https://instagram.com/p/BTQtivFgd8s/

Click to expand...

Holy shit those are tiny!!! Actually surprisingly cool. Wow.

Smoke1ForMe said:

They look awesome. What setting do you use for the mod?

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@pakalolo is dialing in the range but it runs between 25 and 35 watts but is capable of 50 watts if you have the lungs to keep up with it.

Temperature control mode is not recommended as it is intended to be used control the temperature of the wire of an e-cig that is conducting directly to the wick. With convection, the added variable of air flow makes "temperature control" of the element not really relevant to the temperature of the air in the load chamber. With so many variables changing so fast it's hard for an algorithm to keep up imo. I'm sure folks will play around with it but the e-cig world sees it as hype and most run straight up wattage. RBT's design philosophy is simplicity... as @cannabis.pro likes to say, we be #firmwarefree

@AJS the Zion and Milaana heater tech was miniaturized for this application. The production models will use a custom 17/16 mm glass which will shave off another 6 mm from the unit height. A shorter mouthpiece could reduce the size further. The final design should be about the size of an average RTA which should be palatable to most folks.

Due to a long delay in Customs, my time with these lovelies was limited, but I did take some pics:

As I have explained in the past, I do not offer opinions on a device based on only two or three uses. I did not have enough time testing these to feel comfortable comparing them to anything. I did have some satisfying sessions once I learned how to use the box mod. (I've never use one before.) These are basically prototypes for proof of concept, and I'm willing to go so far as to say concept proven. Once RBT has produced a few beta units and gets some tester feedback, I'm confident that the final result will be a winner.

Oh that Pak. I kind of giggled a little when I read your review. Or was it a non review. I remember getting this statement from a different unit I had inquired about a little too early. And to be perfectly honest I found that I appreciated your patience. It doesn't sound like it will do us any good on this one however.

I really do like the look of where the Bodhi is going. It's quite a bit smaller then the very first rendition.

And if the quality of the vapor is as good as the Zion and Mi then it's going to be worth it. Imo.

Is the wood enclosure set in stone or just part of the proof of concept? I like wood and I know it's kinda your thing; and it really fits other RBT products but it seems like an alumina enclosure would be very clean and sleek with something in this market.

invertedisdead said:

Is the wood enclosure set in stone or just part of the proof of concept? I like wood and I know it's kinda your thing; and it really fits other RBT products but it seems like an alumina enclosure would be very clean and sleek with something in this market.

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Yeh for this model we are locked in on wood but def something to look at in future revisions. The wood offers good thermal insulation and different woods lend to easy style choices where as alumina requires costly tooling and long lead times and isn't easy to change. Wood is just a good choice for low volume manufacturing state side.

I'm not participating here because apparently I'm too much of pain in the butt (It's a shame because I got a lot to say and experience from both the user and maker sides) So, in order to continue in this trend, because that's what I do best...

For the name, there is already a "Bodhi" 510 RTA on the market, and it's packaged with a few mods:

https://www.fasttech.com/products/0...hentic-austink-bodhi-sub-ohm-tank-clearomizer

This is going to be in conflict with your google hits... I don't like this name anyways. Not something I would be proud of to say the least... "- oh what it is? - it's a boh...erm.. nevermind it's just a vape". I associate it with stoner new age hippie crap.

RastaBuddhaTao said:

Temperature control mode is not recommended as it is intended to be used control the temperature of the wire of an e-cig that is conducting directly to the wick. With convection, the added variable of air flow makes "temperature control" of the element not really relevant to the temperature of the air in the load chamber. With so many variables changing so fast it's hard for an algorithm to keep up imo. I'm sure folks will play around with it but the e-cig world sees it as hype and most run straight up wattage. RBT's design philosophy is simplicity... as @cannabis.pro likes to say, we be #firmwarefree

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The only question is: does it work in TC mode or not? Our cumulated tests were not conclusive, not enough resistance change to regulate. What about yours?

But saying it's useless is plain wrong. Yes earlier algos were crap, yes e-cig vapers don't use it much, but since DNA boards and the new generation of chipsets, as well as custom firmware for the old ones, temperature regulation is pretty good and solid.

Regulation is better than no regulation, it's not even open to debate.

KeroZen said:

I'm not participating here because apparently I'm too much of pain in the butt (It's a shame because I got a lot to say and experience from both the user and maker sides) So, in order to continue in this trend, because that's what I do best...

For the name, there is already a "Bodhi" 510 RTA on the market, and it's packaged with a few mods:

https://www.fasttech.com/products/0...hentic-austink-bodhi-sub-ohm-tank-clearomizer

This is going to be in conflict with your google hits... I don't like this name anyways. Not something I would be proud of to say the least... "- oh what it is? - it's a boh...erm.. nevermind it's just a vape". I associate it with stoner new age hippie crap.



The only question is: does it work in TC mode or not? Our cumulated tests were not conclusive, not enough resistance change to regulate. What about yours?

But saying it's useless is plain wrong. Yes earlier algos were crap, yes e-cig vapers don't use it much, but since DNA boards and the new generation of chipsets, as well as custom firmware for the old ones, temperature regulation is pretty good and solid.

Regulation is better than no regulation, it's not even open to debate.

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I feel like between my unregulated Milaana experience and my limited voltage-setting experience vaping bubble hash and concentrates w a evic Mini, that I'll be covered. What am I missing w temp control?

hippogriff said:

I feel like between my unregulated Milaana experience and my limited voltage-setting experience vaping bubble hash and concentrates w a evic Mini, that I'll be covered. What am I missing w temp control?

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The ability to vaporize your material at a consistent temperature allows for very strong editing of the particular strains effects. Manual vapes are cool, but sometimes I just want a shot of 350 degree vapor only, this isolation can produce effects quite different from your typical full spectrum vaporizing experience; almost psychedelic at times.

I would also say temp control creates an unparalleled ease of repeatability which is quite necessary for many medical patients.

hippogriff said:

I feel like between my unregulated Milaana experience and my limited voltage-setting experience vaping bubble hash and concentrates w a evic Mini, that I'll be covered. What am I missing w temp control?

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Well you have temp control in your evic VTC mini, just need to enable it! And even better with myevic or ArticFox custom firmware.

With TC you can't combust. You can use your vape while walking, while on the phone, while completely distracted and you don't have to count mentally. With the MVT or the Milaana and a fresh battery, you miss a single time the trigger time window, and say over-indulge for 1 or 2 extra seconds and bam, the load is scorched and the taste is spoiled for the remaining of the session.

With TC it's braindead, you hit the trigger and draw at the speed you want and how long you want (well, you need to retrigger after the timeout for safety reasons but it's easy)

Plus all the reasons listed above of course.

@pakalolo maybe it is a silly question, shouldn't this thread be moved into "e-cig based portable" section? more e-cig folks could chime in