Gear The Source by Extract Craft - a closed loop system for alcohol extractions

herbivore21 said:

Cheers for the info. I'd be interested to find out about the pressure question and whether a solution is in the pipeline to measure pressure.

Does this unit use inductive heating per chance? Is it possible to simply switch to a more appropriately shaped glass dish in the source instead of the SS bowl for the scraping?

Also everything behaves differently in a vacuum, remember that when the pressure changes you cannot be sure anymore that you have a chamber whose conditions are safe to put anything in. I don't trust anything that isn't borosilicate and my meds inside a vac chamber. An ounce of prevention is worth quarter of an ounce of unspoiled meds for me!

I have seen silicone delaminate and stick to full melt (solventless resin), let alone solvent based concentrates with residuals (with which I've seen all kinds of weird behaviour with over time when stored in silicone containers, even when fully purged - I fully abandoned silicone container for concentrate storage or processing over a year ago).

When you have a bunch of ethanol in the mix as well as probably more terps than traditional heat purging would leave, you have an atomsphere full of hydrocarbon vapors around your silicone (a polymer rated only to be used in specific scenarios - food grade does not imply safety for use in a vacuum, nor does food grade have any bearing at all on the superheating and inhalation of a substance where ethanol is concerned).

Let me explain what I mean when I mention hydrocarbons since it is true that ethanol has a hydroxyl group and is hence not a hydrocarbon. When ethanol is superheated, it is known to release ethylene (a hydrocarbon and asphyxiant) and h2o. I have posted scholarly articles to this effect on FC before.

Of course, ethanol itself is a carcinogen and a solvent and will dehydrate your airways in enough concentration whether from too much residual in one dab, or cumulative exposure from small amounts of residual in many dabs. That for me, is beyond the risks that I am prepared to take. Of course, you may decide for yourself what you like to do bro.

With inhaling alcohol - nobody yet completely understands the long term and/or cumulative effects of inhaling alcohol. I have not been able to find scholarly studies concerning the direct inhalation of superheated alcohol (alcohol vaporists tend to use pressure/pumps to vaporize and inhale their alcohol - not heat and oxygen which changes every chemical it comes into contact with in ways that are both to some extent known and unknown!). Dabbing a residual solvent filled oil long term could lead to your inhaling ethanol (a known carcinogen!!!!!), ethylene (an asphyxiant) and more. As a medical user, this is no bueno. As a vaporist who quit smoking for health reasons - this is also self-defeating. Again, it is for you to decide if you mind inhaling alcohol and byproducts of it's oxidation/decomposition of course. As for me, I'll only use solvents for dabmaking when I can be sure that the solvent is gone.

Still, I am sure that we could make this setup work in a way that will allow full purge and collection. It will be a matter of the right tool, or replacing the stock boiling vessel/dish. What metal is that dish made of btw?



I agree with you here my friend, this would be fantastic for tinctures and edibles! I do think that we could yet figure out a way to make this workable as a standalone shatter solution with some thought and some minor modifications! The crucial starting point is determining if this is inductive or conductive heat we are dealing with. The second would be to see what the metal vessel that comes with the unit is made out of.

For example, a titanium shovel tool with a long handle could be great for scraping this dish! You would just want to be sure that the metal dish was much harder than ti though, and that you were careful not to scrape metal shavings off as you collect. Another possibility as I mention above would be to replace the vessel with something else.

I'm fascinated to see what can be done here! If we can overcome this issue and get pressure measurement - sign me up!

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herbivore21 said:

Cheers for the info. I'd be interested to find out about the pressure question and whether a solution is in the pipeline to measure pressure.

Does this unit use inductive heating per chance? Is it possible to simply switch to a more appropriately shaped glass dish in the source instead of the SS bowl for the scraping?

Also everything behaves differently in a vacuum, remember that when the pressure changes you cannot be sure anymore that you have a chamber whose conditions are safe to put anything in. I don't trust anything that isn't borosilicate and my meds inside a vac chamber. An ounce of prevention is worth quarter of an ounce of unspoiled meds for me!

I have seen silicone delaminate and stick to full melt (solventless resin), let alone solvent based concentrates with residuals (with which I've seen all kinds of weird behaviour with over time when stored in silicone containers, even when fully purged - I fully abandoned silicone container for concentrate storage or processing over a year ago).

When you have a bunch of ethanol in the mix as well as probably more terps than traditional heat purging would leave, you have an atomsphere full of hydrocarbon vapors around your silicone (a polymer rated only to be used in specific scenarios - food grade does not imply safety for use in a vacuum, nor does food grade have any bearing at all on the superheating and inhalation of a substance where ethanol is concerned).

Let me explain what I mean when I mention hydrocarbons since it is true that ethanol has a hydroxyl group and is hence not a hydrocarbon. When ethanol is superheated, it is known to release ethylene (a hydrocarbon and asphyxiant) and h2o. I have posted scholarly articles to this effect on FC before.

Of course, ethanol itself is a carcinogen and a solvent and will dehydrate your airways in enough concentration whether from too much residual in one dab, or cumulative exposure from small amounts of residual in many dabs. That for me, is beyond the risks that I am prepared to take. Of course, you may decide for yourself what you like to do bro.

With inhaling alcohol - nobody yet completely understands the long term and/or cumulative effects of inhaling alcohol. I have not been able to find scholarly studies concerning the direct inhalation of superheated alcohol (alcohol vaporists tend to use pressure/pumps to vaporize and inhale their alcohol - not heat and oxygen which changes every chemical it comes into contact with in ways that are both to some extent known and unknown!). Dabbing a residual solvent filled oil long term could lead to your inhaling ethanol (a known carcinogen!!!!!), ethylene (an asphyxiant) and more. As a medical user, this is no bueno. As a vaporist who quit smoking for health reasons - this is also self-defeating. Again, it is for you to decide if you mind inhaling alcohol and byproducts of it's oxidation/decomposition of course. As for me, I'll only use solvents for dabmaking when I can be sure that the solvent is gone.

Still, I am sure that we could make this setup work in a way that will allow full purge and collection. It will be a matter of the right tool, or replacing the stock boiling vessel/dish. What metal is that dish made of btw?



I agree with you here my friend, this would be fantastic for tinctures and edibles! I do think that we could yet figure out a way to make this workable as a standalone shatter solution with some thought and some minor modifications! The crucial starting point is determining if this is inductive or conductive heat we are dealing with. The second would be to see what the metal vessel that comes with the unit is made out of.

For example, a titanium shovel tool with a long handle could be great for scraping this dish! You would just want to be sure that the metal dish was much harder than ti though, and that you were careful not to scrape metal shavings off as you collect. Another possibility as I mention above would be to replace the vessel with something else.

I'm fascinated to see what can be done here! If we can overcome this issue and get pressure measurement - sign me up!

Click to expand...

IchiBanCrafter said:

I get what you are saying and we agree on some things and differ on interpretation on others (which is fine). I am not writing to fight and bore people but wanted to share my thoughts here.

First, I inquired about the vacuum level, they reported the vacuum runs between 15-18 kPa. This is consistent with keeping the ethanol boiling point around 100-105f. My machines are boiling/evaporating between 102-104f as measured by a thermometer left inside the cup during the process.

Your point about some silicone being unsuitable and of inferior quality is dependent on what product you are using. Silicones encompass a wide range of chemistries from China cheap to very well designed. Some are not as compatible with solvents like acetones or methyl ethyl ketones. Properly cured silicones are highly resistant to alcohols and plant phenolics, paraffins, and aromatic hydrocarbons like turpenes. Acetoxy cure silicones in particular are of low toxicity and associated with food-grade formulations. Coincidentally, acetoxy cure silicones are well-represented on the NASA low outgassing list. Their safety in a vacuum is not in question, and any curing outgassing is in the form of acetic acid, as found in vinegar, house italian salad dressing, and snack food flavorings. A partial vacuum in contact with ethanol, turpene, phenolic, and paraffinic vapors does not present a novel environment where reactions can occur with greater kinetics than at a similar temperature at sea level pressure. In fact, the reaction kinetics point in the other direction where pressure is reduced when comparing reactions like this at similar temperatures.

I think your concern about ethanol releasing ethylene may not be entirely spelled out. First, if there were any ethanol remaining in a well purged final product it would be nearly undetectable even on a per millions scale. More importantly, for the ethanol to transform to ethylene it would need to be heated to a dab nail temperature, under pressure of nearly 30-40 times atmospheric pressure in the presence of a non-existent catalyst. The chances of this are obviously negligible. Lastly, Ethylene gas is widely used to ripen vegetables and is produced from the pyrolysis of pretty much anything- barbeques, roasting a turkey in the oven, making toast, etc.

While I mentioned pyrolysis, and you mentioned the want of ‘unspoiled meds’, please keep in mind pyrolysis (dabbing) of any decomposition of the phenols, turpenes, and paraffins in the pyrolysis of plant extract (cannabis) yields significantly greater chemical exposure compared to alcohol vapor. Most gasses are asphyxiants, including the nitrogen that comprises, on average, about 78% of the air we breathe. The dabber is still left with the more troubling furans, phenols, aminated hydrocarbons, dioxins, nitrous oxides, cyanides, etc. Pyrolysis of these kinds of mixtures produces toxins. The risks from ethanol (becoming ethylene or ethylene oxide) are relatively small. The toxic compounds from dabbing vs using a low temperature vaporizer can be found here:

http://www.maps.org/research-archive/mmj/vaporizerstudy4.15.03.pdf

Anyway, we could go back and forth over this forever. I agree with you that we need to be ultimately careful with what we ingest, strive for the cleanest meds we can make, and make good decisions based on our science.

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koclem said:

a few posts back @IchiBanCrafter seemed relatively clueless about the internals and had no idea how hot his source was running (140F) and now he is a chemist and his source no longer runs at 140F !?!?!?!?

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IchiBanCrafter said:

That is quite aggressive and nasty but it's ok. A year ago I was very clueless when I took this on as a hobby. I was unsure of the health risks like what has been pointed out here on this thread. I am no chemesit nor a scientist but have access to many whom I constantly ply for information and direction to insure I have the most accurate information possible. Quite simply koclem it's called learning and contributing positively to the community.

On the temperature of the two units I am using. They were running hot around 140 or higher so I returned them and got new ones that have been running at a solid 100-105. If you would like to know the improvements please contact them for details.

Hopefully this allows you to participate with positive discourse in the future.

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koclem said:

hey man I am not trying to insult you but considering your admitted close relationship with the manufacturer, near identical website name as the reseller that went out of business and sudden expertise in chemistry something just doesnt make sense here

and you never mentioned you got a new unit and you are measuring teh temperature differently than you were before

also you say a year ago you were clueless about the inner working of the source? a few weeks ago you were too by reading your posts

you are seriously going to have me believe you wrote the following paragraphs? you are an expert now?


"
Your point about some silicone being unsuitable and of inferior quality is dependent on what product you are using. Silicones encompass a wide range of chemistries from China cheap to very well designed. Some are not as compatible with solvents like acetones or methyl ethyl ketones. Properly cured silicones are highly resistant to alcohols and plant phenolics, paraffins, and aromatic hydrocarbons like turpenes. Acetoxy cure silicones in particular are of low toxicity and associated with food-grade formulations. Coincidentally, acetoxy cure silicones are well-represented on the NASA low outgassing list. Their safety in a vacuum is not in question, and any curing outgassing is in the form of acetic acid, as found in vinegar, house italian salad dressing, and snack food flavorings. A partial vacuum in contact with ethanol, turpene, phenolic, and paraffinic vapors does not present a novel environment where reactions can occur with greater kinetics than at a similar temperature at sea level pressure. In fact, the reaction kinetics point in the other direction where pressure is reduced when comparing reactions like this at similar temperatures.

I think your concern about ethanol releasing ethylene may not be entirely spelled out. First, if there were any ethanol remaining in a well purged final product it would be nearly undetectable even on a per millions scale. More importantly, for the ethanol to transform to ethylene it would need to be heated to a dab nail temperature, under pressure of nearly 30-40 times atmospheric pressure in the presence of a non-existent catalyst. The chances of this are obviously negligible. Lastly, Ethylene gas is widely used to ripen vegetables and is produced from the pyrolysis of pretty much anything- barbeques, roasting a turkey in the oven, making toast, etc.

While I mentioned pyrolysis, and you mentioned the want of ‘unspoiled meds’, please keep in mind pyrolysis (dabbing) of any decomposition of the phenols, turpenes, and paraffins in the pyrolysis of plant extract (cannabis) yields significantly greater chemical exposure compared to alcohol vapor. Most gasses are asphyxiants, including the nitrogen that comprises, on average, about 78% of the air we breathe. The dabber is still left with the more troubling furans, phenols, aminated hydrocarbons, dioxins, nitrous oxides, cyanides, etc. Pyrolysis of these kinds of mixtures produces toxins. The risks from ethanol (becoming ethylene or ethylene oxide) are relatively small. The toxic compounds from dabbing vs using a low temperature vaporizer can be found here:
"

I have no problem with you quoting other sources but you are passing this off as if you are the expert and author and that is what I am questioning

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IchiBanCrafter said:

It is silly that I have to defend myself but I will because I have some extra time this morning.

The reseller was a reseller and went out of of business, I think they relaunched under a new name selling vape pens and such. I'm not sure how my blog posts which are simply sharing of the processes I have been working on equates to a reseller. I use wordpress which is pretty standard.

Like I said, I am no expert in chemistry but I have access to scientists to whom this stuff is elementary and they explain it very clearly, give me resources, and direction for me to figure it out. I have advanced degrees in other areas so studying and writing is something I have done for some time. I absolutely wrote my post using the input and reference to my friends' replies. Did I write it, yes. Is my knowledge much deeper than than, no. I am learning with every question and post and quite happy with my progress.

If you look back just a couple posts I absolutely informed the group that my new units were delivered and were working accordingly.

Now, I hope we can move on.

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koclem said:

ok fair enough but I would love to hear what @herbivore21 has to say about the inner globe's metal base being attached to the glass housing with a thick ring of what appears to be household silicone of unknown origin that comes into direct contact with the reclaimed ethanol for the duration of the extraction

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IchiBanCrafter said:

I get what you are saying and we agree on some things and differ on interpretation on others (which is fine). I am not writing to fight and bore people but wanted to share my thoughts here.

First, I inquired about the vacuum level, they reported the vacuum runs between 15-18 kPa. This is consistent with keeping the ethanol boiling point around 100-105f. My machines are boiling/evaporating between 102-104f as measured by a thermometer left inside the cup during the process.

Your point about some silicone being unsuitable and of inferior quality is dependent on what product you are using. Silicones encompass a wide range of chemistries from China cheap to very well designed. Some are not as compatible with solvents like acetones or methyl ethyl ketones. Properly cured silicones are highly resistant to alcohols and plant phenolics, paraffins, and aromatic hydrocarbons like turpenes. Acetoxy cure silicones in particular are of low toxicity and associated with food-grade formulations. Coincidentally, acetoxy cure silicones are well-represented on the NASA low outgassing list. Their safety in a vacuum is not in question, and any curing outgassing is in the form of acetic acid, as found in vinegar, house italian salad dressing, and snack food flavorings. A partial vacuum in contact with ethanol, turpene, phenolic, and paraffinic vapors does not present a novel environment where reactions can occur with greater kinetics than at a similar temperature at sea level pressure. In fact, the reaction kinetics point in the other direction where pressure is reduced when comparing reactions like this at similar temperatures.

I think your concern about ethanol releasing ethylene may not be entirely spelled out. First, if there were any ethanol remaining in a well purged final product it would be nearly undetectable even on a per millions scale. More importantly, for the ethanol to transform to ethylene it would need to be heated to a dab nail temperature, under pressure of nearly 30-40 times atmospheric pressure in the presence of a non-existent catalyst. The chances of this are obviously negligible. Lastly, Ethylene gas is widely used to ripen vegetables and is produced from the pyrolysis of pretty much anything- barbeques, roasting a turkey in the oven, making toast, etc.

While I mentioned pyrolysis, and you mentioned the want of ‘unspoiled meds’, please keep in mind pyrolysis (dabbing) of any decomposition of the phenols, turpenes, and paraffins in the pyrolysis of plant extract (cannabis) yields significantly greater chemical exposure compared to alcohol vapor. Most gasses are asphyxiants, including the nitrogen that comprises, on average, about 78% of the air we breathe. The dabber is still left with the more troubling furans, phenols, aminated hydrocarbons, dioxins, nitrous oxides, cyanides, etc. Pyrolysis of these kinds of mixtures produces toxins. The risks from ethanol (becoming ethylene or ethylene oxide) are relatively small. The toxic compounds from dabbing vs using a low temperature vaporizer can be found here:

http://www.maps.org/research-archive/mmj/vaporizerstudy4.15.03.pdf

Anyway, we could go back and forth over this forever. I agree with you that we need to be ultimately careful with what we ingest, strive for the cleanest meds we can make, and make good decisions based on our science.

Click to expand...

herbivore21 said:

Hmmmm, I've watched this thread for a while even with my recent hiatus, but no pressure gauge nor objective measurement of vacuum pressure is provided with this product, which really limits it for my needs.

Also, I died inside a little bit watching that dude in the video put a cheap silicone container full of ISO/earl solution into a vacuum of unknown pressure. Please guys, don't put silicone in a vacuum like that unless you know exactly how that particular silicone polymer will behave in contact with such a complex mixture of solvents (both iso and terps).

Without a proper chamber pressure measurement (not a % of maximum pressure for that particular pump, which is subjective and is not useful for calculating whether you have got ideal conditions for purge or not) - there really isn't a way that you can be sure how that silicone will behave in there, not even with access to the scholarly literature on the topic (which will still require that you can measure the conditions within the chamber).

This does leave us with one other curious point though - Just what did the manufacturer expect the user will do to collect their earl from that metal dish? That dish has a narrower base than any of the glassware I use, with very high edges. It looks like scraping would be tough! You'd need a long tool and a lot of diligence (no pun intended)!

Have any of you guys who have one had any problems with this?

Of course, the oil in that video came out terrible. To be fair, I am sure this is to do with technique though - it looks like he ground up that bud and used ISO. This is gonna reliably give you not so great tasting black slop unless the iso barely makes contact with the bud.

I do think with better wash technique and the right tool to scrape that dish, that this could be used with great success for those wanting to make their own decent solvent extracts though.

If you have access to testing facilities, I'd still get my earlier batches tested for residual solvents until you can be sure you've dialled in the purge to remove all of the alcohol reliably. Peace of mind is a wonderful thing!

Do not rely on recovering the same volume of fluid from the purge as what you put in. This fluid may or may not contain fractions boiled out from the cannabis resin which may pad out the volume of recovered solvent and lead you to believe that all of the alcohol is out of the extract.

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IchiBanCrafter said:

I owe you a big thank you. You got me thinking of different options for the final stages and you idea of glass paid off well for me. I have glass blowing friends and they made a cool flat bottom, beveled edge cup to fit inside the collector cup on the Source. I can reduce it down almost entirely in the glass cup then off to the vac. I would like to show photos but can't see how to here...... Anyway, thanks for broadening my horizons

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herbivore21 said:

It is a great pleasure to have been of assistance sir! I suggest uploading your photos to imgur.com

Once you have the image uploaded, share the URL here It would be wonderful to see the solution you have had made! I wonder if some of our friends in here might like the same if it is an option to make more of them?

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IchiBanCrafter said:

Ok, I think I figured it out.

photo of the simple glass vessel: http://imgur.com/Lm0KJp0

photo of vessel in the Source cup evaporating/purging: http://imgur.com/1ztWJ63

I know the earl looks pretty dark, which it is, but not green. My current project is to make good (or acceptable anyway) shatter from medium/low quality trim. If I were working with flower we would have a better color (I hope.....)

I think my friends would be happy to make them, even custom to order, but it might get a little expensive.

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herbivore21 said:

Fascinating and looking very nice! BTW what are those x's on the glass? We should expect that custom small unit quantity glass orders will be expensive but I am sure folks here will be glad to hear that this option is available!

Also no sweat on the dark solution in the dish - large quantities of concentrate mixed in low quantities of solvent will often look dark even when the shatter comes out relatively pale. Trim that has not been impeccably stored will reliably give us solutions and extracts that will always look darker and taste grassier even when using solventless techniques (and I should know!) - let alone solvent extracts where heat needs to be used in processing.

If you were working with high quality flower you should certainly expect paler coloring, if for some reason flower extracts ever turned out dark or green, try reducing wash time.

Most importantly though - keep on running that trim! - IMHO a wise man always spends his free time thinking on how to make the most of shake and trim The best gains are always made turning waste byproducts into decent meds!

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Monsoon said:

It's working but it's slow going. The temps have been creeping up to between 120F and 130F (might be partially due to the heatwave here) so I've been cycling it on and off to try to keep the temps from getting too high for too long. I've got a thermometer inside so I'll turn it off once it pases 120f. Even if I leave it on for the 2-hour cycle, it's not getting close to being done in that amount of time. It's maybe closer to a 12 hours to evaporate a full container if you keep a close eye on it and change the ice frequently. I think these issues can be addressed via the app by increasing the max runtime from two hours and some kind of customizable schedule to cycle the heater on and off so it can be left mostly unattended (ice on top still needs to be changed for max efficiency). I'm also going to hunt around for close fitting glass container to place inside the unit to try to decrease the temp a bit.

Emptying the alcohol after is a bit of a pain since it falls out the middle too, pouring it out quickly into a large bowl seems to minimize the losses. It's also crazy loud when the compressor is running, louder than both my coffee grinder and vac pump. However it only needs to run for a minute initially and than a 2 second spurt every now and then.

Despite the issues, in the end I got back nearly a liter of alcohol and have so far saved about $50. This is one of the main reasons I got it so in that regard I'm happy with it. Another big reason was to contain the alcohol fumes which it also accomplished. The other stuff will hopefully be improved over time.

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herbivore21 said:

Hmmm, I really want to know how temp control is managed in the electronics of this unit. Do they use a thermostat to detect the temperature that it is operating at? Is the thermostat calibrated and heater controller competent to achieve minimal fluctuations in temp? If not, we might see broad temp variation indeed!

Also I know that some thermostats used in household devices often measure temps from a less than ideal position in the unit, or with other factors leading to an inaccurate reading (such a thermostat might lead to the temp being consistently found to be a few degrees out one way or another). This can mean the temp the thermostat's thermometer is detecting is actually cooler, or hotter than the temp in the chamber itself. In this case, turning down the set temp to something lower than what you are going for will help you if you are getting chamber temps too high. The opposite if you get chamber temps too low of course.

Reading the manual for the source I can see that the app allows you to set a temperature. Which temperature are you dialling in on the app to get temps rising to 120-130f bro?

Remember the chamber is glass and will be prone to getting hotter in higher ambient temps, or situations where the unit is close to heat or light sources. The manual even warns that sunlight can be an issue here so make sure there's no window or similar nearby. If the thermocouple (thermometer) attached to the thermostat is measuring temps somewhere internally that is not likely to pick up on ambient heat, that could be why you are getting too much heat (as you say, there's a heatwave where you are atm).

This is a fascinating unit. I do wonder though, if 2 hours is the max time the unit can be left on, it really is not made for unattended processing is it? No tincture/solution is likely to be completely purged in that kind of timeframe!

I sure hope we can get to the bottom of this, if this unit can be dialled in just that little bit more, it really stands to do a lot of good for a lot of people!

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herbivore21 said:

Hmmm, I really want to know how temp control is managed in the electronics of this unit. Do they use a thermostat to detect the temperature that it is operating at? Is the thermostat calibrated and heater controller competent to achieve minimal fluctuations in temp? If not, we might see broad temp variation indeed!

Also I know that some thermostats used in household devices often measure temps from a less than ideal position in the unit, or with other factors leading to an inaccurate reading (such a thermostat might lead to the temp being consistently found to be a few degrees out one way or another). This can mean the temp the thermostat's thermometer is detecting is actually cooler, or hotter than the temp in the chamber itself. In this case, turning down the set temp to something lower than what you are going for will help you if you are getting chamber temps too high. The opposite if you get chamber temps too low of course.

Reading the manual for the source I can see that the app allows you to set a temperature. Which temperature are you dialling in on the app to get temps rising to 120-130f bro?

Remember the chamber is glass and will be prone to getting hotter in higher ambient temps, or situations where the unit is close to heat or light sources. The manual even warns that sunlight can be an issue here so make sure there's no window or similar nearby. If the thermocouple (thermometer) attached to the thermostat is measuring temps somewhere internally that is not likely to pick up on ambient heat, that could be why you are getting too much heat (as you say, there's a heatwave where you are atm).

This is a fascinating unit. I do wonder though, if 2 hours is the max time the unit can be left on, it really is not made for unattended processing is it? No tincture/solution is likely to be completely purged in that kind of timeframe!

I sure hope we can get to the bottom of this, if this unit can be dialled in just that little bit more, it really stands to do a lot of good for a lot of people!

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Monsoon said:

Yeah it could be environmental to a degree, I'll have to do more testing with pure ethanol which I'm not worried about overcooking. The app has been a bit buggy when turning it on and off a lot so I usually used the physical button on the machine which might be 105F, not sure. I don't know how it's laid out internally but I think the closest they can get the thermocouple is in the threaded base that the metal container screws into. I'm using a candy thermometer for lack of better options with the end touching the bottom edge of the container and I'm assuming it's reading a max temp so the rest of the solution may be lower.

I'm evaporating the last bit in the chamber now, from the smells of it terp loss was minimal and I wasn't super diligent about keeping the temps low throughout.

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IchiBanCrafter said:

I stopped using the app until its fixed. Sometimes shuts the machine off without knowing it when bluetooth reconnects after being away from the machine. I just use the button and the manual said that give a factory default of 105f and 120 minutes. Anyway, good luck, bed time for me!

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IchiBanCrafter said:

Im pretty fascinated. My units are running around 105f on the highest stetting and doing about 3oz per hour, but when put on the lowest temp setting hovers around 100f and takes twice as long. I haven't seen my new units break 105f even one time unless it goes dry and even then it takes quite a while for the temperature to rise. I just don't understand the difference. I calibrated my therms so I know they are right. Ill be interested to find out what the difference is.

I was told the 2-hour time constraint was built in as a safety element.

As far as the temperature control goes, I don't completely understand it because I'm not a mechanical engineer, they said the temp control doesnt actually control the heat but it controls the pressure, which in turn results in the desired target temperature. I don't know if that pieces anything together or not.

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Monsoon said:

Yeah it could be environmental to a degree, I'll have to do more testing with pure ethanol which I'm not worried about overcooking. The app has been a bit buggy when turning it on and off a lot so I usually used the physical button on the machine which might be 105F, not sure. I don't know how it's laid out internally but I think the closest they can get the thermocouple is in the threaded base that the metal container screws into. I'm using a candy thermometer for lack of better options with the end touching the bottom edge of the container and I'm assuming it's reading a max temp so the rest of the solution may be lower.

I'm evaporating the last bit in the chamber now, from the smells of it terp loss was minimal and I wasn't super diligent about keeping the temps low throughout.

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IchiBanCrafter said:

I stopped using the app until its fixed. Sometimes shuts the machine off without knowing it when bluetooth reconnects after being away from the machine. I just use the button and the manual said that give a factory default of 105f and 120 minutes. Anyway, good luck, bed time for me!

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herbivore21 said:

Can the heater be powered on without using the vac? I would be interested to see what temp is maintained by the hotplate when there is no vacuum being applied! Please do let me know what you find if this can be done

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