RBT Open Source build

[rz]

Well yes you could add all that complexity and do it. Or... you could pop them in a dedicated charger, pop some freshly charged cells on the mod and be on your way.

I tend to avoid unnecessary complexity. Less to go wrong.

Maybe. Specially with single battery mods with slower charging and the only way to get going again is to be prepared with some fresh ones.

My guess is that a good 2x ~3000mAH will last most people a few days and almost everyone at least a day. USB chargers are everywhere already, and with a charge rate of ~1A, it shouldn't take much time to get operable even from a depleted pack. With a bit of engineering (we gotta do something, right?), we can avoid the unnecessary complexity of being bound to special external chargers and continuously opening/closing your vape + mechanical contact stresses, battery sleeve wear and tear..

If we're looking for a minimal complexity circuit, we can try think up some under-voltage + fuse circuit, like some zener + mosfet + polyfuse set up.. imho this should be part of a bare minimum DIY scheme if not using a BMS.

 

[oddjobold]

@oddjobold Battery and heater wiring looks good. The wire from just above B- (where a GND post is on the board) to the GND on the top left is not really necessary as these points are connected internally on the board.

These DNA boards look pretty cool. They have a load of useful features, including reverse battery protection, and seem pretty straight forward to wire up. I think it'd be a cool project that almost anyone could build with the right kind of kit and instructions with basic electronic tools.

A cheaper method with fewer features which seems to be used already are the integrated DC/DC modules.

Here's a kit to get an idea (this ones sold out, but I'm sure others exist..)
https://shop.findmyvapes.com/products/diy-okl-t20-box-mod-kit

and a build video (not by me):

If anyone wants to get started with builds like these and I'll do what I can to help with electronics.

There are some features lacking from that module, like a built in USB charger. It may be feasible to build a ~minimalistic motherboard for that module, with just a few extra features. This is something I could maybe get around to but no idea by when. I'll be getting myself an assortment of modules to play with in the meanwhile

Thanks for the tips on wiring.

As @RastaBuddhaTao is so kindly providing the parts, i dont mind spending out on an expensive board

Besides Milaana with colour screen

 

[Boden]

Maybe. Specially with single battery mods with slower charging and the only way to get going again is to be prepared with some fresh ones.

My guess is that a good 2x ~3000mAH will last most people a few days and almost everyone at least a day. USB chargers are everywhere already, and with a charge rate of ~1A, it shouldn't take much time to get operable even from a depleted pack. With a bit of engineering (we gotta do something, right?), we can avoid the unnecessary complexity of being bound to special external chargers and continuously opening/closing your vape + mechanical contact stresses, battery sleeve wear and tear..

If we're looking for a minimal complexity circuit, we can try think up some under-voltage + fuse circuit, like some zener + mosfet + polyfuse set up.. imho this should be part of a bare minimum DIY scheme if not using a BMS.

Agreed. Since we are making these to suit ourselves we can make them however we want.

I don’t worry about undervoltage in unregulated builds as it’s pretty obvious when a cell is sagging below 2.5V. Over current self resetting fuse is best practice in mod-making for good reason. Would definitely be a good addition to a kit.

 

[RastaBuddhaTao]

Thanks for the tips on wiring.

As @RastaBuddhaTao is so kindly providing the parts, i dont mind spending out on an expensive board

Besides Milaana with colour screen

Hell yeh bro! @Saltysusej69 could print you a bottom cover / DNA cover? This would be fast and wouldn't require intricate machining. Either way that's an engenious design in that you can use the button hole to run the wires through. I might have a square body and can make an extended bottom plate for you. This would leave the front bezel and final finishing. Cool to think about a DNA powered Mi!

@Boden it's cool to see all of you put your own spin on your design plans. I think I looked for a 15 Amp resetting fuse once and struck out. One for the kit would be great even if it was just used for the R&D.

I have some repairs to do over the next few days but will work to get kits sent out by Friday.

 

[Boden]

Hell yeh bro! @Saltysusej69 could print you a bottom cover / DNA cover? This would be fast and wouldn't require intricate machining. Either way that's an engenious design in that you can use the button hole to run the wires through. I might have a square body and can make an extended bottom plate for you. This would leave the front bezel and final finishing. Cool to think about a DNA powered Mi!

@Boden it's cool to see all of you put your own spin on your design plans. I think I looked for a 15 Amp resetting fuse once and struck out. One for the kit would be great even if it was just used for the R&D.

I have some repairs to do over the next few days but will work to get kits sent out by Friday.

https://www.mouser.com/Circuit-Protection/Resettable-Fuses-PPTC/_/N-bm931?P=1z0z63xZ1yzuv0zZ1z0x5xs

Bit of educational for those interested
ftp://ftp.jameco.com/Archive/Current-TechDocuments/199996.pdf

______________________________

Bit of info about me. I am an aspie (Asperger’s syndrome) if/when I respond to you, read it like Spock wrote it.

I do not understand emotional responses in a discussion
Sometimes I envoke emotional response because of my bluntness. I have no idea how to react to this. I generally just become confused.

If I write something that seems abrasive I can assure you that it was meant to be taken literally. If I say “I wouldn’t do that” I’m not judging what you do, I don’t care what you do as long as you are not hurting others. I quite literally mean ‘I would not do that’.

I never think what I say is the only answer.


So if I respond in a way that makes you feel cranky

please understand I don’t mean to.

 

[oddjobold]

Hell yeh bro! @Saltysusej69 could print you a bottom cover / DNA cover? This would be fast and wouldn't require intricate machining. Either way that's an engenious design in that you can use the button hole to run the wires through. I might have a square body and can make an extended bottom plate for you. This would leave the front bezel and final finishing. Cool to think about a DNA powered Mi!

@Boden it's cool to see all of you put your own spin on your design plans. I think I looked for a 15 Amp resetting fuse once and struck out. One for the kit would be great even if it was just used for the R&D.

I have some repairs to do over the next few days but will work to get kits sent out by Friday.

A square body and extended bottom would work for me. Ill sort out the front bezel. Might wait till i get the parts to see whats best for that.

This thing will definatly get built - but i am not sure how long it will take till i can fit it in. Is that an issue @RastaBuddhaTao?

Edit: i am liking the idea of a 3d printed front bezel. This could be used by others wanting to replicate what i have done and would be in the spirit of open source!

Can 3D printed parts be drilled, sanded like wood?

 

[RastaBuddhaTao]

@Boden I have been known to be a bit of a dick at times in the past. No worries as people here tend to be opinionated but yield to data. Spirited debate is good

@oddjobold there isn't any obligation with the kits but there might be a little competition to keep things interesting... details forth coming.

 

[vapen00b]

https://www.mouser.com/Circuit-Protection/Resettable-Fuses-PPTC/_/N-bm931?P=1z0z63xZ1yzuv0zZ1z0x5xs

Bit of educational for those interested
ftp://ftp.jameco.com/Archive/Current-TechDocuments/199996.pdf

______________________________

Bit of info about me. I am an aspie (Asperger’s syndrome) if/when I respond to you, read it like Spock wrote it.

I do not understand emotional responses in a discussion
Sometimes I envoke emotional response because of my bluntness. I have no idea how to react to this. I generally just become confused.

If I write something that seems abrasive I can assure you that it was meant to be taken literally. If I say “I wouldn’t do that” I’m not judging what you do, I don’t care what you do as long as you are not hurting others. I quite literally mean ‘I would not do that’.

I never think what I say is the only answer.


So if I respond in a way that makes you feel cranky

please understand I don’t mean to.

Thank you, Boden!
Great to have you here. I like reading your posts and appreciate your info and openness.

Can't contribute to the matters being discussed here - but wanted to say thank you to you and everyone involved. A bit OT but I think it makes sense

 

[KanehBosem]

Hello RBT Open Source build!!!

 

[Lazy Lighting]

Thanks @Stu that sounds perfect!

Wow @rz !!! I am a mechanical engineer but ran hardware and firmware teams in India so I know enough to be dangerous lol. Everything you said seems sound to me but someone like @KeroZen or other electrically minded people should take a look.

Hopefully someone will take a 555 timer and make a simple adjustable PWM board as it might be small enough to fit into the Milaana electronics cavity. Dave at Mist and I have discussed it in the past. Or the poor man's version, a voltage regulator to set constant current. This is super inefficient at the regulator "burns off" the peak to get to constant voltage. Could work with a two battery set-up?

Other ideas... LED buttons or LED imbedded in the wood such that it lights up the female glass. Did a prototype on 2015 on the early Milaana days. CAUTION: ensure that the buttons are rated for the voltage, current, at required duty cycle / life.

https://m.ebay.com/itm/Mini-12mm-12...h-Button-Switch-For-Car-Boat-US-/162823591348

Have also thought a hole drilled for a stir stick would be cool in Milaana. You could have an o-ring fit so it didn't fall out.

I have a feeling some serious Highdeas are about to drop?

Another great resource for buttons and all things for makers is adafruit. I have been buying all my boards and tools from them for a few years now.

www.adafruit.com

 

[KeroZen]

First of all, thanks to all people who expressed their motivation so far. I'm eager to work with you all on this adventure and I'm sure we'll manage to do wonderful things together. Thanks also to Ryan @RastaBuddhaTao for launching this initiative, it's the way to go man!

While I catch up on everything I missed, I would like all people, and especially those wanting to participate in the design, prototyping and fabrication phases, to fill the following anonymous form. Just use your FC handle and please fill in the skills that you have and what kind of machinery you have access to.

https://doodle.com/poll/kxknrn2pgnqesg94

This will help us share resources and tools, centralize production and assembly etc. It's also a good way to know each others and what we can individually bring to this endeavor. It's also relatively anonymous for those living under prohibition like me, and even more than this forum as the site is at least using HTTPS (sigh!)

If you only like to think about vaporizer shapes and design for instance, just tick the "CAD / design" skill. If you just want to buy a ready-made kit and help testing, tick the "Assembling" skill and eventually "Soldering". If you have easy access to machinery, I tried to detail the common tools and processes that could help us.

If you feel that some skills are missing from this list, please speak fast. I can add them later on but then existing form entries would need to be updated by their respective creators. If anything is not clear, just ask in this thread.

 

[vapen00b]

First of all, thanks to all people who expressed their motivation so far. I'm eager to work with you all on this adventure and I'm sure we'll manage to do wonderful things together. Thanks also to Ryan @RastaBuddhaTao for launching this initiative, it's the way to go man!

While I catch up on everything I missed, I would like all people, and especially those wanting to participate in the design, prototyping and fabrication phases, to fill the following anonymous form. Just use your FC handle and please fill in the skills that you have and what kind of machinery you have access to.

https://doodle.com/poll/kxknrn2pgnqesg94

This will help us share resources and tools, centralize production and assembly etc. It's also a good way to know each others and what we can individually bring to this endeavor. It's also relatively anonymous for those living under prohibition like me, and even more than this forum as the site is at least using HTTPS (sigh!)

If you only like to think about vaporizer shapes and design for instance, just tick the "CAD / design" skill. If you just want to buy a ready-made kit and help testing, tick the "Assembling" skill and eventually "Soldering". If you have easy access to machinery, I tried to detail the common tools and processes that could help us.

If you feel that some skills are missing from this list, please speak fast. I can add them later on but then existing form entries would need to be updated by their respective creators. If anything is not clear, just ask in this thread.

Fantastic, Kero!
Honestly, I couldn't think of anyone better leading this ship as I always value and respect your in-depth knowledge on several fields - even more important when it comes to safety and the like. You know existing RBT tech for years now and been part of the Z-Team. My best blessings and have fun on this endeavor!!! This is gonna be gooooood!


Best of luck and fun to everyone!

 

[RastaBuddhaTao]

Great idea @KeroZen !!! This is embodies the communal Open Source sharing in the video that @Dan Morrison shared on the NM thread. I completed the form and the categories are taylored nicely to the threads needs.

Thanks to all for submitting a contact form. Working to get @KeroZen and the other Master builders their kits this week. Second tier next.

This project is by far exceeding my expectations and I am humbled by the talent showing up. This has the makings to create the vibe of the Z-team in the early days of Zion. A dozen guys having the most fun on FC creating a vaporizer together. I feel that feeling again and the strength in this force just might be stronger... because this time it's many people creating many Vapes. That has to multiply the fun, right?

 

[Gray Area]

My favourite thread on FC

Not enough knowledge/skills to get involved, but I'm keeping a close eye on this one.
Can't wait to see what you lot come up with, and have to say very impressed with this whole approach by RBT

Keep up the good work

 

[Lazy Lighting]

Quick battery question. I noticed that most Vapes use 18560s but the haze squared that is coming out uses a li-ion. Is there reason why most use 18560s? I would think that the slimmer profile would make it used more.

 

[Boden]

Quick battery question. I noticed that most Vapes use 18560s but the haze squared that is coming out uses a li-ion. Is there reason why most use 18560s? I would think that the slimmer profile would make it used more.

18650s are li-ion in a more rugged form than flat cells.

 

[Lazy Lighting]

18650s are li-ion in a more rugged form than flat cells.

Thanks for the info!

 

[Shit Snacks]

This has the makings to create the vibe of the Z-team in the early days of Zion. A dozen guys having the most fun on FC creating a vaporizer together. I feel that feeling again and the strength in this force just might be stronger... because this time it's many people creating many Vapes. That has to multiply the fun, right?

(finally figured out how to fix that lol)

 

[RastaBuddhaTao]

18650s are li-ion in a more rugged form than flat cells.

Agreed... the metal case of the 18650 make em super tough. I believe another big reason is that the e-cig market has made them an inexpensive commodity and consumers don't have to buy a unit with a custom or built-in battery.

However, I do know the Li-Po do have there benefits... maybe energy density or safety? The wrapper and a cardboard ring around the positive terminal makes the 18650 more prone to a short condition that can be catastrophic. Given that the 18650 is inexpensive and readily available it's a good idea to change em out at least once a year imo.

 

[Boden]

Agreed... the metal case of the 18650 make em super tough. I believe another big reason is that the e-cig market has made them an inexpensive commodity and consumers don't have to buy a unit with a custom or built-in battery.

However, I do know the Li-Po do have there benefits... maybe energy density or safety? The wrapper and a cardboard ring around the positive terminal makes the 18650 more prone to a short condition that can be catastrophic. Given that the 18650 is inexpensive and readily available it's a good idea to change em out at least once a year imo.

Because of the construction, a flat li-po can have much higher discharge rates than a cylinder cell. Far higher than we would need.

It’s all about heat within the cell. Flat cells dissipate heat better. The middle of a cylinder can get very hot.

 

[Hogni]

Perhaps a 2070/21700 could also be an alternative? Nearly the same size as a 18650 but much more power.

I would like to see an increased stealth factor. That's currently a notable lack of the appearance of all RBT devices for use in public. The protrusing glass mp is pretty compromitting. Perhaps a short glass mp going up until the end of the enclosure with an integrated fitting for a 510 drip tip for prolonging the air air path to the right lenght? Would it let appear much more as a regular sub-ohm atomizer.

 

[oddjobold]

Got another idea that i am toying with. Looking at a 2nd hand lost vape therion squonk. Already got the 75c DNA board, battery holder and a large space inside the cool looking case where the ejuice tank is.

Take out the ejuice tank, 510 conector in the therion. I could chop the milaana body in two. Discard the battery end. I would then have a milaana heater in a wooden box. Insert into mod box where the 510 ejuice tank was. This would all depend on dimensions.

Any comment?

 

[Other Side]

Got another idea that i am toying with. Looking at a 2nd hand lost vape therion squonk. Already got the 75c DNA board, battery holder and a large space inside the cool looking case where the ejuice tank is.

Take out the ejuice tank, 510 conector in the therion. I could chop the milaana body in two. Discard the battery end. I would then have a milaana heater in a wooden box. Insert into mod box where the 510 ejuice tank was. This would all depend on dimensions.

Any comment?

Interesting idea but you would have to figure in some insulation between the heater and the door otherwise I doubt the plastic could handle the heat.

Edit: oh do you mean taking the heater with the wood around it too?

 

[oddjobold]

Interesting idea but you would have to figure in some insulation between the heater and the door otherwise I doubt the plastic could handle the heat.

Edit: oh do you mean taking the heater with the wood around it too?

Yes thats the idea.

 

[Other Side]

I wonder if you could make it all fit?