Underdog Log Vapes

[formicae]

Well, busted out the NonGs for nightly doubledogputmeinacomapls session and hoooohhh boy. Yep. I forgot less is more and hot damn do these quick, hi temp rips compared to the GonGs get me good.

Long live the NonG. Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but I think they're an Underdog exclusive? Mine fit really well, are quiet (in the tactile sense as well as acoustically) and pretty much indestructible, and are very low-maintenance. They're virtually all I use, except for the occasional thick glass direct draw.

My zebrawood glulam shipped this morning, I can't wait to see it in person and post pics and impressions. Also have a Travel VVPS packed in there.

 

[Stevenski]

The NonG is no joke. The most powerful weapon in my UD arsenal & the only thing better than one is loading 2 & going back to back. They hold the perfect amount for a single big rip. @underdog have you ever done O/S 14mm NonG's or is the NonG just too narrow?

 

[muunch]

the only thing better than one is loading 2 & going back to back.

to quote/paraphrase one of the brilliant minds of the 21st century... "at the same damn time"

you gotta try double doggin my friend. 2 NonGs at once milks my waterpiece wayyy better than 2 GonGs
That higher temp+tighter load makes all the difference!

edit: yep, this is the ticket. thick, tasty vapor from specs. I shoulda been using these NonG for double doggin from the get go.

edit2:

https://www.instagram.com/p/BR04Taoj4jkbOspUbylkaI3d0mKxIXQxIb8GA00/

video of rippage. not the best lighting but oh well. it was a nice hit from my angle don't worry.

 

[underdog]

Damn where'd the weekend go?! I look away for one minute and suddenly it's Sunday??

Long live the NonG. Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but I think they're an Underdog exclusive? Mine fit really well, are quiet (in the tactile sense as well as acoustically) and pretty much indestructible, and are very low-maintenance. They're virtually all I use, except for the occasional thick glass direct draw.

My zebrawood glulam shipped this morning, I can't wait to see it in person and post pics and impressions. Also have a Travel VVPS packed in there.

They're exclusive to us as far as I know. I love all the nylon stems and Nongs.. talk about bullet proof, the things just can't be stopped. I know an unbreakable stem is a must-have for some of our medical users too and we're happy to be able to offer them.

The NonG is no joke. The most powerful weapon in my UD arsenal & the only thing better than one is loading 2 & going back to back. They hold the perfect amount for a single big rip. @underdog have you ever done O/S 14mm NonG's or is the NonG just too narrow?

We've played with one-offs and prototypes on a 14mm frame but not on a production scale. It's possible but they're damn close to too narrow, close enough to make it a touchy process.

to quote/paraphrase one of the brilliant minds of the 21st century... "at the same damn time"

you gotta try double doggin my friend. 2 NonGs at once milks my waterpiece wayyy better than 2 GonGs
That higher temp+tighter load makes all the difference!

edit: yep, this is the ticket. thick, tasty vapor from specs. I shoulda been using these NonG for double doggin from the get go.

edit2:

https://www.instagram.com/p/BR04Taoj4jkbOspUbylkaI3d0mKxIXQxIb8GA00/

video of rippage. not the best lighting but oh well. it was a nice hit from my angle don't worry.

Boom! Beast mode!

 

[Stevenski]

you gotta try double doggin my friend. 2 NonGs at once milks my waterpiece wayyy better than 2 GonGs
That higher temp+tighter load makes all the difference!

I have a 14mm claisen already so it will not be a difficult process. Nice vid too

We've played with one-offs and prototypes on a 14mm frame but not on a production scale. It's possible but they're damn close to too narrow, close enough to make it a touchy process.

I dug out my O/S 18mm & figures as much. It would only be a mm or two but a complete pain in the arse to make.

 

[muunch]

I have a 14mm claisen already so it will not be a difficult process. Nice vid too

Thanks! Not the best vid but was something quick, just wanted to show the function but man it rips.


My triple claisen just made it thru customs and my VVPS shipping today so it looks like this week will be a very happy one. I'll have to see if I can get a decent quad-dog video lol

 

[muunch]

Sorry to double post but I don't think it'd properly tag ppl if I just edited.

Was thinking about @Stevenski desire for 14mm OS NonG... Maybe some of the helpful woodworkers here would be able to make a OS WonG? Still unbreakable however the mating the wood to glass can cause "stuck" accidents etc... but this could be a solution?

@Winegums

 

[Winegums]

Sorry to double post but I don't think it'd properly tag ppl if I just edited.

Was thinking about @Stevenski desire for 14mm OS NonG... Maybe some of the helpful woodworkers here would be able to make a OS WonG? Still unbreakable however the mating the wood to glass can cause "stuck" accidents etc... but this could be a solution?

@Winegums

I'm unfamiliar with the underdog vapes. What does OS mean?

Glass and wood don't play nice unless they're both machined and ground to shape.

 

[muunch]

Oversized = OS

Imagine this, but with wood instead of the nylon. It was just a random idea, not sure how possible it'd be.

http://underdogvapes.com/vape-accessories/vape-stems/nong


These would be for fitting in 14mm ground glass joints. There is currently no oversized NonG stem in 14mm size bc it's too hard to get the nylon that thin without it cracking(?) But wood would work, and still maintain the characteristic of being unbreakable for those who need their accessories to be not breakable...

Has both wet and dry applications. I can't see water+wood being any more of an issue than it is with the vapcap VonGs, so (in my head at least) as long as the wood can be made to fit the wide, SS tip without cracking, I think it'd work

 

[Winegums]

Oversized = OS

Imagine this, but with wood instead of the nylon. It was just a random idea, not sure how possible it'd be.

http://underdogvapes.com/vape-accessories/vape-stems/nong


These would be for fitting in 14mm ground glass joints. There is currently no oversized NonG stem in 14mm size bc it's too hard to get the nylon that thin without it cracking(?) But wood would work, and still maintain the characteristic of being unbreakable for those who need their accessories to be not breakable...

Has both wet and dry applications. I can't see water+wood being any more of an issue than it is with the vapcap VonGs, so (in my head at least) as long as the wood can be made to fit the wide, SS tip without cracking, I think it'd work

I'm fairly certain I could make some WonGs, but I would need to get my hands on the internal stainless tubing. So far my luck selling to the log vape crowds has been really cold, very little response at all from the few inquiry posts I've made. So I'm hesitant to spend time and money on developing another log vape product.

 

[muunch]

I would think underdog could supply you with them, the regular size SS tubes are available on their site.

I'd be interested and I do believe a few others would be as well, but don't let me speak for everyone

edit:

if you made these with a slight little airhole carb you would be a god amongst men.

 

[Prolusio]

I'd buy one!

 

[underdog]

I have a 14mm claisen already so it will not be a difficult process. Nice vid too

I dug out my O/S 18mm & figures as much. It would only be a mm or two but a complete pain in the arse to make.

Yeah they're a PITA to be sure and one of those items that don't sell in high enough volume to be able to run them in big enough batches to be cost effective.

Sorry to double post but I don't think it'd properly tag ppl if I just edited.

Was thinking about @Stevenski desire for 14mm OS NonG... Maybe some of the helpful woodworkers here would be able to make a OS WonG? Still unbreakable however the mating the wood to glass can cause "stuck" accidents etc... but this could be a solution?

@Winegums

We used to make them in house years ago but ran into the same limitations that I just mentioned in my above response to Stevenski and we had a 3rd party we were partnering with that was making them as recently as last year but isn't going to make more from what I understand.

Oversized = OS

Imagine this, but with wood instead of the nylon. It was just a random idea, not sure how possible it'd be.

http://underdogvapes.com/vape-accessories/vape-stems/nong


These would be for fitting in 14mm ground glass joints. There is currently no oversized NonG stem in 14mm size bc it's too hard to get the nylon that thin without it cracking(?) But wood would work, and still maintain the characteristic of being unbreakable for those who need their accessories to be not breakable...

Has both wet and dry applications. I can't see water+wood being any more of an issue than it is with the vapcap VonGs, so (in my head at least) as long as the wood can be made to fit the wide, SS tip without cracking, I think it'd work

It might be counterintuitive but wood is actually a lot harder to use in this regard than the nylon. The nylon will be almost immune to cracking as it will stretch and bend whereas the wood will more easily crack along the grain. The hard part about the nylon is cosmetic, keeping the resulting pieces from looking like crap and all that. With short runs by the time you dial the process in for best results the production run is over so it's just not efficient.

With us it usually comes down to trying to balance our available time with the labor required to accomplish something. If we do slow/inefficient stuff like run those types of items on a regular basis it would cut into our ability to make vapes and we'd end up with a wait list which for me is a deal breaker.

I'm fairly certain I could make some WonGs, but I would need to get my hands on the internal stainless tubing. So far my luck selling to the log vape crowds has been really cold, very little response at all from the few inquiry posts I've made. So I'm hesitant to spend time and money on developing another log vape product.

Hi Winegums, that sucks you haven't had much luck dealing with the Log crowd, sorry to hear it. We're always looking to work with third party partners to make things like this that we're not setup for. We can definitely provide you with the tubing we use for tips just send us a message. If you need/want longer pieces than the tips we can give you the specs and some sources to buy it from.

 

[Winegums]

It might be counterintuitive but wood is actually a lot harder to use in this regard than the nylon. The nylon will be almost immune to cracking as it will stretch and bend whereas the wood will more easily crack along the grain. The hard part about the nylon is cosmetic, keeping the resulting pieces from looking like crap and all that. With short runs by the time you dial the process in for best results the production run is over so it's just not efficient.

Wood has the same challenges as Nylon as far as surface finish goes with the added complexity of grain and variances in hardness depending on direction. So I have to build my WonGs in a certain way with aligned grain and do minimal sanding to avoid making an oval shape. I'm considering moving to an o-ring based seal rather than wood on glass so that I don't have to worry about the wood.

Hi Winegums, that sucks you haven't had much luck dealing with the Log crowd, sorry to hear it. We're always looking to work with third party partners to make things like this that we're not setup for. We can definitely provide you with the tubing we use for tips just send us a message. If you need/want longer pieces than the tips we can give you the specs and some sources to buy it from.

If you let me know the specs I could start drafting some things up and see how I'm going to do things. It would be much appreciated as it seems there is some interest in WonGs. While they won't be "unbreakable" they should survive longer than glass and be a bit of eye candy for sure.

 

[underdog]

Wood has the same challenges as Nylon as far as surface finish goes with the added complexity of grain and variances in hardness depending on direction. So I have to build my WonGs in a certain way with aligned grain and do minimal sanding to avoid making an oval shape. I'm considering moving to an o-ring based seal rather than wood on glass so that I don't have to worry about the wood.

If you let me know the specs I could start drafting some things up and see how I'm going to do things. It would be much appreciated as it seems there is some interest in WonGs. While they won't be "unbreakable" they should survive longer than glass and be a bit of eye candy for sure.

Yeah I definitely remember the similar difficulties of making them in wood when we still did so. I think it's best to leave making WonGs and wooden stems to people who are set up specifically to do that.

Let me know if you need some specific specs, in the meantime I'll give you the basics. The tubing should be 5/16" OD (to fit in the ID of the UD core) with a wall as thin as you can comfortably use - we've used .01" to .02" wall tubing with best results. There should (ideally) be 3/4" stick-out of the tip tubing from the end of the WonG to ensure sufficient vertical clearance. We typically use stainless 304 but most any common grade will work equally well. That's really about it actually.

 

[Winegums]

Yeah I definitely remember the similar difficulties of making them in wood when we still did so. I think it's best to leave making WonGs and wooden stems to people who are set up specifically to do that.

Let me know if you need some specific specs, in the meantime I'll give you the basics. The tubing should be 5/16" OD (to fit in the ID of the UD core) with a wall as thin as you can comfortably use - we've used .01" to .02" wall tubing with best results. There should (ideally) be 3/4" stick-out of the tip tubing from the end of the WonG to ensure sufficient vertical clearance. We typically use stainless 304 but most any common grade will work equally well. That's really about it actually.

Just so I understand how the vape works.
It heats the tube in the bottom which contains the material being vaped and the screen inside of it is friction fit to adjust the bowl size?

I'll send a message about tubing suppliers and tubing.

 

[Diggy Smalls]

I would love to have a straight wooden stem for my UD. I've seen it for another log vape but not for the underdog.
But yeah a WonG made by @Winegums quite be beautiful and not fragile like glass.

I was wanting to by oversized 14mm nong, but opted for the 18mm since it's all they had. It works good for the few 18mm glass pieces I have, but I can't use it at all with most of my pieces

 

[formicae]

I would love to have a straight wooden stem for my UD. I've seen it for another log vape but not for the underdog.

You're in luck :

http://underdogvapes.com/vape-accessories/vape-stems/lacewood-stem
http://underdogvapes.com/vape-accessories/vape-stems/premium-wood-stem

 

[muunch]

It heats the tube in the bottom which contains the material being vaped and the screen inside of it is friction fit to adjust the bowl size?

Essentially, yes. The stems will be used inverted (as the vape is also inverted) on a waterpipe, but they can still be used right-side-up for direct-draw.

Normally the SS tube goes inside of the heater port with NonG, but since we're talking about oversized, the tubing will fit over the port, like GonGs do.

 

[Diggy Smalls]

You're in luck :

http://underdogvapes.com/vape-accessories/vape-stems/lacewood-stem
http://underdogvapes.com/vape-accessories/vape-stems/premium-wood-stem

I mean no ss tip, just wood that fits over the heater port. Not tight fitting.

 

[underdog]

Just so I understand how the vape works.
It heats the tube in the bottom which contains the material being vaped and the screen inside of it is friction fit to adjust the bowl size?

I'll send a message about tubing suppliers and tubing.

Not sure if I understand your understanding but the center tube of the vape (ie, the 'core') holds the heating element and the stem tubes hold the herb. We have two kinds of stems, ones that fit inside the ID of the vape center tube and ones that fit over the OD of that same tube. This core tube is 3/8" OD. Stems that fit inside the ID are what I was referring to that uses 5/16" tubing. Stems that fit over the OD are limited to our glass stems at this point as there isn't an appropriately sized stainless tubing available for that purpose.

Essentially, yes. The stems will be used inverted (as the vape is also inverted) on a waterpipe, but they can still be used right-side-up for direct-draw.

Normally the SS tube goes inside of the heater port with NonG, but since we're talking about oversized, the tubing will fit over the port, like GonGs do.

I was under the impression we were talking about WonGs with a 5/16" tip? If we're talking about ones with a tip that fit over the port then we have a problem with the lack of available tubing per my post above.

 

[muunch]

The WonG was just a thought to maybe have some 14mm OS, unbreakable stems since you mentioned troubles with the nylon breaking and whatnot.

Personally, I'm good on the OS NonGs (I'd prob just use glass if I wanted a bigger bowl but I'm full NonG the past few days) and have no problem with the way the convo went so I just went with it...!

Any WonG sounds amazing as I remember asking about em prior to my first dog purchase

 

[Winegums]

I found the FAQ vids and all my questions have been answered!

Great narration btw, really clear and easy to understand at a good pace.

 

[Stevenski]

Sorry to double post but I don't think it'd properly tag ppl if I just edited.

Was thinking about @Stevenski desire for 14mm OS NonG... Maybe some of the helpful woodworkers here would be able to make a OS WonG? Still unbreakable however the mating the wood to glass can cause "stuck" accidents etc... but this could be a solution?

@Winegums

I only use my one hit NonG's these days really. It was more of a curiosity as I have a 18mm one that never gets used but a 14mm would cover every unbreakable base.

I found the FAQ vids and all my questions have been answered!

Great narration btw, really clear and easy to understand at a good pace.

I was just about to suggest looking at them mate. Very clear & concise.

 

[formicae]

Good news! My new pup made it to Vancouver in almost record time!

...except I'm in Ottawa, some 4000km (2500mi) away, and it looks like the package missed the plane that would have made it in time for delivery this morning. Still, it's impressive that it made it into Canada and through customs in under two business days. With any luck I should have it tomorrow.