Cannabinoid hyperemesis syndrome

[grokit]

It's also about flushing whatever nutrients out before harvest, and curing afterwards. If the weed is not stored properly it gets too much cbn, which has always had horrible effects on me. With hydro it's much easier to flush the nutrients out of the plant, but it's possible with soil as well it just takes longer. Of course with hydro it's even more important to flush, because you're typically not using organic nutrients. Another important issue is if the flowers aren't cured properly, then the thca won't convert properly into thc.

 

[Garysfriend]

Interesting. What are these effects?

 

[Glass004]

Thanks for the reply. Finding different sources is difficult in my location, but I'm working on it. Your absolutely right that the Jamaican stuff was weaker. I actually kind of preferred that. I've never tried dabbing, as it's not really available here and I'm not all that interested in it.

For the chs suffers, in your experience, if you smoke/vape just a little bit (<.1g) do you automatically get stomach pains the next morning?

Yes, just one or two tokes brings on symptoms. For me, it was as if my body became hypersensitive to smoking herb. Vaping causes no problems.

 

[Garysfriend]

Gkass004, and was this stomach pain, nausea, vomiting or all 3? If it's pain can you describe exactly what you feel? Sorry, just want an accurate picture to compare my pain to.

 

[Glass004]

Gkass004, and was this stomach pain, nausea, vomiting or all 3? If it's pain can you describe exactly what you feel? Sorry, just want an accurate picture to compare my pain to.

The only pain I have associated with CHS is right upper quadrant abdominal pain due to gallbladder dysfunction from not eating. It showed up on the day 3 or 4 and lasted for a couple of weeks sometimes.
I start with a "backed up" feeling in my stomach like last night's food not passing. My bowels start to empty. Then nausea. Migraine sometimes wakes me up. After the first vomit, it goes full blown. Sometimes I could abort with sublingual Zofran and try going back to sleep before vomiting
Lately with my body's increased sensitivity to smoking herb, the migraine with nausea are the pre attack symptoms.

 

[grokit]

That sucks! Keep us posted

 

[grokit]

This rarely happens to people that use herb casually so I feel there is hope to get back to normal.

Kinda like me and ice cream

 

[syrupy]

What a strange condition. One thing I don't understand from reading up on it is the warm baths. One article said it's a learned behavior, something compulsively picked up? Just wondering because that part jumped out for some reason.

 

[Baron23]

Update regarding my CHS.

I have found if I do not do a behavior that triggers nausea I do not have a CHS reaction at all. For example shoving a double bacon cheeseburger down my throat Carl's Junior style. If I don't attack Panda express' beijing beef like I have only three minutes to live. All I am saying if I do not induce that feeling of overdoing it leading to nausea I will not have a CHS reaction. I have not had a single episode when I eat small portions at a slow, easy, pace like you should anyway. I hope this can help someone else out or maybe see if anyone else has experienced this with CHS?

Still taking it easy and will be working on a micro dosing regimen. I think this is going to work out just fine now that I have figured out how to avoid a serious CHS reaction. I have came to the conclusion micro-dosing may be the only truly responsible way to use a substance rather than abusing a substance.

This is great news, Steama. Probably for a number of reasons. First, it would appear you have found a solution to your CHS and found a way to continue to use cannabis. Second, not shoving Carl Jr or Panda Express down your throat like you have two a-holes will probably extend your life! LOL

Cheers and congratulations on finding a way...a really healthy way...around the CHS.

 

[syrupy]

Are you still going through with the t-break @steama ..or is it straight ahead to micro-dosing?

 

[OldOyler]

Update regarding my CHS.

I have found if I do not do a behavior that triggers nausea I do not have a CHS reaction at all. For example shoving a double bacon cheeseburger down my throat Carl's Junior style. If I don't attack Panda express' beijing beef like I have only three minutes to live. All I am saying if I do not induce that feeling of overdoing it leading to nausea I will not have a CHS reaction. I have not had a single episode when I eat small portions at a slow, easy, pace like you should anyway. I hope this can help someone else out or maybe see if anyone else has experienced this with CHS?

Still taking it easy and will be working on a micro dosing regimen. I think this is going to work out just fine now that I have figured out how to avoid a serious CHS reaction. I have came to the conclusion micro-dosing may be the only truly responsible way to use a substance rather than abusing a substance.

Yeah careful my friend.

I thought I had CHS when I first started cannabis for pain, for about a year. Turns out the underlying condition - pancreatic cancer - was brought out because *cannabis will always attempt to return pancreas function to normal*.

Pancreas and gall bladder are of course interlocked. So my point is to keep pushing with your doctor if symptoms return, I was lucky to have had a very stubborn Primary Care doc at the time.

My point here is that a CHS diagnosis, even if just a first guess at the problem and ends up not being the case 100%, can still lead someone to another underlying problem. So anything the pancreas affects - diabetes, digestion, etc. could be getting shaken out *by* the cannabinoids.

My first thought after you posted about your Carl's, etc. was a diabetes-type problem or pancreatitis (which meat just kicks off like nobody's business) - both of which center in the pancreas and can be symptoms of a more serious problem.

Peace, good micro-dosing to you, and much healing!

 

[OldOyler]

I cannot thank you enough for this information as I already could be having what you have described. My blood was tested and they found very elevated levels of triglycerides (600+ because of meds). The worry here is this it could lead to pancreatitis (just as you have said).

How do I press my physician to dig deeper into the pancreatitis question? What you have posted got my attention.

Thanks again @OldOyler --- it's possible you could be saving my life. Holy shit.

EDIT: Just check this new info out with family members and they think it is most likely I have what you say it could be. Thanks again.

Peace my friend!

Well, the question will really be "do you continue to have pancreatitis symptoms", specifically around eating.

Remember, something more serious (like cancer) is actually unusual - but pancreatitis is not. I mean, I am the absolute KING of starting with a Carl's burger. Ah, make it two patties. And some raw onions. Then tomatoes and lettuce and ketchup and mayo. Oh, and about 3 strips of salty bacon. Fries and a shake in case I am still hungry...

Then, I am SO high I attempt to eat said burger in under 7 minutes.

Anybody past the age of 25 or so can't handle that!!!

I have had to permanently cut out certain things, and I don't want to suggest anything in particular beyond what I had to cut out myself - anything tomatoes and onions specifically, and only lean beef (like steak or roast) occasionally, mostly chicken or no meat at all any more.

I also take an over-the-counter enzyme (where the cancer was removed at the tip of the pancreas is where a lot of those enzymes are secreted, and not doing it as much any more), again maybe Google it because I don't want to give you anything wrong or incomplete.

Believe me, if you have more than 3-6 months of pancreatitis type symptoms, your doctor (I am in the U.S. here, it is pretty much a worldwide thing though) will absolutely send you to be "scoped out", maybe some other internal tests.

They probably won't let those symptoms go much longer than that *if* they can't identify the source.

The key has been YOU here all along - you have been honest with yourself, honest with others, and have sought to take action. Keep that attitude, and everything will turn out okay even if it is serious. One pancreatitis-looking attack at a time, my friend!

In the style of @ataxian (whose wisdom is sublime, missing O2 his heart and will simply built skybridges over the affected synapses instead)...

OLDOYLER + FOOD JOY = MODERNIZED
FOOD JOY + CALM INDULGENCE = HARMONIZED
CANNABIS AS SERVANT = OLDOYLER'S MOUTH IN CONTROL
CANNABIS AS MASTER = HUFF THAT BURGER + D'OH



Peace and healing, and keep us up to speed on how you are doing!

 

[ataxian]

Peace my friend!

Well, the question will really be "do you continue to have pancreatitis symptoms", specifically around eating.

Remember, something more serious (like cancer) is actually unusual - but pancreatitis is not. I mean, I am the absolute KING of starting with a Carl's burger. Ah, make it two patties. And some raw onions. Then tomatoes and lettuce and ketchup and mayo. Oh, and about 3 strips of salty bacon. Fries and a shake in case I am still hungry...

Then, I am SO high I attempt to eat said burger in under 7 minutes.

Anybody past the age of 25 or so can't handle that!!!

I have had to permanently cut out certain things, and I don't want to suggest anything in particular beyond what I had to cut out myself - anything tomatoes and onions specifically, and only lean beef (like steak or roast) occasionally, mostly chicken or no meat at all any more.

I also take an over-the-counter enzyme (where the cancer was removed at the tip of the pancreas is where a lot of those enzymes are secreted, and not doing it as much any more), again maybe Google it because I don't want to give you anything wrong or incomplete.

Believe me, if you have more than 3-6 months of pancreatitis type symptoms, your doctor (I am in the U.S. here, it is pretty much a worldwide thing though) will absolutely send you to be "scoped out", maybe some other internal tests.

They probably won't let those symptoms go much longer than that *if* they can't identify the source.

The key has been YOU here all along - you have been honest with yourself, honest with others, and have sought to take action. Keep that attitude, and everything will turn out okay even if it is serious. One pancreatitis-looking attack at a time, my friend!

In the style of @ataxian (whose wisdom is sublime, missing O2 his heart and will simply built skybridges over the affected synapses instead)...

OLDOYLER + FOOD JOY = MODERNIZED
FOOD JOY + CALM INDULGENCE = HARMONIZED
CANNABIS AS SERVANT = OLDOYLER'S MOUTH IN CONTROL
CANNABIS AS MASTER = HUFF THAT BURGER + D'OH



Peace and healing, and keep us up to speed on how you are doing!

Under the RADAR as one say's!

NO CLAIM + FINE WINE + TOP SHELF CANNABIS + FEMALE 109 POUNDS 5'9" (FRENCH) =

CIVILIZED

SOUTHERN CA = WAY TOO HOT = DIP NOW

BURGER AFTER GAME CHANGER HYBRID in a clean piece = NORMALIZED

THANK GOODNESS I STILL HAVE A BRAIN! (so I think)?
CANNABIS is the only thing that works? (in my case)!

 

[Pyrocity420]

Briefly looking threw that thread, it appears nausea and vommiting are the main conditions and I only have that during this time that I got sick (like my yearly gastroenteritis). Not throughout the 15 years of pain. Also, when I do go, I do have inflammation I my colon. I'm beginning to think it has nothing to do with what I got. I haven't thrown up since Friday night. And I haven't had a zofran since Tuesday 2am. I don't wake up nauseous.

Just having this intense pain and diarrhea (sorry for being explicit).

Doesn't look like diarrhea is a part of CHS either.

Hey, I get abdominal pain after i smoke and worsens when i eat, I have not thrown up but notice that i get diarrhea too. would vaping help at lower temps? do i have CHS? I would hate to stop using cannabis for ever!

 

[grokit]

Hey, I get abdominal pain after i smoke and worsens when i eat, I have not thrown up but notice that i get diarrhea too. would vaping help at lower temps? do i have CHS? I would hate to stop using cannabis for ever!

Try taking a break from smoking, see if it helps, then introduce vaping and see if it hurts. You'll be rewarded with a lower tolerance in general, and will be able to appreciate the difference between high and stoned.

I did the above, and now I even smoke occasionally to be polite among combustors. But I wouldn't recommend smoking at all for the first year or two, until you've acclimated yourself to vaping.

 

[newVaper420]

Hey, I get abdominal pain after i smoke and worsens when i eat, I have not thrown up but notice that i get diarrhea too. would vaping help at lower temps? do i have CHS? I would hate to stop using cannabis for ever!

Sadly, I'm not a doctor so I can't really give you a definitive diagnosis. I was on a bender with some not so quality wax during that time which probably wasn't purged correctly. That's probably what made me sick, along with my Crohn's disease. If you have no underlying medical reason to use marijuana, then you should give yourself a few days break as suggested above. Once you find yourself feeling better, start to slowly reintroduce and see if you feel worse.

And listen, if marijuana is making you sick, then you shouldn't feel bad about stopping. Another suggestion is maybe you need a different form, edibles, oil, etc.

And just to clarify, my abdominal pain gets incredibly better after I vape. When I eat, I'm in pain then I vape again.

 

[Pyrocity420]

Try taking a break from smoking, see if it helps, then introduce vaping and see if it hurts. You'll be rewarded with a lower tolerance in general, and will be able to appreciate the difference between high and stoned.

I did the above, and now I even smoke occasionally to be polite among combustors. But I wouldn't recommend smoking at all for the first year or two, until you've acclimated yourself to vaping.

So i am not new to vaping I actually just recently bought a Firefly 2, was using it for wax more then herb though, but prior to that I had a Gpen Elite and before that a Gpro I usually do about 390 degrees maybe if i do a lower temp? I do plan on taking at least a month break and i did stop for a week last week and then smoked again this Wednesday. after about 2-3 days with no weed my appetite came back and I WAS SO HUNGRY i could never have enough food it felt like but after I smoked a couple days ago i did have some abdominal pain again, have not really eaten in the past 2 days because eating makes my stomach feel more crampy then before even if i feel hungry as soon as i eat it hurts worse then it already is. I am hoping maybe lower temps will help me in the future have you noticed that lower temps vape give less abdominal pain. this Friday i ended up smoking half a blunt and a Pinner before class. I have been to doctor since the summer they have no idea the Gaestro doctor gave me IBS meds but I did not want to take them because i really don't want to take that for the rest of my life. So thats why im going to quit weed and see if it helps but the first week break def helped. If i do end up having CHS if i take Months break will i be able to vape again at lower temps? I really would hate to put weed to the side this is KILLING ME! I also have lost a lot of weight since i never feel hungry when i was smoking/vaping daily. i was 130 around June and now i'm 116!!! Sorry for the long paragraph BTW and thanks for such a quick Reply!!!

Sadly, I'm not a doctor so I can't really give you a definitive diagnosis. I was on a bender with some not so quality wax during that time which probably wasn't purged correctly. That's probably what made me sick, along with my Crohn's disease. If you have no underlying medical reason to use marijuana, then you should give yourself a few days break as suggested above. Once you find yourself feeling better, start to slowly reintroduce and see if you feel worse.

And listen, if marijuana is making you sick, then you shouldn't feel bad about stopping. Another suggestion is maybe you need a different form, edibles, oil, etc.

And just to clarify, my abdominal pain gets incredibly better after I vape. When I eat, I'm in pain then I vape again.

I did take a week break and felt better but I'm going to do a complete detox and do as you suggested with low temp vaping. and I would not feel bad about stopping would just SUCK!! I have not had any of these problems until the summer when it started, I ended up smoking and I got REALLY pale felt like i was going to throw up and EXTREME abdominal pain and was very sweaty this has only happened once more the beginning of this month I also replied to the other message above which gives some more details. Thanks for the quick reply!

I also started smoking last summer

 

[newVaper420]

No problem. Maybe the wax is too strong. Use flowers. I think that's what happened with me and the wax

 

[Pyrocity420]

No problem. Maybe the wax is too strong. Use flowers. I think that's what happened with me and the wax

I was thinking that as well but it is not like the pain started right after i started vaping wax it started during the summer when i was just smoking and vaping the flower im thinking the wax def made it worse. its just a real bummer The one thing i enjoyed I might not be able to do anymore which sucks!

 

[Garysfriend]

So a bit of an update here. (to save anyone the trouble of going back a page or two) I last posted in April of this year. Quick summary, starting in Nov/Dec of 2015 I thought I was starting to get symptoms of CHS. Never vomited, but for every night I smoked, I'd have intense nausea and some upper stomach pain the next morning and typically most of the next day until the later afternoon/evening hours. Well, I abstained for 2 months, tried to clean up my diet as much as possible, took some supplements like fish oil, vit B, magnesium, and had a vacation in Jamaica (end of march/april 2016) and started up again there. Had no issues in Jamaica and when I returned to the states, I slowly ramped up again to daily usage. Only in the evening, only flower, only vaporizing, and almost always less than .1g. I didn't have any issues at all... until this week. I was starting to see the same symptoms again.. waking up in the middle of the night with pain, fullness in the gut, nausea, bloating, etc.

I'm pissed. While I don't rely on it for any diagnosed medicinal purposes, it gives me something to look forward to every evening, after I get my shit done, and I think overall it makes me a more level, happier, person. (Wife agrees). I don't feel like I'm abusing it, given the amount I use (these days less than .05g a day). So of course I'm jumping back into researching everything I can because I refuse to believe that some people just develop an allergy, or intolerance, or genetically can't handle cannabis, etc. I for one proved this wrong last April, as I went from feeling sick as shit any time I vaped, to being able to get back into it, just by taking a break and taking care of myself.

So today I stumbled upon a study stating that cannabis lowers stomach acid. So the wife and I went out for sushi tonight for dinner, and when we got back, I proceeded to start experimenting with hydro chloride acid pills. (I had read that if you don't have a stomach acid problem, 1 of these will bring about acid reflux type symptoms... burning, etc). Well, I took about 1250mg of HCL (5 pills) tonight... and feel fine. My wife took one and had to take a tums. (She doesn't use cannabis).

Could this be it? (at least for some of us)? I don't want to vape tonight, as I was nauseous all day today until about 5pm, but I plan to tomorrow night. I'm wondering if I vape, and then take a lot HCL, will I still have the same issues?

Summary: Last november, nausea every day after I'd vape. Took 2 months off, went to Jamaica for a week (combusting) returned to the states for ~6months of vaping flower only and problems are returning. Tried a stomach acid test tonight by taking 1250mg of hydro chloride acid and felt no bad effects, meaning my stomach is low in acid.

 

[nickdanger]

@Garysfriend, I just happened to stumble on this thread and noticed your reference to HCL capsules. I used these for awhile when I had digestive issues involving my gall bladder (not cannabis related). I'm not sure how old you are, but age supposedly causes stomach acid to be lower in many people, myself included. I started taking the capsules with meals and my problems resolved. I occasionally have to take one when I eat a large meal, such as when we go out to eat. It was a miracle for me.

Since I"m prone to lower stomach acid, I will definitely keep the possible cannabis connection in mind if I start to see symptoms again and up my HCL intake. IT will be interesting to see if this resolves your problems.

 

[Garysfriend]

@nickdanger thanks for the response. @steama, that's good to hear, and it seems, (again for some of us, not everyone suffering from CHS) that diet and lifestyle have a lot to do with this. I'm working on cleaning up my diet (which I did the first time around) and am already seeing some improvements. I did eat chili on Saturday but went slow and had more HCL as I ate. Also had quite a lot of beer... buddy's bday party.

No weird pains that night and only some minor pressure and discomfort the next morning that went away quickly.

I realize that I never got really sick like some of you, and I'm aware that this may not even be CHS, but really bad GERD or some stomach issue that is only exasperated by cannabis. I'll continue to try/experiment with clean eating (as much as possible) and HCL.

 

[chris 71]

did any of you guys who have experienced this remember if there were some signs leading up to the first time you got sick ? did you notice a change in the effects of your usage before hand ? i mean like maybe feeling sick after using for a while before you had the full blown puking ?

 

[chris 71]

thanks steama , i only ask because lately every time i vape or smoke i feel a little sick . and after reading some of this thread i was starting to wonder if i could possibly be starting to get it .
but i am ill from Graves disease and im taking meds for that , and of coarse side effects from the meds are being sick with nausea and possibly vomiting , and a whole host of other fun stuff as well plus . the disease itself causes one to not be well either .

i cant say that a hot showers is either appealing or something that i do at all but its just that i seem to be having a reaction as of late everytime i vape or smoke . so i thought about this thread . but i think in my case there are just to many other things going on to think it could be this ... i havent actully even vomited in years like i cant even remeber the last time , it could be decades lol. i just wondered if this was something that maybe started with noticing a sick feeling after use for a while before the full blown vomiting

 

[Garysfriend]

Holy shit you will know it if you have CHS.

Well that's part of the problem... I don't know. With all the bullshit floating around the internet, very little research, very little definitive data, etc... I don't know what's wrong with me. A quote I read on reddit once comes to mind and goes something like this, "This is just another thing for an already paranoid stoner to worry about." And that's true.

While I'm not a doctor, I'm certain I don't have ulcers (the HCL pills would definitely aggravate that, and I feel better with HCL). And when I have told my doc about stomach issues (leaving out the cannabis) the next step was a scope. I don't want to spend the money on that or put myself through that when I know laying off the herb a few days will cure me.

So there's a very small percentage of people who get violently ill. steama is one of them. Then there are others like Chris 71 (whether or not its his other meds or the cannabis), who seems to be affected in a very similar manner to me. I haven't vomited, yet it seems that no matter what, the day after I vape, I'm rather nauseous for most of the following day. I don't feel the need to shower, and showers don't really seem to help. They feel good, but that's about it.

So I'm going to take a break, which sucks because I just picked up an underdog (which I love by the way). If this is similar to what I went through last March/April, a few weeks should clear things up. The frustrating thing is the cause. Is it cannabis directly causing this? Or Cannabis exasperating another condition (low stomach acid, gastritis, too much bad stomach bacteria).

steama I'm sorry you get so violently ill, and it comes on with no warning. I guess I'm lucky that I do get some warning... although I've never pushed it to see what will happen if I continue to vape with these symptoms. Maybe nausea is the worst of it? and for whatever I have... it won't lead to vomiting? I have a regular full time job, along with other family duties and such where I don't want to risk seeing what could happen. With the limited knowledge I'd rather play it safe.

God I wish our stupid govt would pull their heads out of their asses and allow research.